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Author Topic: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue  (Read 1480 times)

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Offline dsaw

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #20 on: May 16, 2017, 09:45:25 pm »
Good to know on the left hand thread.  Just had that issue tonight removing the old truck tires off the axle.  Sheared the 1st nut before I realized one wheel was reverse treaded.  I'd never heard of a wheel being reverse threaded, so didn't think about it.  Other side side is right hand threaded. 

Offline paul case

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #21 on: May 16, 2017, 10:43:11 pm »
A lot of those truck wheels that are left handed will have an L stamped on the end of the nut or the end of the stud or both. That stands for the last Looser that tightened them while trying to loosen.

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Offline Kbeitz

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #22 on: May 17, 2017, 06:16:20 am »
Good to know on the left hand thread.  Just had that issue tonight removing the old truck tires off the axle.  Sheared the 1st nut before I realized one wheel was reverse treaded.  I'd never heard of a wheel being reverse threaded, so didn't think about it.  Other side side is right hand threaded.

I bet it was a Dodge.
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Offline grouch

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #23 on: May 17, 2017, 11:09:35 am »
Good to know on the left hand thread.  Just had that issue tonight removing the old truck tires off the axle.  Sheared the 1st nut before I realized one wheel was reverse treaded.  I'd never heard of a wheel being reverse threaded, so didn't think about it.  Other side side is right hand threaded.

I bet it was a Dodge.

My '49 Olds has left threads on the left, right on the right. Maybe some marketer insisted on that to tell customers the wheels turning would keep the lug nuts on.

Offline Dieseltim

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #24 on: May 18, 2017, 06:20:28 pm »
Ok, who knows how tight to install the left-hand nut to hold on the blade? How many foot lbs?

Offline bandmiller2

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #25 on: May 18, 2017, 09:21:56 pm »
Tim, I don't recall any torque figure given. Usually hand tight with a wrench same radius as the saw or wack a shorter wrench with a soft hammer. Belsaw collars don't have the two pins that other saws have. Frank C.
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Offline grouch

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #26 on: May 18, 2017, 09:46:36 pm »
Ok, who knows how tight to install the left-hand nut to hold on the blade? How many foot lbs?

Advice I was given a few decades ago -- run it up 'til it strips out, then give it another quarter turn.                          ((Don't do that)).

Offline Coolrunner

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #27 on: May 19, 2017, 07:50:48 am »
Tim, I don't recall any torque figure given. Usually hand tight with a wrench same radius as the saw or wack a shorter wrench with a soft hammer. Belsaw collars don't have the two pins that other saws have. Frank C.

Sounds about right.  I use a 24" pipe wrench on a 44" blade and haven't had an issue with blade slipping.  I am on the lookout for a proper wrench before I chew up the nut.  Hopefully sawing again tomorrow- some squared stock for a timberframed picnic shelter we're building at our community hall.  Coolrunner.
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Offline Babylon519

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #28 on: May 19, 2017, 04:17:15 pm »
My belsaw manual says the nut holding the blade (left-hand thread) should not be over-tightened. The collar has an engineered bevel on the circumference that should not be 'flattened' against the blade (see below). I use a big wrench to tighten it, but the action of the blade in the log also has the effect of tightening it.
BTW, the left-hand wheel of my rig also uses left-hand-thread lugs. I found that out the same way as Grouch says! I heard a lot of the stake trucks used in the army back in the '50s were the same way - in fact, my wheels are from that era, with the split-rim for added safety (NOT)!  :D


(This was the shape of the mill when I found it.)

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Offline dsaw

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #29 on: May 23, 2017, 11:22:36 pm »
My tire fiasco took another turn when I went to get them mounted.  The tire company refused to mount the tires on the 5" rims, saying I needed minimum 6" rims.  I asked about companies selling truck rims, and there was a place two blocks away.  The salesman took a look at the rims, he'd never seen anything like them, so he brought in his manager.  His conclusion was that they were popular back in the 50's and 60's; but little hope of finding replacements now.  I searched E-bay; but no luck.

So change of course.  Luckily, I was a cheapskate when I bought the tires.  Walmart.com was $5 cheaper then Amazon.  The beauty of that came through on the return, I just drove them to the closet Walmart, and they gave me the full refund.

Now I'm going to strip off the old axle and put on a "normal" trailer axle.  Total cost is about $100 more, but makes replacement parts much more accessible.  It does necessitate removing the blade for travel, but as others have pointed out; that's advisable.

Offline captain_crunch

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #30 on: May 28, 2017, 12:10:45 am »
M y Carrage  Has High molly Blocks to Help take Load
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Offline Coolrunner

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #31 on: May 30, 2017, 01:54:54 pm »
This past weekend, I decided to investigate why my cant gets thicker at the tailend, not the 8' logs but the 16' ones.   I put a string on the track and found that it bowed away from the saw which I guess, throws any overhanging cant outward as it goes by the saw.  I know...I should have made it straight when I built it.  I redrilled and straightened the track which threw my lead off.  Took blade off, adjusted to near limit on my adjustable bearing block, run my carriage by and it's too close now to the blade.  I then reshim the end rollers but the ones under the headblocks are not adjustable.  Sooo... now I'm back to redrilling and moving my entire track out from the blade.  I so hope it cures my little problem as it wasn't that big of a deal to begin with.  I'm sure having fun with this little Belsaw.
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Offline captain_crunch

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #32 on: June 04, 2017, 12:22:28 am »
Run Cagage past splitter And Measure to Knee They Famous For jumping a Tooth
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Offline dsaw

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #33 on: June 17, 2017, 10:36:50 pm »
Finally got the mill to my forest 1:20 away after putting a new axle on it.  Had several other delays, mainly  because it kept raining every weekend.  Got it leveled up and finally put power to it today, and my stuck carriage issue is back.  I ground for several hours on it with an angle grinder, pulled the middle carriage wheel, and got it to move back and forth. However, when I put a log on it, it moves fine in reverse (which is geared down), but gets stuck in the middle in forward.  Put a laser to it, and the middle of the rail jumps out about 3/16" over about a 10' span, then comes back.  I didn't check the carriage travel after putting the new axle on, so I may have torqued something doing that.  I just thought of that, so I'll check tomorrow.  Even if the axle didn't cause it, because it appears to be near where the axle is, I may be able to use that to pull the two sides together and hope it helps the bow.  Otherwise, I'm back to either turning the grove on the wheels even larger on my lathe, installing new rails, or trying to straighten the existing rails.

I was able to get a tiny amount of cutting done (2 faces of a log).  I'd reverse out when it stopped, but it got worse so I had to quit.  The mill is eating my hardwood dowel blade guides in a few minutes; so I'm guessing I need to have the blade hammered.  I was cutting about a 14" poplar, so nothing too dense.

Offline Kbeitz

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #34 on: June 18, 2017, 04:04:46 am »
Maybe you could use some all-thread rod to push or pull your track back in place.
Mount it in a spot where you could just leave it. 3/4" will give a lot of push. Smaller
will give a lot of pull.
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Offline grouch

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #35 on: June 18, 2017, 04:19:13 am »
Don't think I'd be trying to saw with bowed rails and a carriage that jams. Bad things are more likely to happen if you have to fight the machine to finish a cut.

I'd probably try something like what Kbeitz suggested, if threaded rod could be used without putting a twist to the rails.

Offline Blaszer

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #36 on: June 18, 2017, 10:43:06 am »
Sounds like your lead is off...It will make your blade heat up and do weird stuff..Including wiping out your dowels...

Offline dsaw

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #37 on: June 21, 2017, 01:23:20 pm »
I think my two problems are related since the carriage works with a log on but not cutting, but sticks while trying to cut.  If the blades wobbling too much, that probably contributes to the feeding problem.  I printed off a copy of "The Efficent Saw Mill" and will work through it to make sure I have my adjustments correct this weekend.

Offline dsaw

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Re: Belsaw M14 Rail Issue
« Reply #38 on: June 24, 2017, 08:47:52 pm »
Adjusted the plumb and the lead, but couldn't get the blade to keep cutting into the log even with lots of lead.  Decided blade must be too dull.  Changed out the inserts, and now it cuts and feeds.  I still have a wobble in the blade, but now I think it's one or both bearings. 
     I had purchased the inserts a few weeks ago, but having never changed them out, I wasn't sure what I was in for.  So I held out until I was sure I needed to do it.  Took me awhile (I doubt they've been out in many years, and learning as I go), but zipped right through logs after that as fast as I can feed them.  Cut two beams for a log deck and called it a night. 
     Saw guide dowels are lasting much longer, but I may still buy some phenolic rod for more longevity.