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How long ar your back / log stops?

Started by Crusarius, October 04, 2017, 07:43:36 AM

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Crusarius

I started designing the bed for my mill and came to a crossroads. I am wondering what length are everyone's log stops? I am thinking since my mill is setup for 36" log that the stops should be at least 18".

Whats everyone think? How long are your backstops from the bed?

WV Sawmiller

   The side supports on my mill are about 12" tall when fully raised. My mill is designed to cut up to a 32" diameter log. You can always add extensions if need more height - I never have. I'm thinking the taller they are the more likely to try to saw them off. ;D
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2011 4WD F150 Ford Lariat PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Stihl 440 Chainsaw, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once

Crusarius

yes. sawing... hmmm. Trying to cut steel. That is going to be a tough habit to break :)

Thanks for the response.

William1961

The taller the stops are then the need for more clearance at the bottom to ground level when you drop them. Assuming you are building that style of stop that does not swing down.

Crusarius

My plan was to make them pivot and connect them all together so I can raise and lower all 4 with one device. The divice is still undecided whether I use acme threaded rod a lever or something completely crqazay.

Jeff

I'd steer from threaded rod. Sawing logs is not clean. Dust, dirt, sap, pitch, bark and debris. Imagine all that binding in your threads even in one place let alone multiple location.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Crusarius

was not going to do full length. Just long enough at one end to get full movement and use a bar to connect everything else.

Thanks Jeff that is a good thought I did not think about.

Heh, I think I finally see a use for the 100,000 stupid shock boots I kept throwing away :)

sawmilljoe

No matter what length you make them you will try to cut them off😲 Trust me I have a couple of times. 12 inches seems to be about average.

Percy

The ones on my lt70 are just under 14.5 inches. They go straight up and down.
GOLDEN RULE : The guy with the gold, makes the rules.

Chuck White

On my LT40, with the blade set at 11¼", the blade will clear the top of the stops with about ¼" to spare!
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

kelLOGg

Mine are 12" high and pivot. I would not gang them together so they operate via a single device. Even if you have only 2 backstops sometimes a log lands on the mill where one of the backstops encounters a knot or bulge and being able to lower/raise one backstop is a big help.
If you plan to skim the log then it's a moot point.
Bob
Cook's MP-32, 20HP, 20' (modified w/ power feed, up/down, loader/turner)
DH kiln, CatClaw setter and sharpener, tandem trailer, log arch, tractor, thumb tacks

Crusarius

Thanks for all the responses.

KelLOGg that is something I keep wondering about. I am not sure I want them all to work at the same time but I also don't want to have to walk the full 24' of the mill every time. My mind is still going crazy with ideas on what to do for that.

I really appreciate everyones help and comments. they really help get my creative juices flowing.

btulloh

Usually you're using only two backstops at a given time and they're probably 6-10 ft apart. It's nice to have extras along the length of the track, but they all don't come into play on every log.  Many times they want to be at slightly different heights depending on what's sticking out of your log.  If they're not hydraulic, you're going to have to tend them, so you'll get some exercise.  Sawmilling presents lot's of opportunities for cardio-vascular and strength training.   
HM126

Magicman

On my sawmill, the additional (inside) side supports are geared more toward handling short logs, and that is the only time that I ever have to raise mine.  For normal sawing two are sufficient for me; one on each end of the log.  Of course much depends upon the length of the majority of the logs that you will saw.  With 24', I could visualize a manual side support toward the end beyond the powered support.  I would not space the powered side supports further apart than 7' for handling 8' logs.  The log clamp would be centered between the side supports.

The great majority of the logs that I saw are from 8" to 16". 

I would make the side supports no taller than 12" and have square tubing or pipe to slip over them for turning the odd shaped etc. log.

Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

pineywoods

About 1/4 inch shorter than original  >:(
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

Crusarius

Thanks MM thats very helpful.

Maybe what I need to do is just make the stops and have them setup on a pivot but not link them together until after I get some sawing under my belt and I see what works. I am sure this is going to have a huge learning curve. But, I am also sure I am relly going to enjoy it.

Hmmmm could have all of them on separate levers. Thats a lot more material though.

Uh oh there goes my crazy thoughts again....

So pineywoods your saying I should make them a 1/4" longer than I need? :)

Percy

GOLDEN RULE : The guy with the gold, makes the rules.

YellowHammer

I've got all four of mine hooked up to the same hydraulic lever, so 4 up 4 down. 
The first one is about an 1/8" higher than all the others so that if the band clears it, then it will clear them all.

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Crusarius

oooh. I like the 1/8" idea. I am guessing you only have saw marks on the first one? You ever find times when you wish they weren't all connected?

Coltbodi

my timber king 1600 has the swing type and they all work together, Id say the are about 14 inches tall, which is plenty tall enough for me and I have put some big logs up. I would defiantly say keep them all together, there is no way in hell id want to adjust each one individually! But If I built this mill, I would not make them swing, Id make them move vertically up and down. The swinging motion is constantly hitting knots when I go to lower them. And I raise and lower mine a lot. I raise them every time I roll the log or cant. They are much sturdier in the completely vertical position, which is why you want them there when you roll stuff around on the mill.
If I can't fix it, I don't want it.
Timberking 1600 with lots of mods, a 65hp mahindra with a front end loader, a welding shop, and sugarcane mill from 1890 for making syrup

Crusarius

Coltbodu, that is something I did not think of. Thanks.

Coltbodi

No problem. I have a fab shop and that's what I like doing. So if you have any fabrication questions during your build send me a message. I will be re-working mine in the near future so that my stops move vertically instead of swinging. The swinging is just to unstable. Rolling logs and cants can be pretty rough and the stops take a lot of abuse, so they need to be really sturdy. In my experience, the less moving parts the sturdier something is.
If I can't fix it, I don't want it.
Timberking 1600 with lots of mods, a 65hp mahindra with a front end loader, a welding shop, and sugarcane mill from 1890 for making syrup

Crusarius

I agree completely about the less moving parts. I am planning on having my pivot points at the bottom of the 2x6 main rail so when they are in the up position they have the full 6" rail to rest against on the outside. When they are all the way up they will rest against the back of the bunks supporting it that direction as well.

That should allow the pivot point to be lighter duty hopefully saving me some weight and cost.

YellowHammer

Quote from: Crusarius on October 05, 2017, 12:00:15 PM
oooh. I like the 1/8" idea. You ever find times when you wish they weren't all connected?

Never.  I wish I had five instead of four.  Mine are standard LT40 pivoting backstops.  I don't mind the pivoting action, because they sometimes help me shift an unruly log back and forth on the mill to get it settled better on the toe boards.  It doesn't work all the time, but if I push the log or cant mostly on top of the backstops with the two plane, basically balancing it, where the backstops are supporting a good deal of the weight, and then back the two plane kind of out a little and unloaded, sometimes, not always, I can raise or lower the backstops and as they pivot, they will physically lift and translate whatever is on top of them forward and backward a few inches, just enough for me to get it situated.  Its a pretty hard and stressful move on the backstops, but I watched a Woodmizer Competition Sawyer do it many years ago and I still use the trick.

Putting top rollers on the backstops is a big help when rolling logs.  Also, installing stainless covers or shields to protect fresh wood, especially oak, from contacting bare carbon steel backstops and blue staining is very useful.
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Magicman

When building be sure to have some means of adjustment so that you can keep them 90° with the sawmill bed.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

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