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Most abused

Started by bandmiller2, October 16, 2017, 07:11:40 AM

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bandmiller2

Surely the backstops must be the most abused part of the band mill. Every time your log loader rolls a large log on the mill it hits the stops. Your turner crowds the log/cant agents them to turn. I bet most folks never check them for square. We can't stop loading or turning logs but we can check and adjust the backstops. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

drobertson

you bet they are,, and they are tough too,, I've tried a few times too chew them, tougher than a piece of grissel,  ;D
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Magicman

After I bought my sawmill (used) the side supports were actually bent and curved from taking a beating from being banged by logs.  I suppose that logs were being dropped on the bed by commercial loaders.  I had to take a rosebud and straighten them back out.  Now it is a simple matter to occasionally check them for square.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Coltbodi

I just stopped using mine for squaring logs. I had them set right and after a few logs they where off a tad. I'm very particular about things being as close to perfect as possible, so now I use a torpedo level to get the log plumb. I make my first couple passes across the top of the log until I have it down to the size I will want it for the cant, then I roll it 90 degrees towards the log stops. I then put my torpedo level on the newly cut side and roll it with my log turner until it is plumb. I have a pretty good eye for it, so it usually only takes me 2 or 3 tries to get it right, which takes less than 60 seconds. And I only have to do that once per log, since the next roll will have that flat side on the bunks and it is smooth sailing from there. Now this only works if you have your mill set up perfectly level, but I would imagine most people take there time setting up and get it right.

So far that process has been working great for me, takes an extra minute of time, but I think it is well worth it.
If I can't fix it, I don't want it.
Timberking 1600 with lots of mods, a 65hp mahindra with a front end loader, a welding shop, and sugarcane mill from 1890 for making syrup

Magicman

That's fine, but when I am sawing for production there is no way I will stop and spend that time when all that it takes is having the side supports at 90°.  Another thing that will sometime happen is that the ground will be soft and the outriggers will slowly sink putting the sawmill out of level.  I had to re-adjust mine a couple of times this past Friday.

My normal setup is for the front (hitch) end and the loader side to be slightly higher.  This makes the logs "favor" the side supports and also puts me going slightly downhill when sawing.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Kbeitz

Quote from: bandmiller2 on October 16, 2017, 07:11:40 AM
Surely the backstops must be the most abused part of the band mill. Every time your log loader rolls a large log on the mill it hits the stops. Your turner crowds the log/cant agents them to turn. I bet most folks never check them for square. We can't stop loading or turning logs but we can check and adjust the backstops. Frank C.

My most abused part is my blades... It's the only part that I have to keep replacing...
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

Coltbodi

Once I do a complete re-fab of the log stops that should be possible. But the factory supports on this Timberking just wont stay at 90 degrees. I have adjusted them a few times and welded the plates solid so that the bolts aren't the only thing holding them in the position they need to be and they still get out of wack. And I'm pretty gently when loading the mill, I set the logs on it with my tractor and then push it to the stops with the log turner. Its the turning that really puts a whopping on them. But like I said, I only have to use the level on the one side and It only takes a minute. If I use the stops its pretty close to 90, most people wouldn't be able to tell its not. Usually only out 1/8"- 3/16"  over 20". think_not It would just drive me crazy not having it perfect.
If I can't fix it, I don't want it.
Timberking 1600 with lots of mods, a 65hp mahindra with a front end loader, a welding shop, and sugarcane mill from 1890 for making syrup

crowhill

I have an old B-20 TimberKing, about 17 years old. I have had some pretty tough log bumps on the stops and haven't had to readjust them more than three or four times since I got the Mill in 2002. I check them quite often but they just don't move out of alignment.
TimberKing B-20, Kubota M-4900 w/FEL with tooth bar, hyd thumb and forks, Farmi winch, 4 chain saws.

Coltbodi

If I'm not mistaken the B-20s log stops move vertically. I have a tk 1600c mine move in a circular motion, which is the problem. They will move vertically when I'm done with them though.
If I can't fix it, I don't want it.
Timberking 1600 with lots of mods, a 65hp mahindra with a front end loader, a welding shop, and sugarcane mill from 1890 for making syrup

Chuck White

I have to stop a customer/off-bearer once in a while, because once the log comes off of the loader, they will give it a shove into the log stops!

I explain to them that the log stops are adjustable and therefore can get out of adjustment by slamming a log into them!

Usually only have to explain to them once!   ;)
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

ladylake

 
The log stop on my B20 TK have taken a lot of abuse and I've adjusted them twice in 13000 hours. The ones on the TK 2000 are way heavier.  No fan of the swing up stops over here.   Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

4x4American

I remember the days when I had to adjust my side supports for square all the time.  Not been a problem with team orange theirs are engineered very well I rarely have to adjust them.
Boy, back in my day..

JB Griffin

I hate, loathe and despise swing up backstops. Not only do they have to be square at full height but also have to stay square in their full arc.
Vertical is the only way to go.
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota with 6gpm hyd unit, 150 Prentice, WM bms250, Suffolk dual tooth setter

Over 3.5million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator.

ladylake

 The reason I'm no fan of swing up stop is I've had mills cut for me with swing up stops and quite often a 4 x 4 would be a quarter inch out of square plus a mill operator I know traded off his swing up mill to get a vertical stop mill for the same reason.  Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Coltbodi

Yea, swing ups are horrible. If anyone with vertical stops could take some pictures of them and how they are fabbed i'd really appreciate it. I'm going to be building some real soon.
If I can't fix it, I don't want it.
Timberking 1600 with lots of mods, a 65hp mahindra with a front end loader, a welding shop, and sugarcane mill from 1890 for making syrup

Kbeitz

Guess I'm the only one happy with swing up's...



 



 
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

4x4American

Quote from: ladylake on October 17, 2017, 07:07:35 PM
The reason I'm no fan of swing up stop is I've had mills cut for me with swing up stops and quite often a 4 x 4 would be a quarter inch out of square plus a mill operator I know traded off his swing up mill to get a vertical stop mill for the same reason.  Steve


Could also be they didn't have their head adjusted proper.  Finding square with swing up stops is difficult but doable, has a lot to do with the operator. 
Boy, back in my day..

Coltbodi

Getting swing up stops square is easy, getting them to stay square is the tricky part.
If I can't fix it, I don't want it.
Timberking 1600 with lots of mods, a 65hp mahindra with a front end loader, a welding shop, and sugarcane mill from 1890 for making syrup

4x4American

Quote from: Coltbodi on October 17, 2017, 10:21:43 PM
Getting swing up stops square is easy, getting them to stay square is the tricky part.


I know on the lt40 if helps if you kinda preload them before you tighten the lock nut.  I had a spell on mine where it was hard to get them to stay square, then I finally figured it out and they stayed square for a long dang time
Boy, back in my day..

drobertson

Not even sure why you are having issues,,with the apparently low hours and experience you seem to have. Not at all trying to be critical, but understand the mill you have and what it is,,and it's not a high production ram and slam outfit.
Of all the issues you have brought forward, you lean on the side of a very eager, production oriented individual, My suggestion is to just slow down, and learn how to run what you have,, I know this may be marked, even cut off, but a very important note to so many folks that have bought into the fast pace, thin kerf technology.  If it was easy, and simple more folks than we even see now would be still at it,, just check out new mills for sale on the net,,   
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Chuck White

One of the big reasons for "out of square" lumber and "out of square" log stops comes from too much pressure when clamping!
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

OffGrid973

When you clamp a lot after the first cut it will typically jump when you tighten too much because there is still a circle shape touching the square stop.  I agree to slow down but when your stops are bent from the big dogs we all try to smash on there, well you are sol.  Not even sure how the square helps to be honest but I guess a good eye is worth it's weight in gold. 
Your Fellow Woodworker,
- Off Grid

Peter Drouin

A good eye is everything.
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

ladylake

 A good eye is fine for fence post, not for timber framing or wood workers.  Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

PA_Walnut

Let us not forget we are sawing ROUGH CUT lumber. The overages are meant to compensate for slight milling imperfections and drying changes.

Of course, the closer the better, yet better is the enemy of good enough.  8)
I own my own small piece of the world on an 8 acre plot on the side of a mountain with walnut, hickory, ash and spruce.
LT40HD Wide 35HP Diesel
Peterson Dedicated Wide Slabber
Kubota M62 Tractor/Backhoe
WoodMizer KD250 Kiln
Northland 800 Kiln

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