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blades for frozen logs

Started by JB Griffin, January 06, 2017, 09:56:22 AM

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JB Griffin

At work we are having trouble with frozen logs not sawing too good leaving a hump at the front of the log. We're running a Baker Dominator 50hp 3ph and turbo 7 blades. Anyone think that 4deg blades would help on the frozen logs? We only use 7deg blades as 10deg blades are not fast enough or cut flat enough in hardwood.
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota with 6gpm hyd unit, 150 Prentice, WM bms250, Suffolk dual tooth setter

Over 3.5million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator.

Kbeitz

Other people have said the dip at the beginning of a cut is from
the gov. of the engine dropping rpm's until it stables out.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

JB Griffin

With 50hp elec. that drop in rpm is very small.
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota with 6gpm hyd unit, 150 Prentice, WM bms250, Suffolk dual tooth setter

Over 3.5million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator.

Kbeitz

Quote from: JB Griffin on January 06, 2017, 10:30:34 AM
With 50hp elec. that drop in rpm is very small.

It still might pay to check with an rpm meter.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

derhntr

My only issue with 4 degree blades is the amount of saw dust left on boards and the below zero temps caused the boards to freeze to the cant. I also had to enter slower to stop the rise on entry.
2006 Woodmizer LT40HDG28 with command control (I hate walking in sawdust)
US Army National Guard (RET) SFC

Ox

Common thought is 4° blades for frozen logs.  I wouldn't know.  When it's cold out I try not to mill.  I try to hibernate.
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Jim_Rogers

A hump at the beginning of a cut on the cant side is called "blade push off" as the blade is being pushed off the cant. Usually that is a sign that the blade is dull or that the set is not right for the log type.

But it could be just that the ends are hard and frozen.

I use 4° all the time in the winter.

Jim Rogers
Whatever you do, have fun doing it!
Woodmizer 1994 LT30HDG24 with 6' Bed Extension

ChugiakTinkerer

Quote from: Jim_Rogers on January 06, 2017, 12:04:19 PM
...
I use 4° all the time in the winter.

Jim Rogers

Another vote for 4° blades.  Derek at Kasco set up with a box and they are doing fine on frozen cottonwood.
Woodland Mills HM130

Dave Shepard

Turbo 7° have worked well for me. Before that, I used 4°.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

ladylake


  10° rise at the beginning of the cut way worse than 4° in frozen wood.  Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Peter Drouin

WM 7°x55x1¼, With the set push out to 30. Flat going in, cutting flat in the middle and leaving cutting flat. ;D
Hardwood and soft.
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

drobertson

I got that in frozen and half froze logs, mainly when sawing the butt end first though, seems like some blades just do it worse than others, been grinding mine right at 5 degrees and slow the entry a hair, then pour it on, tricky,  bout rather saw froze than half froze,  rather be fishing too!
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Gearbox

Where you live I would bet the log is not frozen all the way through . Its got to be down near zero for a while to freeze them through .
A bunch of chainsaws a BT6870 processer , TC 5 International track skidder and not near enough time

dgdrls


jclvsall

We had the same problem with our Baker 3665D this year.  We run .055  2" blades.  We use exclusively WM 7 turbos.  We found they are not liking the frozen chestnut oak at all.  WM doesn't make a 4 degree blade in 2"width so we have been looking elsewhere.

We have been told 4 degree is the way to go.

We recrowned the wheels yesterday and that seemed to make a difference even with the 7 turbo.  I was able to crank the feed speed pretty good.  I only had issues with 2 of the small diameter white oaks. 

It seems those small diameter frozen logs are quite "hard" to get good cuts. 

Brian
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.  Ben Franklin

JB Griffin

We just got our spare bandwheels back from Baker, got em recrowned and new bearings put in but ain't got em put on yet. I suspect that the recrowned wheels and a alignment wouls do the trick.  Thanks
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota with 6gpm hyd unit, 150 Prentice, WM bms250, Suffolk dual tooth setter

Over 3.5million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator.

JB Griffin

Jclvsall, how do the 2" blade work for ya'll?
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota with 6gpm hyd unit, 150 Prentice, WM bms250, Suffolk dual tooth setter

Over 3.5million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator.

jclvsall

We love the 2" machine.  It would be hard to ever go back to the 1 1/4 or 1 1/2. 

With a sharp blade and everything tuned good I can run at about 1.5fps. 

I generally don't run that fast unless we are pushing to finish a load.

It took a little experimentation to get it to run well.  The blades didnt want to track well when we first got the machine but we figured it out.

What does your Dominator run?  Do you saw toward yourself or away?

Brian
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.  Ben Franklin

MartyParsons

Hello,
   Phone is busy with calls like this. I have found as you have there is something not quite right with the mill. Could be drive belt tension, blade strain or tension. Roller guides worn or bearing tight. Alignment of the mill. ( blade guide arm loose)  When the sawing gets tough ( not sure what word to use here) Frozen, dry, wide and you get the idea.
Good tip. Have a blade that you know worked well hanging on the wall only use it when you have an issue. If it does not work then look at other areas. Review the maintenance section of your manual. I am sure this is not brand specific.

Anyone can saw nice logs!  ::)
As I have posted before the 7 /39 degree or Turbo blade works very well in the tough cutting woods.   If everything is maintained with the mill it will cut. You must have feed rate of the saw head correct. Sawing with a slow feed rate increases sawdust in the cut and creates wash board and many other issues.
I have slowed down the SFM Surface Feet per Min of the blade in extreme conditions when nothing else worked.

I hope this helps. 

Marty
"A pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees opportunity in every difficulty." -Winston Churchill

JB Griffin

Brian we run 1.5 in blades on our Dominator 7deg turbo.  Boss ordered this one set up like a Blue Streak with the saw station at the rear,  to replace the Blue Streak we had. We have had real good luck with these blades, getting 3 sharpenings on average with blade life of 4-6mbf.
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota with 6gpm hyd unit, 150 Prentice, WM bms250, Suffolk dual tooth setter

Over 3.5million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator.

JB Griffin

2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota with 6gpm hyd unit, 150 Prentice, WM bms250, Suffolk dual tooth setter

Over 3.5million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator.

etroup10

A local band manufacturer/sharpener sells notched tooth blades for frozen logs. They require a lot of power to run them but I know guys that swear by them. I have a couple but don't have quite enough power to run them well. I will say they remove sawdust better than any other blade I've used. I can get you their number if you'd like to call. They are Mennonites and I don't think they have a website
NHLA 187th class, lumber inspector. EZ Boardwalk 40 with homemade hydraulics; Gafner Hydraloader; custom built edger, Massey Ferguson 50E, American Sawmill 20" Pony Planer; Husqvarna 55 Rancher

Ox

Notched tooth blade?  This I gotta see.  My curiosity is piqued.  Have you seen one before?  Where is the notch?  How big is it?  Is it a round notch like if you used a chainsaw file?  ???
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Dave Shepard

WM has a new band with big notches. Haven't tried any get.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

MartyParsons

 

 


Here is a picture.

It is made for the ReSaw. Clean cants, less than 8" in width. I have used them for primary brake down and they worked well. This is a 10 degree hook angle and .042 thickness. 1 1/4" width. They have been working on other thickness for testing and have not released these for sale yet.
There is very little sawdust between the cuts.

They can be resharpened with a CBN wheel.

Thanks
Marty
"A pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees opportunity in every difficulty." -Winston Churchill

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