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After the sanity check!

Started by Satamax, August 16, 2017, 04:42:31 PM

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Satamax

Well guys!

I realy wanted a JD440. But here there's a few and far between. All expensive.

This machine was just next door, over the Lautaret pass. Less than 20 miles!







Originally, it's a "debusqueur" a french type of skidder. 4wheel drive, 4 wheel steer, lockers. 4 high, 4 low 4 extra extra low.

The snowblower is shot. But there's plenty of parts for the log stacler blade, winch etc. There is a "unic" V8 of 270hp in the back, with PTO etc. Hydraulics.  and whatnot. Only 250h on the machine, 150 on the back engine. The "chimneys" of the snowblower have 360 hydraulic rotation, which will become my log turner on the sawmill somehow.

V8 will most certainly replace the GM 6-71 in my gen set. There's rams on the snowblower for the blade etc.

So not a bad deal at 2000€ Far sounder than a well broken in 440. It has a 6 inline saviem 5.5 liter of 125 din HP in the front.

So there's some new iron in my fleet.  ;D

French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

Riwaka

Is that cab ROPS certified? or are you going to put a rollcage or T-Bar on?  (T- Bar behind cab http://www.engrep.co.nz/fertiliser.html  )
What type of tires might you use, old tyres and rims off an old forwarder?
http://www.trelleborg.com/en/wheels/your--industry/agriculture--and--forestry/forestry--machines

mike_belben

Now this is a bad idea i can get behind.. Right up my alley!

I like it.  What axles, and does it have any sort of suspension?
Praise The Lord

Satamax

Riwaka, Rops certified? In France?  ;D for the moment, i have no plan. But along the roll cage line. There's plenty of space inside. Tirewise, the michelines on it will do for the moment.

Mike Belben, these are portals, made by Latil. Brakes juste outside the differential bulb. Not articulated, there's cardans, but a rigid bar below.  Ans the leaf springs are mounted on this. I haven't paid attention if SUA or SOA.

Here's a page describing the original tractor.

http://www.avant-train-latil.com/TL73.php
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

sawguy21

I could have used that on my driveway last winter but the neighbors might get annoyed. I can just imagine it moving snow. ;D
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

Satamax

Here, it's been 3 or 4 winters with less snow than usual. So the local machines weren't working much.

This one comes from paris airport. Which one i don't know. But it has only 275h. It has a 4 digit horameter, but can't have any more than the 275, it's brand new in some protected spots.

Same as mine, at work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7SaT3ZANV4

French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

Satamax

To work, but in the original configuration.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v06DNzmgr5U

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHnZB-NlScs

Discovered yesterday, that i have the small wheels :( For which it's even harder to find tires!

French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

mike_belben

Well, it looks much better suited than that crane and appears to have diff lock in both axles which will be a tremendous help.  A rear steering portal is an odd choice for a skidder since theyre inherently weakened by the kingpins and leverage that the portal box places on the inner knuckles, but it appears they have incorporated a lower tension brace across the bottom trunnion?  I suppose i would sacrifice the clearance for the increased strength.



Are they 14-20 xml's?  Thats a common american military tire.

Do you have a winch for it?


I highly encourage you to fab grapple fingers when you build your blade.  For every log ive wanted to push there has been another ive wanted to pull.
Praise The Lord

47sawdust

Between this rig and the sawmill,there is no need for a sanity check.I can see you are a very troubled soul.There is no known cure ,so you might as well continue on the path you are on. ;D
Best of luck to you.All I have to do is show your latest find to my wife and I can bring just about anything home.
You are a great point man,keep up the hard work.
Mick
Mick
1997 WM Lt30 1999 WM twin blade edger Kubota L3750 Tajfun winchGood Health Work is my hobby.

Satamax

Quote from: mike_belben on August 17, 2017, 06:24:54 AM
Well, it looks much better suited than that crane and appears to have diff lock in both axles which will be a tremendous help.  A rear steering portal is an odd choice for a skidder since theyre inherently weakened by the kingpins and leverage that the portal box places on the inner knuckles, but it appears they have incorporated a lower tension brace across the bottom trunnion?  I suppose i would sacrifice the clearance for the increased strength.



Are they 14-20 xml's?  Thats a common american military tire.

Do you have a winch for it?


I highly encourage you to fab grapple fingers when you build your blade.  For every log ive wanted to push there has been another ive wanted to pull.

Mike, there's lower tension brace. With those tires, about 12inches from the ground. They are 11.00r20 michelin XL. But i need one, cose one blew and has been replaced by a no good firestone.  There's a lock at the back, but there's no sign of a handle for the front. I bet there is all the gear inside tho.

I wouldn't mind a set of 14.00R20.


Quote from: 47sawdust on August 17, 2017, 06:57:58 AM
Between this rig and the sawmill,there is no need for a sanity check.I can see you are a very troubled soul.There is no known cure ,so you might as well continue on the path you are on. ;D
Best of luck to you.All I have to do is show your latest find to my wife and I can bring just about anything home.
You are a great point man,keep up the hard work.
Mick

My soul is fine. It's just my brain which is demented! :D
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

Satamax

Guys, just one daft question.

Do i keep the ultra low gears? It's on the PTO, and i could use this one for other things.

I have 1/1 for normal gears. 1.72 to one for the low ones. The max speed in normal 5 gear is supposedly 45kmh. or 28mph.  1.72 lower is already very good. I wonder if the 12.8 to one could be of any use?

French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

Riwaka


Satamax

Sent a mail to vraking ans to another guy in France.

The later has replied, 294€ shopping and taxes included.

I will see what vraking says. I hope i can scrounge enough to buy the tire, from the blower's metal. Ans few other bits of metal i have. I need four tons :(
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

Puffergas

I would be one proud puppy to own that machine. Nice ! !
Jeff
Somewhere 20 miles south of Lake Erie.

GEHL 5624 skid steer, Trojan 114, Timberjack 225D, D&L SB1020 mill, Steiger Bearcat II

mike_belben

The 1:1 or 1.72.. Thats a transfercase after the transmission right? 

You want to know your crawl ratio.  First trans gear x tcase ratio x ring and pinion ratio x portal box ratio = crawl ratio.


My truck has about 60:1 crawl ratio..it might go 4mph to the floor in takeoff gear, and will get any load rolling without throttle.  I think deeper than 70:1 is pointlessly slow.

Praise The Lord

Satamax

Mike, So these 1:1 and 1:1.72 are the transfer case ratios.

Then after you have 1.93 in the differentials, and 4.93 in the portals.

So that's Just for the secondary transmission, a ratio of 16,36, gearbox not taken into account.

The gearbox is from the Renault TRM4000 or it's brother Saviem SM8.

First gear is 7.41 to 1

Second 4.19

third  2.39

fourth 1.48

and fifth   1

So first gear low ratio, that's already 121 to one engine rotation. Plenty i would say!

With the 12.8 to one inserted, and the 1.72 out of the cinematic chain, that's 902.48 to one in first gear. So, at idle, it would do one wheel rotation every minute or so. Not worth it i'd think!



French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

mike_belben

Youre confusing me now. 

Im seeing 5spd transmission, 2spd transfer case, single speed differential and portal box reductions.  Are there more? Does it have two manual transmissions in series.. Or a brownie box or something?

Crawl ratio
7.41 x 1.72 x 1.93 x 4.93 = 121.27

Transport speed
1.0 x 1.0 x 1.93 x 4.93 = 9.51


Seems pretty well set up IMO.   I think a 900:1 ratio is a pointless novelty unless you plan to get out and walk beside it.  Youd only find use for that type of ratio (inches per minute) in concrete type traction.  Anything wet or muddy will just spin.  Muck requires wheelspeed to clear the tire voids.


120:1is a very capable ratio.  It should be able to provide enough pull and engine braking for what you want to do. 


Praise The Lord

Satamax

Hi Mike.

I don't know what is a brownie box!

Basically, there's a second gear at the gearbox (i think) . Sort of. It's on the PTO, then coming back out to the main shaft with pulleys and V belts. An additional 12.8 to 1. I will try it. But i doubt it's of any use besides blowing snow. And since i need PTO for lots of things. I think this will have to go.
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

Satamax

Starting thinning down

Photo from yesterday.



French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

mike_belben

Browne-lipe was a manufacturer of auxiliary transmissions that went in series behind the primary trans to provide more ratios on american trucks of yore.  Eaton fuller incorporated the this internally with their auxilliary tail section in the roadranger line, which gave you only one shifter and some air buttons to wrestle, so brownies went extinct and fuller reins supreme.


I understand the pto box now.. It takes power off the trans input shaft, steps it down through extra reduction device and feeds it back into the driveline.  The purpose was to get full engine rpm (to run pumps, trecher, vibrator plow or auger etc etc) at a half mile per hour ground engagement speed.  Its not uncommon for trenchers to have a gear trans with a hydraulic drive option for plow engagement thats routed off the pto then back into the tcase.  Useless for you unless you plan to mow, till or mulch with it too.

I love your truck.   Im looking at those blower mounts and cylinders thinking how easy it would be to base a log loader/blade off them.  Then weld a limb riser brace right off that to an exo skeleton cage over the cab.  This thing is cool.
Praise The Lord

Satamax

Mike, thanks for the reply.

The pto is blocked by the transmission thingy.

About the  chimney mounts, they're hydraulic. Ans will be transformed into log turners on the sawmill. Cylinders will go on the blade. Someway. And i just found some parts from a snowplough, with cylinders which will become stabilisers like on my crane. And the guy has a winch for little dough i think. A pan brand. About 15/20 tons.
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

mike_belben

I guess id hafta see this gear reduction.  I meant a power takeoff acess cover on  the side of the trans.. Not a pto shaft at the bumper.

Take lots of pics as you go!
Praise The Lord

Satamax

Mike, this is pure weirdness.

It's dual transfer case. But not normal way. As in a crawler box. One feeding the other.

Nope. There's belts on the shaft from the gearbox, this shaft goes to the transfer case. The output of this transfer case is linked to the output front shaft of other transfer case. I dont even understand how this can work.  Since there's a differential in the normal transfer case. I think i would have to lock the diff, for the four wheels to work. I'll post photos in a minute.
French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

Satamax

Backside of the second transfer case, with the pulley cover.



Front, with the pulley visible, and the shaft, which is linked to the front output of the transfer case.

 

Still, that doesn't tell me where to take power for the winch, and hydraulics! I'm onto a lead for the stabilizers apron thingy i want at the back. And for a winch too.

I have taken out and cut the blower's slides.



Big one has a smaller engine (4236 4 banger turbo) than the little brother!  :(



And the big V8, i wish i could stuff this one in the  crane! 15 liters!




French CD4 sawmill. Latil TL 73. Self moving hydraulic crane. Iveco daily 4x4 lwb dead as of 06/2020. Replaced by a Brimont TL80 CSA.

mike_belben

Yeah that belt drive tcase is a new one on me. 
Praise The Lord

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