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taking the weight out of walnut

Started by tule peak timber, September 14, 2017, 08:13:30 PM

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YellowHammer

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

tule peak timber

Quote from: nativewolf on October 30, 2017, 12:50:20 PM
Rob,

Love the project but am curious as to the two statements: 

going to sand almost all the epoxy off....and you are removing all the micro bubbles,etc. 

You don't sand it off then remove anything that is a flaw?  Just seems odd process wise but I'm a forester at best and a poor woodworker. 

Wish I could send you some of our walnut off crooks, corners, elbows and such.  Maybe I'll make up a tractor trailer load and send it out to you.
This beautiful crystal clear, almost perfect coat of epoxy is actually the primer for the final coat. We build it up fairly thick and should have caught the bubbles in the first 2 coats. There's actually a fair amount of technique to getting end grain wood sealed up and bubble free. We will sand aggressively and pull away probably 90% of the finish thickness and then final coat with another material.
On your walnut crooks and off cuts, I bet they would make fun artistic material to work with!
Rob
persistence personified - never let up , never let down

Magicman

I had to do some catching up with your project.  While I was paying and playing, looks like you were doing quiet the opposite. 

Great innovation and Beautiful work. 
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

WLC

Woodmizer LT28
Branson 4wd tractor
Stihl chainsaws
Elbow grease.

tule peak timber

After building a jig to get the bends accurate I welded 3/8's nuts every 18 inches to the inside of the steel band. The nuts are seated into blind pockets drilled into the solid sides. Tony , my shop foreman hand lapped the the butt joints with a file to get the joint perfect. After dry fit we pressed it all together with epoxy putty.The pic below is from another project (same customer) showing welded screws on the inside of the band. I switched to welded nuts on this build and assembly was a lot easier. Rob

 
persistence personified - never let up , never let down

Magicman

Hey, I also like that makeshift backpack for the LP bottle.   ;D
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

tule peak timber

I used to own an organic farm and the propane setup is one of the legal weed abatement options allowed. :)
persistence personified - never let up , never let down

WLC

Thanks for the explanation!  I really like your projects and admire your skills. 
Woodmizer LT28
Branson 4wd tractor
Stihl chainsaws
Elbow grease.

tule peak timber

The last major sanding before coating.Visibly no flaws....

 
persistence personified - never let up , never let down

Magicman

Oh My, what a monster!  I never realized how large it is.   :o
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

tule peak timber

 Final top coating, number two of three. Getting closer.... :)

 
persistence personified - never let up , never let down

tule peak timber

After three top coats and a day of fine buffing , we are ready to ship.Very hard to get a decent photo due to glare so below are some pics of the next two bartops in line and some natural edge trim going to another job.The bartops are White oak and the trim is Ponderosa pine. We use the lifts to hold while spraying, move to a drying area, then scoop up another set for finishing. Cheers  Rob

  

 
persistence personified - never let up , never let down

Timbercreekfarm


Brad_bb

Does the walnut lose it 's chocolate color over time and get lighter?  I've seen that before especially in a house where the wood was exposed to sunlight.  Will any of the top coats stop it?   Does the epoxy yellow over time?
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

tule peak timber

Brad, I don't have enough years experience to comment on the walnut losing color.Yes , generally epoxy will yellow in sunlight over time, depending. Yes there are top coats that will lessen or prevent sun caused deterioration.On this top we used AwlCraft 2000 to protect it as well as provide the best finish possible.  Rob
persistence personified - never let up , never let down

Magicman

It does not matter the wood species, type of finish, nor whether it is ever exposed to direct sunlight.


 
Here is a table top in our "sunroom" that never sees direct sunlight, only some ambient.  The center always has a centerpiece and the ring is obvious where the uncovered wood/finish has lightened during the past ~10 years.  The picture makes the center portion much redder than it actually is.  Now the question is whether the uncovered portion lightened or the covered portion darkened?? 
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Larry

Brad, I can tell you without doubt that walnut gets lighter with exposure to UV.  Under the same conditions cherry gets darker and a much richer color.  A lot of tropical woods go brown as does osage orange.  Dad was a woodworker and made walnut clocks...some were exposed to sunlight and others were in dark rooms.  That is my source of experience.

The last few years I've been using a lot of SW cab acrylic lacquer.  A couple of reasons.  It goes on crystal clear and does not yellow over time.  It also has UV absorber in it.  I've used it on osage orange, purple heart, bloodwood, and some other samples to test.  One sample is exposed to light while the other is in a envelope.  Only been a couple of years but it seems to slow the color change.  I think with enough time/UV the change is inevitable no matter what is used.

 
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Kbeitz

In my experience walnut logs gets much darker laying on the ground for years.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

tule peak timber

well,,,, a parting pic from today, and I hope the final picture....The customer kicked this table back  to us two  weeks before Christmas and we have been wet sanding/polishing/ buffing since that day. The customer detected small imperfections in the finish and asked me to correct all to a  perfect finish.This has not been an easy or inexpensive thing to accomplish. Supposedly this UV resistant coating I am using here will withstand the test of time given the level of work in this piece. I have spent a GREAT deal of time and money trying to find the best coatings possible in the last year or two. Not an easy or inexpensive venture - we shall see .

 
persistence personified - never let up , never let down

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Kick it back to me....I'll take it. Beautiful work!
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

YellowHammer

When you say imperfections, are they tiny air bubbles or waves or ?  Seems like getting "perfection" in a wood finish would be an impossible task, especially after as much fastidious work as you guys have invested in it.
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

PA_Walnut

Wow...*DanG customers!  :-\

Getting a "perfect" finish on a large table/slab is a dance of technique, patience and air quality control.

Outgassing of the wood also causes constant pin holes until you have it sealed. I've discovered that multiple, if not many, seal coats are necessary on a slab PRIOR to putting on a finish coat. ALL pinholes must be sealed first.

Having end-grain up on a semi ring-porous species would seem like a REAL difficult task in controlling the outgassing during finish. Have you tried spraying a fast-drying seal coat like shellac (both sides) prior to beginning your finish?

I'm not at expert on this, by any means...just spitballing with some things I've experienced.  8)
I own my own small piece of the world on an 8 acre plot on the side of a mountain with walnut, hickory, ash and spruce.
LT40HD Wide 35HP Diesel
Peterson Dedicated Wide Slabber
Kubota M62 Tractor/Backhoe
WoodMizer KD250 Kiln
Northland 800 Kiln

PA_Walnut

Oh, by the way...what a labor of love! Cool table.
Are you able to share hours invested and/or what a table like that fetches on the retail market?
I'm supposing if you actually got paid for the hours invested in would be an astounding cost!  :o
Nice work!
I own my own small piece of the world on an 8 acre plot on the side of a mountain with walnut, hickory, ash and spruce.
LT40HD Wide 35HP Diesel
Peterson Dedicated Wide Slabber
Kubota M62 Tractor/Backhoe
WoodMizer KD250 Kiln
Northland 800 Kiln

Kbeitz

The way I gey my best finishes is sanding sealer or cheap varnish.
I use the cheap stuff for the first 3-4 coats Then the good stuff for
the last coats. There is a big difference in price between the good
stuff and the cheap stuff.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

Crusarius

I had a customer one time that wanted a super high gloss white conference table 12' long 6' wide. It was made out of corian. We spent more money on the stupid table than we made on the entire job. I hate high gloss finishes for that reason.

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