iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

Small scale sawmill business

Started by dirthawger, November 12, 2017, 04:43:43 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

terrifictimbersllc

Quote from: dirthawger on November 14, 2017, 10:26:35 AM
Quote from: Stuart Caruk on November 14, 2017, 01:15:51 AM
The cost of the machine is of course tax deductable. You won't ever regret buying a hydraulic mill, although you will regret getting just a manual one, unless you plan to start that way and trade up. Get the biggest baddest you can comfortably afford.

This is the plan i intended to follow. Im not quitting my day job or selling my grinder. My plan was to get the lt15 that is portable and if i become swamped with work a bigger one is a phone call away. Im much more comfortable with a 170 a month note vs 450. My way of thinking is that itd give me the opportunity to really get a feel for the market without a lot of risk. That was my plan at least.
I think you would get a feel for the market and you would be able to make the $170 payment. Also the equipment should have good resale value.   You already know something about being in business. 

What I'm feeling and hearing in the replies above is that once you have the mill after a few jobs, i.e. pretty quickly,  you will probably be seeing that your market would be bigger, your future income potential higher, and the amount of time and energy you would be expending on jobs much lower, if you had a mill more suitable to and more capable for  portable sawing.   I don't know what you are looking at for a mobile LT15 but if it is about $12K then it is already about half or more of what a good used LT40 could be had for.

Another way of saying part of this is that being able to make $170 a month is a given.  So is getting the feel of sawing.  If whether you like the feel of sawing is in question maybe find out how to get that some other way maybe spend a few days helping out a sawyer somewhere. 
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

BigBurOak

What kinda wood would you be sawin? There seems to be a halfway decent amount of trees down on the Red River but I'm a long way from there.
Who needs a gym if you got a woodpile?

Mcgeezer

Hi Everyone,

I'm new to the forum, and have been reading some great articles here.  Nice to chat with you all...
I'm looking at switching careers into more agriculture/farming.  A small sawmill business would be a big part of this (along with honey, firewood, Christmas trees and more).  I have only around 60hrs of actual operating experience, but have realized now at 35 years old that being in the bush, and having a career that makes one happy is the most important thing in life!
I was hoping to lay out some of my business ideas here int he hopes that you folks would provide some feedback for me with your shared experiences/knowledge.
-We have timber rights on a Christmas tree permit in eastern British Columbia.  Our bush is 70% Douglas fir, 20% western larch, and 10% ponderosa pine.  Many trees are 40"+ in diameter.
-I would like to start small, using cash to startup as opposed to thinking too big and being buried in debt.  The market I'm targeting is renovations through my contacts in the building trades.  Slabs for sinks, counters, mantles, tables, benches, and board cutting of the larch for furniture, cabinets etc. and more would be my primary focus, in addition to accent timbers for interior work.  I'm looking at 10-12' maximum logs to begin.
-My idea is to have a friend build a logging arch which would attach to the hitch of my jeep for hauling logs to the mill.  I do have some issues with placing logs/taking timbers off the mill, as I will be mostly working alone, and don't have the capital to purchase a tractor or bobcat yet.
-The mill I'm leaning toward is the Woodland Mills model 130.  Does anyone have any feedback of this mill, or suggest something else conducive with my plan?
-I'm really excited about this idea.  I feel i can make some supplemental income (along with other agriculture and substitute teaching on the side if needed) and just let the business evolve and see what happens.

I would greatly appreciate your comments/feedback on this as many of you seem to have a tremendous wealth of experience milling wood.

Kind regards



starmac

Every body has made some valid points.
I do wish the op the best in his goal, any choice he makes.
If his aim is mobile sawing, I would encourage him to find some sawyers that would let him help and get somewhat of a feel for what is getting into, and maybe get some of the learning process out of the way before making a financial decision. I know sometimes that is hard to do.

I bought my mill during the winter and didn't even see it till after spring breakup. I had never sawed the first board, but what I did do in the mean time was found this forum and read it from the beginning. I am also lucky that we have only one main species to saw, White spruce.
From what I had read, spruce was terrible to cut, but it turns out our white spruce is very forgiving and probably about as easy to make nice straight lumber out of as there is.
We do have some sawable (is that a word) birch and aspen that I do want to try, and would probably have to if I was a mobile sawyer for hire. So would need some more experience with that.

Reading back through the sawing and milling threads all the way. It is obvious quality boards can be made by any type of mill, from chainsaw mill on up to the latest and greatest.
Also from my reading, I have never, that I recall, ever seen a thread where a member wished he had started with a manual mill.
I am in no way trying to dissuade the op, and wish him the very best, but from a purely financial standpoint, realistically how many hours sawing a month would be the difference in making the payment on a basic hydraulic mill and the mentioned LT15 manual, I bet it is no more than 3 or 4 hours. At any rate the payment should be doable in one day a month sawing, if we are only talking covering the mill payment.
Old LT40HD, old log truck, old MM forklift, and several huskies.

TKehl

McGeezer

First, welcome.  There is a ton of knowledge here that can help on your journey.  A few of us, including myself, also farm in addition to the sawmill/forestry addiction.

Second, keep your day job and do this on nights, weekends, and vacation.  A steady income gives the ability to take some risks as well as a cushion if those risks don't pan out.

Third, take a bite and chew it until it's done.  Going from Felling trees to installations can be done, but there are several steps each with its own learning curve.  You will definitely need a kiln in addition to the mentioned starter equipment.  Get good at an enterprise before starting another.  Would have saved me a lot of time, $, and pain if I would have followed my own advice.  Nothing like watching goats eat $700 worth of pig feed in 2 days or spending hours fixing pig fence in 100°F heat after 12 hours at my day job just to have them tear up a new spot a day or two later (for weeks) and then come out below break even...

Fourth, the WM is a good mill from what I've seen, but I don't think it will do what you want it to for sinks and counters.  Just doesn't have the cut width and won't handle large logs.  It would be worth your time to look into a swing mill with a slabber or a chainsaw mill for the large stuff.  Easily portable and can set up around the log so you move boards and slabs instead of heavy logs.  If the large stuff is only a small %, a WM + a chainsaw mill could be a good combo.

Fifth, how far to your site from where you plan to process.  Moving logs with a Jeep is going to be very hobby level unless it's a very short drive.  Can still work if you chase higher margin stuff.  Otherwise, cut and hire a log truck to move them.

Finally, do you have any experience with any of this?  It's a lot of hard work even with good equipment.  Would be good to try it before you buy it.   ;)
In the long run, you make your own luck – good, bad, or indifferent. Loretta Lynn

Ianab

McGeezer - Big logs and limited support equipment? Look at a Swingblade mill / Slabber combo for your situation. Peterson or TurboSaw for example. The idea is that you don't move the logs, you move the mill, and basically saw them up where they fall. A winch and farm jack are handy for maneuvering logs into the best position for milling, but otherwise you just need a sturdy utility trailer to move the mill and your sawn boards.

The Woodland is a decent mill, but you aren't going to enjoy wrangling 40" logs with one, or any small band mill for that matter, and those big butt logs are where the best wood is going to be.

My support equipment is basically a Corolla and a trailer, but I can handle logs like this weeks mission.

That's the stump it came off behind the mill. I did have a tractor and chain to spin the log around to a better position to mill, but it couldn't pick up that size log to transport any distance. A decent winch on a Jeep would manage that sort of thing.

And get the boards home.

Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

starmac

Mcgeezer, you will probably get more and better responces, if you start your own thread.

Curiosity though, Can you even get a jeep and logging arch to most of your available trees? There are ways to get her done with minimal equipment, but sometimes the labor negates it.
Old LT40HD, old log truck, old MM forklift, and several huskies.

Mcgeezer

Thanks Starmac, Ianab, and Tkhel for your input

I'm actually going to cut and paste this into a new thread for more response, but I appreciate your input folks!  To answer your question Tkhel, yes there is a great road network, and clearings close to the old-growth logs from 60 years of timber harvesting and christmas treeing on the property.  No problem getting my jeep to the logs. 

Thank You Sponsors!