What would you want to see?

[williamgriffin]

Hi all.

My name is William Griffin, and I'm a currently a forestry student at Mississippi State. I am considering a masters degree at MSU with a a concentration in Operations/Harvesting.

Since I don't personally have a lot of experience in logging, I thought I would ask those of you that do: What kind of project/thesis/study would you as a logger/truck driver/forester see as most useful in that realm (ops/harvesting) of forestry?


Thanks in advance for any insight!

JWG

[dustintheblood]

Hi William,

Congratulations on your pursuit of your thesis.  You'll find a wealth of information here, from seasoned veterans of the industry and those with a firm grasp of the practical (and real) side of the sector.  I'd respectfully suggest that you pay close attention to their thoughts, as they're far more valuable than many of the abstract concepts that permeate the academic world as it relates to forestry.

Best,
Geoff

[longtime lurker]

Welcome William.

I'm on the other side of the world in a very different situation in a lot of ways from most here, but reading between the lines there are a lot of people in the industry in the US that are hurting. Mill and pulp plant closures, tie market falling fast. Aging workforce that have the necessary skill set, aging equipment, limited ROI and limited opportunity for those prepared to go out on a limb. Tightening emissions and environmental standards. International competition and a tight domestic economy. Pests and diseases ravaging much of the forest resource.
Those are the issues facing the industry on a regional and/or national basis.

A study that called it like it is, and presented some thought as to where things will be in 20 years when the aged (men and equipment) have become ancient might be useful. It gets real hard to see a way forward when you're too busy working to survive to look past next week.

Good luck with your thesis.
John.

[caveman]

Welcome William. I had a reply almost completed and I made an errant key strike and it is evidently gone.  I have to leave in a few minutes so this one will be brief.

I am not in the industry but I think I would focus on invasive species and the impact they have on the forest industry.  There are other industries that have been severely affected by invasive species as well.

Asian Citrus Psyllid (citrus)
Cogan Grass (one of the world's 10 worst)
Brazilian Pepper
Melaleuca
Japanese and Old World Climbing Ferns
Kudzu
Emerald Ash Borer
Red Bay Ambrosia Beetle (forestry and avocado industry)
Tropical Soda Apple
Fire Ants
Gypsy Moth
Pythons, monkeys, tilapia, Cuban lizards and frogs have all displaced native Florida species.

There are plenty of others but the impact of these that have no natural native predators or competition can be devastating.  Whatever direction you decide to go with your thesis, I would like to read it when you have completed it.
Kyle

[WV Sawmiller]

William,

   I am just a small portable sawmiller who harvests my own logs. I would love to see a study on harvesting small woodlots with low impact logging techniques like ATV, snowmobiles (if applicable), horse/mule logging, and the small walk behind skidders (or whatever they are called at that size).

    I know loggers and big sawmills like huge plots of land they can clear cut but I know there are many small family owned plots (say 5-20 acres) where the owner would like to selectively salvage some mature, maybe over-aged trees but not damage the property or smaller trees to which the owner may be very personally attached. Good luck. A big old War Eagle to you.

[Riwaka]

Hello

When picking a Master's thesis topic primarily the question is; will this thesis topic aid me in obtaining a job in the real world (unless you intend to remain in an academic environment)?
i.e Will this thesis topic be seen to have real value to a future potential employer?

Choosing a thesis supervisor or will this person be allocated to you? Personality clashes should be avoided. Do not pick topics that are pet subjects of your course supervisors. Read a few 'How to pick master thesis topics' guides. Ask previous master's students who was the most helpful supervisor, work out who might be best to ask if you get stuck with the maths of your thesis (if you need someone other than your supervisor)

Get into contact with cotontop3 and a few forestry companies/ logging companies personnel (in your area or that you or your friends know to see) if they need any questions answered.
*Choose a topic that you think you will be enthusiastic about for the duration that you take to complete it.

topic - anything to improve logging efficiency / cost saving is usually valuable. e.g Machine monitors to prevent employees damaging logging equipment. Reducing time skidder operators spend looking for log bunches in the cutover and minimising skidder haul distances to reduce fuel use. optimising logging machine maintenance to reduce downtime and optimise log machine availability, LED lights to lengthen logging day (is 4x 15 hours versus 5 x12hours to give crew 3 day weekend)
http://www.interpine.co.nz/SitePages/STICKS%20-%20Harvester%20and%20Woodflow%20Information%20System.aspx   (One of the logging software companies might have a piece of their jigsaw that needs more work to improve their product that might need data collection etc)

[Corley5]

Actual experience would give more credibility.  That's an issue in many industries.  People with "education" and no field experience advising those who are actually doing the job everyday...  Things look completely different from the seat of machine. 

[starmac]

Probably not what you are looking for, but I would love to see some feasibility studies for ways to use the wood we waste and leave in the woods.

I do not even know if spruce is usuable for plywood, but if it is, I would love to see a study to see if a plywood plant could be profitably run in Alaska.
We ship all plywood, particle board and osb up now, even if we had to ship some out, outgoing freight rates are just a fraction of incoming as barges and even trucks are mostly empty going out.

Another use I would like to see studied would be burning chips for heat, we have 2 schools that I know of that are heated with chips. I would like to see a study on the feasibility to use it in remote villages that has barge access, instead of bargeing diesel, barge chips instead.

Just a couple of ideas, but there has to be an affordable way to use what is now left to rot, and put a few more bucks in loggers pockets.

[caveman]

I should have paid closer attention to your request for ideas on harvesting/operations.  Improvements on efficiency, safety, productivity could be possible topics.

[plasticweld]

Logging is a lot like farming.  There are a few people doing really well and most that just get by.  They are loggers first and businessmen second.  I see this all the time when it comes to mills and logging operations.  As in any business you will see a handful of people who do very well.  I would do a study comparing the similarities between those successful men and why they seem to do better than the rest.   If I were a business looking to hire a sharp young guy, I would want him to bring to the table the techniques that are successful, and the dynamics of what make a business work.  You are at some point going to need a job to pay for  your education and pay the bills, why not do the best you can to become an expert on the top 10 percent of the trade and how they got there.  Any company seeking hire you would be hard pressed to find a quality and skill set that set you apart from the rest of the herd and the day dreamers who just always wanted to work in the woods.

[mad murdock]

Welcome, and congrats on working on your degree.  It is good to see guys like yourself reach out to venues like the Forestry Forum, I don't know if any of the admins have done any cumulative statistics on the years of knowledge amassed on here, but my bet it is probably in the 500 plus, maybe even 1,000 years of logging experience in the aggregate.  I for one would love to see something similar along the lines as to what WV Sawmiller suggested, there has been much done on forestry on a "macro" scale, I think moving forward as an industry thought needs to be put in on more local markets, local niche products and specialty forestry, if you will.  I for one have been working on developing high value markets for products that can be produced with equipment as close to the stump as possible, so as to keep production costs down, and margins up.  A focus on a high end product, will produce a good livelyhood, while being able to utlilze the resource to the maximium. Kind of like what new member Osage Outlaw is doing, specializing in custom products from a single species of wood, that most people would consider just firewood.  I think that with a little research, one could develope a strategy for high value products wherever they live.  When I was in N. Wisc, my brother and I worked on this basis, and were able to do some things that netted some good money and did not require that we produce lots of wood as the value of what we were producing was up there, way moreso than if we had been focused on pulp and box bolt wood. Things like custom products for log home builders, like white cedar rail stock, dredge and dock works pilings, to custom veneer markets.  With a little market research and networking, it is pretty remarkable what one can find out.  With the new ultra portable mill platforms, it is pretty amazing to see what can be done a a "micro" scale. Products like the Logosol Laks Frame saw, produce high end products and can be set up in somewhat remote settings, then there are the many portable swingblade mills that are being used in many extreme remote situations, due to their portability, ease of use and remarkably high production rates for the sizes of the mills.  I will stay tuned to see what you end up focusing on for your thesis, should be an interesting piece of work!

[Puffergas]

How charcoal could pickup up the slack from the declining pulp wood industry.

[Riwaka]

Thread author could you please tell (if you know) us outside North America a few things.
My American Forest Economics lecturer at an Australasian Forestry School used to joke that people with undergraduate forestry degrees in North America could expect to be a taxi driver or a pot washer in a restaurant kitchen. Master's forestry degrees could expect to spend 5 years volunteering in a Central American Tropical Forestry operation before getting a starter forestry job back in North America. Is the situation still like this?

Rather doing a Master's in Operations/ Harvesting you might also look at other areas such as more targeted business qualifications, more technical training to complement your mainly theoretical? degree - training in hydraulics, machine electrics/ electronics, diesel, welding, small engines- chainsaws etc. A Master's  might mean you end up driving around in a pickup watching people chop down trees for years and buying a longer trouser belt every year.

Have you done the cost/ benefit analysis of a Masters vs other degrees training etc?

Contact a few people around the Globe who do the career you want to have. Brian Tuor is a great example of plenty of practical experience and plenty of academic learning and research/ innovation and then  training other people. http://www.cableloggingspecialist.com/