The Forestry Forum is sponsored in part by:




TimberKing Sawmills




Toll Free 1-800-582-0470

LogRite Tools



Forest Products Industry Insurance


Norwood Industries Inc.


Sawmill & Woodlot Magazine



Your source for Portable Sawmills, Edgers, Resaws, Sharpeners, Setters, Bandsaw Blades and Sawmill Parts

EZ Boardwalk Sawmills. More Saw For Less Money!

STIHLDealers.com sponsored by Northeast STIHL


Woodland Sawmills

Peterson Swingmills

 KASCO SharpTech WoodMaxx Blades


Turbosawmill

Sawmill Exchange

BRUTE FORCE Authorized Dealer

Woodshax Outdoor Vending Solutions

FARMA

Forestry Forum Tool Box

Author Topic: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw  (Read 1812 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline SlowJoeCrow

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Waynesburg, Ohio
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« on: March 15, 2017, 04:43:04 pm »
I am considering buying a large Delta radial arm saw, but I am not an electrical whiz and I can't tell if the motor is 3 phase or not.  This is a Delta International 33-420 that was originally bought new in the 1990's and used until 2004 and it has just been sitting in a warehouse since.  Upon inspection, I couldn't find a motor plate with the specs - looking online at similar vintage machines, it appears the motor tag was just a decal so it could have peeled off.  After more internet research, it also appears that this model saw was available with different motors, both 3 phase and single phase.  The data decal on the lower saw frame indicates that it is 3 phase, but the fellow selling it says he's pretty sure it was single phase since they didn't have 3 phase power at the time the saw was purchased.  He is an employee of the larger company that owned it and isn't certain.  How can I tell what kind of motor this sucker has???  Anybody knowledgeable about these saws or what to look for to tell? I was ill-equipped at the time that I looked at it and will likely go back and open up the motor top plate for more inspection.  Here is the data plate that is one the lower frame of the saw.


Thoughts anyone?

Offline 21incher

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2062
  • Age: 62
  • Location: Marion, NY
  • Gender: Male
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2017, 04:53:25 pm »
It says 3 phase on the sticker. Check the number of wires to be sure ( there will be 3 hots). You should be able to run it on single phase with a VFD or phase converter.  :)
Hudson HFE-21 on a custom trailer, Deere 4100, Kubota BX 2360, Echo CS590 & CS310, home built wood splitter, home built log arch, and a logrite cant hook.

Offline Darrel

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1419
  • Age: 64
  • Location: Sprague River, Oregon
  • Gender: Male
  • Never throw an unopened log on the burn pile.
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2017, 05:18:40 pm »
Hear is a link that goes into detail as to how to build a rotary phase converter. It is way easier than most people believe

http://www.metalwebnews.com/howto/ph-conv/ph-conv.html
1992 LT40HD

The winds of change are blowing at hurricane force and I don't like it but good shall come even though I see not how.

Offline SlowJoeCrow

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Waynesburg, Ohio
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2017, 06:11:05 pm »
I will be going back tomorrow to open the motor cover to look at the wires.  They were pretty adament that it was single phase despite the label shown above.

Offline Dave Shepard

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 10128
  • Age: 2012
  • Location: Alford Massachusetts
  • Gender: Male
  • Geometrically proportional
    • My homepage
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2017, 06:29:42 pm »
That O with a slash through it means phase, in this case three phase. Could the motor have been replaced with a single phase one?
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

Offline SlowJoeCrow

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Waynesburg, Ohio
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2017, 09:07:20 pm »
That what I was wondering.   They said they bought it new though so they would have had it equipped for whatever electrical service they had at the time.
We shall see tomorrow.   I'm hoping it is the 5 hp single phase on the machine.

Offline Larry

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 5588
  • Age: 69
  • Location: NW Arkansas
  • Gender: Male
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2017, 10:24:30 pm »
The label say's its a 3 phase motor so I suspect its 3 phase.  It can become tricky.  In the picture is a 14 Delta bandsaw that has a 3 phase motor that I run on single phase.  Inside the box is a small capacitor and relay that starts the motor.  Its called a static phase converter.  Most folks assume the bandsaw is single phase.

I built that static converter, but I never would run a 5 HP saw with one, especially if I was working it hard.  I also build rotary phase converters which work well and have a whole flock of VFD's in the shop.  VFD's to run 5 HP are expensive.

And remember....Real Machines are three phase. :)

Larry

Nine out of ten trees recommend wood for your building project.

Online opticsguy

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 274
  • Age: 68
  • Location: Bellingham, WA
  • Gender: Male
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2017, 11:28:09 am »
18" radial arm saw?  Never knew they made such an item, I want one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
TK 1220 band mill,  1952 Ford F-2, 1925 Dodge touring, too many telescopes.

Offline WV Sawmiller

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3372
  • Age: 64
  • Location: Hinton WV
  • Gender: Male
    • Green's Sawmill Services
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2017, 01:03:54 pm »
18" radial arm saw?  Never knew they made such an item, I want one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
X2.

   I just got a 10" radial arm saw last year, built a stand/table for it in the end of my lumber shed and I don't know how I ever got along without it. I see I now salvage a lot more short lumber and such that I used to throw in the scrap pile. My next tool to use more is my planer.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2009 4wd Dodge PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Sthil 440 & 441, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

Offline Brian_Weekley

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 626
  • Location: N. Stonington, CT
  • Gender: Male
  • I am Batman!
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2017, 02:51:27 pm »
Any chance it already has a phase converter on it but they didn't realize what it was?

Make sure you wear your big boy pants to move that thing!  Radial arm saws are cool!

BTW, this is a fascinating WWII era film showing large scale use of DeWalt radial arm saws to build barracks.  The versatility of these saws are amazing...



e aho laula

Offline Dave Shepard

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 10128
  • Age: 2012
  • Location: Alford Massachusetts
  • Gender: Male
  • Geometrically proportional
    • My homepage
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2017, 07:15:26 pm »
The scale of those projects is amazing. I'm doing good just to make a few tomato stakes in an hour. :D
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

Offline Brian_Weekley

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 626
  • Location: N. Stonington, CT
  • Gender: Male
  • I am Batman!
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2017, 07:40:54 pm »
I'm doing good just to make a few tomato stakes in an hour. :D

Did you see them making tomato stakes at 13:15 in that video?   :D

And check out the dado blade at 21:15!
e aho laula

Offline SlowJoeCrow

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Waynesburg, Ohio
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2017, 08:12:05 pm »
Well to give an update, I returned for more investigation... it is in fact a single phase motor - there are  two capacitors in the box on top of the motor.  From the research that I have done, the 33-420 was a 5hp single phase.  The 33-421 was a 7.5hp 3 phase.  I have no idea why the model plate indicates it is three phase,  the motor is definitely single phase, and looks completely stock as far as I can tell.  I will post some photos if I can.

Offline SlowJoeCrow

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Waynesburg, Ohio
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2017, 08:54:47 pm »
Wow that video is awesome!!  BTW, cutting points on stakes is exactly why I want one of these larger radial arm saws, even though I have never seen this video before.  Nice to know my thought process isn't way off!  I want to be able to tip entire boards and then rip them into stakes.  The saw that I'm looking at is in rough shape though and I'm having second thoughts.   I have no way of seeing it run before purchasing and I don't know what condition the motor is in.

Offline SlowJoeCrow

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Waynesburg, Ohio
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2017, 09:15:05 pm »
Here are some pictures of the beast:



The last picture shows the motor capacitors.   It is in rough shape with the stock legs missing, the brass Arbor nut stripped out and most pivot points are seized up.

Offline Larry

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 5588
  • Age: 69
  • Location: NW Arkansas
  • Gender: Male
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2017, 09:29:28 pm »
In that condition its hardly worth scrap value.  Usually the motors are good and at most would require new bearings which is simple.  The arm is the real problem.  I've never tore into a Delta but some of the Dewalt arms can be re-done at great expense.

I've seen a lot of RAS's at industrial auctions that do good if they get a bid.  I have a 12" Delta and a 16" Dewalt in fair condition but lots better than that saw.  Think I have $100 in the two of them.

Larry

Nine out of ten trees recommend wood for your building project.

Offline Darrel

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1419
  • Age: 64
  • Location: Sprague River, Oregon
  • Gender: Male
  • Never throw an unopened log on the burn pile.
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2017, 10:04:30 pm »
A machine in that condition will be happier if you don't wake it up and make it go to work and so will you. I'd hold off 'till I found one in better condition. I know of no woodworking machine as versatile or dangerous as a RAS. that being said, use your head and you can stay quite safe.
1992 LT40HD

The winds of change are blowing at hurricane force and I don't like it but good shall come even though I see not how.

Offline Don P

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 3787
  • Gender: Male
    • Calculator Index
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2017, 10:38:03 pm »
I've used older versions of that saw in 3 ph, they are beasts, one followed me around to 2 different shops, couldn't get away from it  :D.
I was working in an expanding furniture company back in the day... Yes back in the day there were expanding furniture companies. They had about 30 12" DeWalt radial arms that I helped switch out to whirlwind chop saws. The problem with most was that the arm is a casting with grooves machined in it that the motor carriage bearings run in. Those grooves were pretty heavily worn on most of the saws in the first 6" or so where they did most of their work and bouncing. The Craftsman's had a half round strip of replaceable steel and bearings with a concave rather than convex outer profile performing the same function on their saws. I agree a radial arm is probably the most versatile and dangerous tool in the shop.

Offline SlowJoeCrow

  • Full Member x2
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Waynesburg, Ohio
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm new!
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2017, 10:53:56 pm »
The arm and slider are in good shape, just needs cleaned and relubed.  This Delta has four roller bearings that ride on four hardened rods held in the cast arm.  If these wear, all you have to do is rotate the rods.  I'm sure I could loosen up the pivot points as well, I'm more worried about the motor being junk.  I am leaning away from it since I would have to spend a good amount of time to get it up and running and my time is at a premium.  He is asking $400.  Still, it's not everyday I come across a single phase 18" RAS......hmmmm....

Offline 21incher

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 2062
  • Age: 62
  • Location: Marion, NY
  • Gender: Male
Re: Delta 18" Radial Arm Saw
« Reply #19 on: March 17, 2017, 08:32:58 am »
Good luck if you purchase it. For $400.00 I would have to hear the motor running. I bet it will cost another $400.00 for a good blade with the proper hook angle for it. That saw would put fear in my heart after seeing my 10 inch kick out a strip of wood that shattered when it hit the concrete wall. :) 
Hudson HFE-21 on a custom trailer, Deere 4100, Kubota BX 2360, Echo CS590 & CS310, home built wood splitter, home built log arch, and a logrite cant hook.