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I'm a sucker

Started by Crossroads, August 19, 2017, 07:53:09 PM

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Crossroads

I have a hard time telling customers no. I had a job the other day to mill up some Cotton wood, the customer had told me the biggest log was 32" and I knew we might have to rip that one to deal with it. The rest of the logs were supposed to be smaller. The biggest one was 37", I didn't measure the rest, but I guessed the smallest to be about 28". I figured after driving an hour and a half, I might as well try to make some some sawdust. First we ripped the big one in half because it was the first in the pile and we were unable to move it with the tractor. Then we tried to winch it up onto the mill, about half way up the gears on my winch let go. Next we quartered that half and pulled it onto the mill with the tractor and made some boards. In the process of trying to move the other half around, the handle on my pevey got broke. We quartered the rest of the log and finished milling it up. Then the guy wanted to start on the next one in the pile. At that point I had had enough and told him that the logs are to big for my mill and I'm not willing to destroy any more of my equipment or worse, getting hurt. We parted ways on a good note, but I definitely learned a good lesson. Now I understand why some of you with more experience refuse to cut big logs.
With the right fulcrum and enough leverage, you can move the world!

2017 LT40 wide, BMS250 and BMT250,036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins, l8000 Ford dump truck, hr16 Terex excavator, Valley je 2x24 edger, Gehl ctl65 skid steer, JD350c dozer

Chuck White

Wow, that was really a rough day!

Glad to hear you parted on good terms, the customer obviously understood where you were coming from!
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

Magicman

Get the customer to text or email pictures of the logs.  It helps with decision making.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Peter Drouin

After a while you will learn how to cut them and charge $100.00 an hour.
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

Magicman

In 15 years of portable sawing, I have only had one job that I did not saw and it was this year.  The log pictures were accurate and looked good, but I had no way of knowing that the ground was saturated by the rains.  Just too wet and still is.   :-\
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Sixacresand

I certainly understand what you went through.  Add summer heat
"Sometimes you can make more hay with less equipment if you just use your head."  Tom, Forestry Forum.  Tenth year with a LT40 Woodmizer,

Crossroads

Yes, it was a rough day for sure and it being in the 90's probably didn't help. I did see pictures, but they were taken prior to the logs being sorted and rolled down the and up against a tree. Somehow I don't remember seeing any logs that looked to big in the picture, but I may have just missed it lol. I can only cut up to about a 28" log and things need to go in my favor at that. Also, I can only cut out to 16'. Between the size and length limitations of my 1985 lt 30, I miss out on quite a bit of work. So, I price out a new lt40 today 😳, not sure I'm ready to drop 33k
With the right fulcrum and enough leverage, you can move the world!

2017 LT40 wide, BMS250 and BMT250,036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins, l8000 Ford dump truck, hr16 Terex excavator, Valley je 2x24 edger, Gehl ctl65 skid steer, JD350c dozer

Magicman

When you are discussing the sawing with the customer, always go through a checklist (even if mental) and be sure that both you and the customer are in agreement regarding your maximum log lengths and diameters.  Also, be sure that the customer understands what the "diameter" is.  It is surprising how many don't.   :-\
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Peter Drouin

Maybe logs were added after the pix was taken,  :D :D :D
I have run into that before.
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

Crossroads

Quote from: Magicman on August 19, 2017, 10:04:59 PM
When you are discussing the sawing with the customer, always go through a checklist (even if mental) and be sure that both you and the customer are in agreement regarding your maximum log lengths and diameters.  Also, be sure that the customer understands what the "diameter" is.  It is surprising how many don't.   :-\
Good point, I actually didn't get to actually talk to the guy other than through email. I didn't have his phone number until the day before and left a voicemail. In the email exchanges I suggested he call, then I started only
Responding with my phone number and name, but he still wouldn't call. I guess in the future I'll say I'm not going to show up until we've had a conversation on the phone. I think a lot could have been avoided with a phone call.
With the right fulcrum and enough leverage, you can move the world!

2017 LT40 wide, BMS250 and BMT250,036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins, l8000 Ford dump truck, hr16 Terex excavator, Valley je 2x24 edger, Gehl ctl65 skid steer, JD350c dozer

Crossroads

Quote from: Peter Drouin on August 19, 2017, 10:17:17 PM
Maybe logs were added after the pix was taken,  :D :D :D
I have run into that before.
I don't think he added any logs, but he definitely sorted out the smaller logs and set the big ones up for me to set up on. I was able to point to the pile of smaller logs and explain how that size log was perfect for my mill. He was looking for clear wood and figured on finding more
Of It in the bigger logs.
With the right fulcrum and enough leverage, you can move the world!

2017 LT40 wide, BMS250 and BMT250,036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins, l8000 Ford dump truck, hr16 Terex excavator, Valley je 2x24 edger, Gehl ctl65 skid steer, JD350c dozer

Ianab

QuoteBetween the size and length limitations of my 1985 lt 30, I miss out on quite a bit of work. So, I price out a new lt40 today 😳, not sure I'm ready to drop 33k

Thought about adding a basic swing blade mill to your operation? Keep the LT 30 for the smaller logs which it's better suited for, and bust out a swing mill for the big stuff. Then 36+" logs make your smile rather than curse.  Cost a lot less than $33k and you would have the best of both worlds.
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

YellowHammer

Everybody goes through it, main thing is you knew when to stop.

I break it down into several sizes (categories) of customer logs and typically blurt it out, short and sweet, before they unload.  Best is "sure, no problem," but I do have to serve up a good many "ain't no way", "this is gonna cost extra", "too short", "too many limbs", and "that's not a log, it's a branch." :D.

When on the phone, I ask does the end fit in a 5 gallon bucket (12 inch diameter) or in a plastic garbage can (24 inch diameter) or....

I once had a guy swear he was bringing me a 3 foot diameter log one time, and when he drove up it was the size of my wrist and 3 feet long. 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Crossroads

Quote from: Ianab on August 20, 2017, 12:18:26 AM
QuoteBetween the size and length limitations of my 1985 lt 30, I miss out on quite a bit of work. So, I price out a new lt40 today 😳, not sure I'm ready to drop 33k

Thought about adding a basic swing blade mill to your operation? Keep the LT 30 for the smaller logs which it's better suited for, and bust out a swing mill for the big stuff. Then 36+" logs make your smile rather than curse.  Cost a lot less than $33k and you would have the best of both worlds.
I actually have considered adding a swing blade and haven't completely ruled it out. I im kinda salivating over the acuset 2 though lol.
With the right fulcrum and enough leverage, you can move the world!

2017 LT40 wide, BMS250 and BMT250,036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins, l8000 Ford dump truck, hr16 Terex excavator, Valley je 2x24 edger, Gehl ctl65 skid steer, JD350c dozer

Crossroads

Quote from: YellowHammer on August 20, 2017, 12:24:21 AM
Everybody goes through it, main thing is you knew when to stop.

I break it down into several sizes (categories) of customer logs and typically blurt it out, short and sweet, before they unload.  Best is "sure, no problem," but I do have to serve up a good many "ain't no way", "this is gonna cost extra", "too short", "too many limbs", and "that's not a log, it's a branch." :D.

When on the phone, I ask does the end fit in a 5 gallon bucket (12 inch diameter) or in a plastic garbage can (24 inch diameter) or....

I once had a guy swear he was bringing me a 3 foot diameter log one time, and when he drove up it was the size of my wrist and 3 feet long.
Those are some pretty good size comparisons. I can see someone showing up with a stick thinking they had something lol
With the right fulcrum and enough leverage, you can move the world!

2017 LT40 wide, BMS250 and BMT250,036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins, l8000 Ford dump truck, hr16 Terex excavator, Valley je 2x24 edger, Gehl ctl65 skid steer, JD350c dozer

Peter Drouin

33k is cheaper than a new truck. With a LT40 supper  you can make money if the work is there. A truck will be worth 0 in a few years. A Wood Mizer will be worth all most what you payed for it for ever.

If your going to cut big logs all the time get a swing mill. If not, go with a band mill.
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

PA_Walnut

I'm learning (re-learning) about the whoas of big logs. Just sawed a 36" cherry yesterday. (have an LT40 wide) so I can handle big stuff, but unfortunately my tractor isn't up to the task it sorta/almost could do it, but not quite.

Looking for a BIG skid steer or rough-terrain forks to get it done. Don't wanna break my tractor...yet. She's too purdy! ;)  8)
I own my own small piece of the world on an 8 acre plot on the side of a mountain with walnut, hickory, ash and spruce.
LT40HD Wide 35HP Diesel
Peterson Dedicated Wide Slabber
Kubota M62 Tractor/Backhoe
WoodMizer KD250 Kiln
Northland 800 Kiln

Magicman

I use my end tong "MM Hook" to help load heavy logs.


 
42" White Oak log.  Actually it is the log pictured in my avatar.   :)


 
I use the loader and clamp in tandem.  The hook keeps the log snuggled against the pivot side of the loader and thus transfers some of the weight there and makes the loading possible.  The loader alone would not pick up either of the above pictured logs.

Now after they are loaded, it takes both the turner and log clamp working in tandem to turn those bad boys.

Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Bruno of NH

I mill a lot of big logs 45" to 34" with a manual mill.
I use my tractor with forks or grapple and peavys to turn and have a helper.
I don't mill for others just my own logs and sell my products.
It's how I make money with a manual mill.
Lt 40 wide with 38hp gas and command controls , F350 4x4 dump and lot of contracting tools

sealark37

It goes back to the fact that sawmilling is simply a material handling exercise with a head saw in the middle of it.   Regards, Clark

Crossroads

I've been using a 3500# boat winch off eBay to load logs. I've been surprised at how east they roll up the ramps. I have a 4t waren winch in my shop that I've been contemplating adding to the mill, but I've not talked myself into it yet. I'm not sure I want to worry about charging another battery. I just bought a new to me truck a few weeks ago. It's a dodge 3500 duelly with a 5.9 Cummings and 6 speed manual. At 165,000 that engine has a lot of life left in it. For 14k, it leaves me with enormous enough wiggle room to consider that new lt 40 lol
With the right fulcrum and enough leverage, you can move the world!

2017 LT40 wide, BMS250 and BMT250,036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins, l8000 Ford dump truck, hr16 Terex excavator, Valley je 2x24 edger, Gehl ctl65 skid steer, JD350c dozer

PA_Walnut

Quote from: sealark37 on August 20, 2017, 09:41:21 AM
It goes back to the fact that sawmilling is simply a material handling exercise with a head saw in the middle of it.   Regards, Clark

Biblical-level truth there! I'm learning the hard way.  :-\
I own my own small piece of the world on an 8 acre plot on the side of a mountain with walnut, hickory, ash and spruce.
LT40HD Wide 35HP Diesel
Peterson Dedicated Wide Slabber
Kubota M62 Tractor/Backhoe
WoodMizer KD250 Kiln
Northland 800 Kiln

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