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Author Topic: Kubinec strapping trick  (Read 1484 times)

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Offline Brad_bb

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Kubinec strapping trick
« on: January 27, 2017, 12:46:49 am »
Strapping up some timbers for shipment.  Strapping a layer of 5 8x8's with corner protectors.  The problem is that with the corner protectors, when you try to tighten the strapping with the manual tool, the whole strap slips around the layer and doesn't tighten.

 

 

Solution:  leave the coil on the loose end as shown, leave the short end about 14 inches long  and locate the buckle about 6 inches from the corner as shown.  Here's the trick: take the coil end and wrap it around the out side timber twice.  It will hold that end fixed while you pull/tighten with the 14 inch end.

Note, I make "T" separators from two 4" long pieces of sticker and a brad nailer.  Keeps the timbers separated to allow airflow if they get wet at all.  They'll be tarped for shipping, but you never know If they'll get wet from a hole, or at the other end, nor how long they will sit.  You want to make sure they can dry out.
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Offline WV Sawmiller

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2017, 09:55:51 am »
   Nice tip. Pretty fancy strapping to my way of thinking.

   About everything I have to tie down gets tied with old hay strings or dry rotted polypropylene ropes that got too weak to hold up a deer feeder.
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Offline YellowHammer

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2017, 08:01:41 am »
How does the web strapping compare to crimp poly or steel in these heavy bundles?  Just as secure?  Do you notice any issues?

I've also been using a lot of the buckled webbed strapping for certain applications.  It unexcelled for the ability to retighten during the handling and drying process, as opposed to standard crimp strapping.  For example, as soon as a pack gets stickered, about 5 feet tall, it gets strapped tightly (we use our hands to tighten, or the standard ratchet tool that can universally be used for crimp or buckle tightening) so I don't spill the tall packs off the forklift and to keep the stickers in place when transporting.  Then, after a little air drying time, the packs shrink, the bands will significantly loosen, so we retightened them when we move them to the kiln, generally only requiring a quick pull with our hands.  Once out of the kiln, the straps are loose again, and we will hand tighten them again, and move to unsticker and dead stack and then tighten them to capacity with the mechanical ratchet for on the road transport.  Using crimps, we used to blow through the strapping material, but one web strap can be used for the whole process.     
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Offline dgdrls

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2017, 08:15:55 am »
Thanks Brad_BB  I have that system too, 
 
 ?,  have you tried doing a 2 over 3  stack or similar when shipping odd totals
Just wondering if it would ship/manage better or do you loose some advantage I'm not considering?

D



Offline 4x4American

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2017, 08:39:20 am »
The best trick I found with my Kubinec strapping was to buy the $70 ratchet tool
Wait til you get to be my age

Offline paul case

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2017, 08:54:22 am »
Uline sells 2 versions of that tool and as best as I can see they are the same. The same tool works on the green plastic strap. I tried them both and they work. So if you buy the tool then you only are the crimp tool short of being able to use much cheaper strapping.

I used the kubinek strap and buckles. I found that uline.com sells a comparable strapping for cheaper then I switched to the green plastic and I like it best.

I also have a friend who made his own tightener for the buckle strapping by making 2 saw cuts in a 2x6-2' so it worked as a lever like the one in the kit from baileys.
Good job Brad on using it twice.

PC
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Offline tmbrcruiser

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2017, 09:13:51 am »
I use the same banding too, only I didn't get the corner protectors. Not sure why I didn't get them but didn't. I have only used the banding for finished lumber after the kiln, so everything I have banded is flat stacked.  My answer to protect the corners was to cut 1"x2"x height of the bundle (scrap), place this under the strap on each side. Haven't have any problems with the strapping slipping. The other thing I like with this method is, as I tighten the banding a slight tap on the 1"x2" evens up the side of the bundle. Great idea on the spacers for larger timber.
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Offline 4x4American

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2017, 09:50:08 am »
Uline sells 2 versions of that tool and as best as I can see they are the same. The same tool works on the green plastic strap. I tried them both and they work. So if you buy the tool then you only are the crimp tool short of being able to use much cheaper strapping.

I used the kubinek strap and buckles. I found that uline.com sells a comparable strapping for cheaper then I switched to the green plastic and I like it best.

I also have a friend who made his own tightener for the buckle strapping by making 2 saw cuts in a 2x6-2' so it worked as a lever like the one in the kit from baileys.
Good job Brad on using it twice.

PC


I might look into that.  I got two 2750' rolls of the Kubincec from global industrial supply over the summer. Well the sales rep didn't bother to mention there were two strengths.  The small rolls I had been getting in the 8 packs were the strong (green line) ones.  Well now I guess to save $ they sold me the weaker red line strapping, and I have had
multiple cases of the straps breaking.  One time was when I had a guy backhaul a pack of 100 2x4x8's to a customers site in his dump trailer and when he dumped it one of the straps broke.  And we've had multiple breakages when the guy who buys my slabwood unloads them off my truck, but he's far from easy on the bundles and alot of times he spkies his forks right jnto the bundle because he has the flip over the bucket forks and can't see what he's doing.


  Another problem with the ratchet tensioner is the dogging spikes slide before picking up and if you tighten it too much it will break when you release the tool.  Imo they should make it so it just picks straight up.  I'm just about done with the first roll and once I finish the second I'm gonna look at different options.  Fwiw the green line high strength kubinec strapping was great, I never had a problem. And when I called Kubinec directly they were helpful. I wish I had called them first before Global Industrial
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Offline Brad_bb

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2017, 12:41:56 pm »
YellowHammer, I like the system because it's low cost to get into it.  I use the manual tool and it works fine for the amount I use it.  This system probably takes a little longer to install because the strapping is loose(not stiff like metal or poly) and fishing it between timber layers can be a little more difficult - unless you make a little wood or metal tool to hook the end of the strapping on and push it through the space(another trick).    You get faster with the system the more you use it.  the buckles and straps are reusable so long as the straps aren't sun damaged.  Sometimes I'll temporarily strap something like moving it to the site, then you cut the short end and you can reuse it albeit it's a few inches shorter.  I find myself making the tails longer to help tighten them and reuse them.  YES, you can retighten them if you've left the tail long enough to wrap on the manual tool.  Another great thing is you can order more strapping and buckles on Amazon.

dgdrls,
Do you just mean stacking like a pyramid for stability?  For the stack of 8x8's shown, I stack 5 flat across.  The layer is strapped to keep that layer together- keep one from kicking out.  Bunks go on top and another layer goes on and so on.  There is are layers loaded on the semi flat bead from each side.  The deck is 8ft wide and the layers are 45 inches wide on each side.   Now when I have curved brace stock, I strap it up a lot more - I strap pairs together, and then strap 4 pairs together as I go up the stack.  If I have an odd single it goes on top as 1 over 2.

 

 
 

 
 

 
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

Offline dgdrls

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2017, 01:48:51 pm »
"dgdrls,
Do you just mean stacking like a pyramid for stability?  For the stack of 8x8's shown, I stack 5 flat across.  The layer is strapped to keep that layer together- keep one from kicking out.  Bunks go on top and another layer goes on and so on.  There is are layers loaded on the semi flat bead from each side.  The deck is 8ft wide and the layers are 45 inches wide on each side.   Now when I have curved brace stock, I strap it up a lot more - I strap pairs together, and then strap 4 pairs together as I go up the stack.  If I have an odd single it goes on top as 1 over 2."


Yes, that was the thought,  I like the pics you posted,

D

Offline barbender

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2017, 02:08:36 pm »
I haven't been able to get my strapping as tight with the ratcheting tool, vs the manual one. It starts to slip before things get cinched down very well.
Too many irons in the fire

Offline Brad_bb

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2017, 02:20:58 pm »
I think the leverage of the manual tools works pretty well.  It does rely on friction with the wood to tighten down, which is why when using corner protectors you need to wrap the one strap end around the wood.  You lose  your friction using the corner protectors and so need to hold one end of strap to tighten.  Wrapping twice around the timber is like using a reduction pulley, and thus the friction of the wrap is enough to hold it while tightening the other end.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
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Offline hersnsh#590

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2017, 09:47:21 pm »
Brad:  I've got to ask a stupid question.  What's the species of the lumber in your third picture.  If it's what it looks like from here in VT, there should be an armed guard posted nearby.

Thanks
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Offline YellowHammer

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #13 on: January 29, 2017, 11:26:18 pm »
I've never used the manual tool, but the ratchets will pull the strapping so tight I can break it.  Certainly tighten it up to a high "e" before it pops.  Nice thing with ratchets, it doesn't have to be threaded through the cutter, so once tight, it can be disengaged without trimming the tags, so they can be ratcheted again, if the need arises.
I bought a 4 foot long plastic threading tool, which is nothing but 8 feet of 1" by 1/8" plastic folded back on itself, held floded with pop rivets every few inches.  The strapping is passed between the air space between them, and the tool simply pushes under a pallet.  Best tool I've bought lately, but incredibly simple.   

I've noticed some of the commercials mills around here have started using buckle straps too, but instead of orange web, they use a white fibererd, clear strap with no stretch at all.  Very strong stuff. 
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Offline Brad_bb

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2017, 02:28:58 am »
 hersnsh#590, you mean the Walnut?  It's "highly Valuable".  But seriously, not worth as much as highly figured wood, although some in that stack is actually figured.  The time and work I have in it is worth more to me.  It's planed stock for timberframe braces.  Actually the second pic is curved Osage brace stock, which I have a lot more time and work in.  That stack would be harder to replace and if it were taken, It would really hurt the project schedule.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

Offline red

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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2017, 08:43:30 am »
This is a very good strapping kit. For the right applications
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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2017, 03:56:56 pm »
I found with manual tool you can just put thumb pressure on the strap to the wood and it holds great. Between you and the buckle, not on the far side of the buckle. Doesn't seem like it should work, but works well. Don't how corner protectors affect it though.  Also that's with Polly .  (I wish I knew how turn off autocorrect on this fire hd)
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Re: Kubinec strapping trick
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2017, 06:01:11 pm »
After thinking about it, the corner guards change the whole dynamic.  I guess the belaying technique of Bradd_bb is essential.
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