dual tandem trailer ???

[caveman]

Jmoore and I are probably going to buy a trailer from his FIL.  The trailer pulls great but is older and needs a little work (tires, wires, paint, lights etc).  I have been reading that a lot of people have begun using synthetic grease in the axle bearings rather than 90 weight as the manufacturer intended.  The reason given is that when the seals fail, the oil ruins the brakes.  Have any of you had success using synthetic grease for this application?  The trailer's pig tail is currently not attached to the trailer so I do not know if the brakes or lights work or not but I am a fan of trailer brakes on heavy trailers.  Thank you for your suggestions.

  

 

[Gary_C]

I would not be in a hurry to switch an oil bath hub for grease of any kind. Just consider that every semi tractor and trailer on the road is running on oil bath hubs and I'm not so sure you can just convert from an oil bath to wheel bearing greased hubs without replacing the hubs. At any rate, oil bath is a long ago proven technology.

I have a dual tandem goose neck grain trailer and I regret that I did not order oil bath hubs. I already had a set of tires and hub depart the trailer (fortunately unloaded) and wander out in a field by the road. I was lucky I did find the set but it was no fun rolling that set back to the road. I'm sure it was caused by too little grease in the original factory packing job.

On oil bath hubs you can see at a glance if the hub is lubricated, not so with grease packed wheels.

[caveman]

Thank you Gary_C. 

[scsmith42]

I have a set of oil bath's on this trailer and have not had any problems with seal leakage.  (it also has hydraulic disc brakes otherwise I would not have moved the motor grader with it!)



 

If it were me, I would pull all of the hubs, clean the bearings with a clear, fast evaporating solvent such as MEK, acetone or starting fluid, replace the seals and reinstall using a very high quality 90 weight lube.  I've used Lucas or Lubrication Engineers quite successfully in mine.

While the hubs are out I would go through the brakes and make sure that everything is in good working order, wire brush all of the adjusters and relube with anti-seize, replacing brake shoes or electric components as needed.

LED lighting would be my preferred choice for lights.  If the wiring is old I would replace it from end to end, and get rid of any of the clamp type three wire connectors that trailer companies seem to love.  I don't mind crimp connectors, just don't like the clamp type ones. 

That looks like a solid, well built trailer that can offer many years of good service.

[Chuck White]

Also, clean all wiring connections and ground points.

Dielectric grease can be your friend!

[slider]

Amen to Scotts advice on re-wiring the trailer.Those clamp type connectors are going to fail at some point .

[caveman]

Thanks Al, Chuck and Scott.  We discussed the rehab that we will do on this trailer last night.  At the price we are paying for the trailer, there should be enough meat on the bone (old saying) to do some maintenance and still come out ahead of buying a used one off of CL or a new one.  On most of the stuff we wire, we use solder and heat shrink and have had very few wiring issues. 

Plan of attack
1.  add a few receiver hitches (rear and gooseneck), clean, wire brush, prime/paint
2.  axle seals, lube
3.  re-wire, replace lights
4.  brake maintenance
5.  tires



Scott, that grader looks like a load. 

[David Freed]

Years ago I was running synthetic 90w in my trailer wheel hubs. I parked for the night in Omaha, NE.

Apparently, a seal went out just as I arrived because the next morning there was a big puddle on the ground and no oil left in the hub. I cleaned the drum and hub with a couple cans of ether and put Lucas hub oil in.

I was able to drive for 3 days until I got home with no sign of a leak.  8)   I changed the seal and started running Lucas in all my hubs after that.

[caveman]

Update on gooseneck trailer.  We bought the trailer a few weeks ago.  The axles are 10,000 lb Dexters.  We purchased new seals and, oil fill grommets, o rings and clear plastic caps.  The bearings were filled with grease but we cleaned them, cleaned all of the brake parts and reinstalled everything including adding synthetic 90w oil.  Most went smoothly except for the installation of one of the clear plastic caps.  The 4", 12 tpi threads were boogered up.  When screwing the cap into the hub, it would eject the cap after about 3/4 of a turn, messing up the softer plastic threads.  We tried a variety of repairs and not having a 4", 12 tpi tap, I called a friend of mine who has a machine shop at home to ask if he had a suggestion to repair the threads short of pulling the whole assembly and mounting on a lathe to recut the threads.  He suggested using a tap, I think it was about 5/8", 12 tpi and just engaging it in the threads and sliding it in the grooves (threads) to remove the burrs.  It worked like a charm and the plastic cap threaded in by hand just after just a few minutes on doing this.



  I did not take a picture of the repaired threads.  Hopefully this thread repair quick fix will help someone else one day.
We still need to paint, replace a few bulbs and replace some tires but the running gear should be good for now.

[snowstorm]

on the subject of paint. every year i paint the frames and sander bodies on my plow trucks. i have used several different brands of paint none of them stand up to the salt. this year i took a different approach. i used sherwin williams  dura plate 235. i can tell in the spring if its any better. it is different its very thick. and its rated for immersion in salt water. as the paint guy said they paint tug boats with it. on a frame or under a body or trailer it dosent need to be top coated. where the sun will see it yes. it needs to be thined a lot to shoot with a hvlp gun. but a cheap way to shoot it on a frame body ect. i a $20 undercoat gun. very little over spray get it thined rite and it levels out pretty good. it is thick. when you take the lid off the can you would think it was  tar. it needs to go on thick 6to8 mills. and the price is less than a lot of other paints

[YellowHammer]

I had oil bath hubs, loved them.  The key is not to let them sit, the more use, the better.  Back in the old days, oil bath got a bad name for boat trailers, where they would sit for long times, maybe years.  The oil would settle and the exposed metal in the hubs would rust, causing all kinds of problems.  I'm sure you will be using yours enough it keep that from happening.

I always use marine (saltwater) wire when rewiring trailers.  Marine wire is a better grade of wire (tinned copper instead of bare copper), a higher strand content so more duarable and flexible, and the insulation is bonded better so it's more waterproof.  Good stuff.

I would also buy some weld on 4 inch commercial trailer winches and commercial load straps and get away from ratchet straps.  Much stronger, easier to use, and just generally much more better...

Also, remember that the straps must always go inside the rub rail. Never outside.  The rub rail is there to protect the straps in case of a sideswipe accident, where another vehicle inadvertently slides down the side of your trailer, cutting all the straps and in the process and dumping the load. 
I was in such an accident about a year ago, and the rub rails were bent in and scratched for most of the length of the trailer as the opposing car slid down the length of the side of the trailer.  The winch straps suffered damage at all.  The rub rail needed some work, though, as well as a few other things. 

[sawguy21]

Scott, that load would get you parked in a hurry here.

[scsmith42]

Scott, that load would get you parked in a hurry here.

That's why I towed it Saturday night! Lol.

[caveman]

With the lights off for stealth? 

I once hauled a single wide mobile home frame and floor home right through downtown from the other side of the county (our county is about the size of Rhode Island) behind an F-150 on a Sunday morning.  When I got to my house, I had to cut two fences to get it to my shop because I could not make the turns to get through the gates.  The f-150 could have used some turning brakes that morning.

[Larry]

I would also buy some weld on 4 inch commercial trailer winches and commercial load straps and get away from ratchet straps.  Much stronger, easier to use, and just generally much more better...

Also, remember that the straps must always go inside the rub rail. Never outside.  The rub rail is there to protect the straps in case of a sideswipe accident, where another vehicle inadvertently slides down the side of your trailer, cutting all the straps and in the process and dumping the load. 

The best thing I did when I bought my trailer was to add the winches.  When you buy the straps get some of the protector sleeves also.  Now is the time to do it before it gets painted.

DOT likes to see the buckles inside the rub rail also or else.....

[caveman]

I think we will purchase some of the weld on winches.  I have been looking for pictures of them installed on similar trailers and have not found any.  Should I weld them onto bottom of the 6" channel on the driver's side of the trailer?  Yesterday we installed the pigtail but had to extend it a few feet and added a weather proof electrical box on the trailer tongue as a junction box.  Most of the lights worked with a couple of passenger side marker lights and the right side brake/blinkers being the exception.  The brake wiring was still in good shape so we left it alone but decided to rewire all of the lights and replace a couple of the rear lights and all of the rubber light grommets on the rear.

We had just left to go get wire to do the lights when I remembered some wire that I had stashed away.  It was 4-wire, direct burial, tinned and stranded copper wire.  The colors were not right but the quality is exceptional and the price was right so it was pulled through the trailer's conduit and soldered to all of the light wires.  We should finish up the wiring this morning.

I was afraid that we were going to have to replace some or all of the brake magnets but after adjusting the brakes up a couple of times the trailer's brakes work well.  We still have some things to do but after today, the trailer will be usable and relatively legal (still needs a few tires replaced).

Thank you for the suggestion to put the straps inside of the rub rails.  Since it was mentioned, I have been noticing the straps used on flatbed semi trailers and the placement of the straps.  Most seem to be on sliding rails and at least half of the loads I have seen have been strapped outside of the rails.  It never ceases to amaze me how much knowledge the members of the FF have about such a variety of subjects.

[caveman]

Update on the trailer.  The running gear has been gone through and works well.  Yesterday my 12 year old daughter and I pulled the deck off.  That took about 45 minutes due to some of the hardware being rusted to the point of not being able to be extracted using the proper methods.  The rest of the afternoon was spent wearing out a couple of cup wheels and another knotted wire wheel removing rust.  Today, after selling some live oak boards, JMoore and I removed the rest of the rust.  I pressure washed the trailer and then sprayed and brushed P2S04 (phosphoric acid) on to treat the rust.

If the price is right, we will deck it with CCA pine 2"x12"'s.  The lumber yard was organizing their office today and did not have access to their computers to give us a price.  If they can provide it for around $1 a bf we will likely buy the wood to do the deck.  If it costs

   much more we may look to use live oak.  It still needs paint, tires and a little welding.
I got my left arm a little too close to the wire wheel yesterday, JMoore did the same today.   

  I might eventually rival MagicMan in the OOPS/injury column if I keep going at this rate.

[scsmith42]

Tough call between live oak and PT pine.  Live oak weighs more, but is tougher and not as slippery when wet as the pine.

[bill m]

I would install the winches on the passenger side. That way you are away from traffic when you are binding down your load.

[YellowHammer]

I think we will purchase some of the weld on winches.  I have been looking for pictures of them installed on similar trailers and have not found any.  Should I weld them onto bottom of the 6" channel on the driver's side of the trailer? 

You can either weld winch tracks onto the channel so the winches can slide, or simply weld the winches onto the channel.  I much prefer the strength of the direct weld on winches.  Main thing is to weld them under the channel, and make sure they will not protrude further than the outside of the trailer fully loaded with the winch straps.  Also, don't weld the ends of the winch frame as it will rack the winch and make it harder to turn.  I highly recommend welding the winches before running the wiring harness, or you run the risk of melting the wire.  However, I have successfully welded on winches where I used a garden hose and flooded the inside of the channel with water to keep the wire cool. 

[caveman]

The wire has been run but all of it is on the passenger side except for the marker lights on the driver's side.  I can weld the winches on without melting the wires.  This trailer project will cost us a bit of money but we should come out okay on it.  I will call about paint next week before we decide which paint to go with.  I appreciate the suggestions mentioned about winches, oil and paint. I have a busy week next week but hopefully some progress can be made.

Normally I apply the Ospho with a brush or a hand held spray bottle but today I used a HVLP spray gun set at 30-40 psi and it worked well. 

[caveman]

We ended up using the Sherwin Williams 646 two part epoxy.  It is sold in two, one gallon cans and we also purchased a gallon of reducer to thin it to spray it through a Harbor Fright  : syphon spray gun with a 2mm tip.  It sprayed but it did not spray nearly as well as auto paint or an oil based paint.  It dried hard with no tackiness.

We decked the trailer with PT pine, made a step, made and installed a receiver hitch on the gooseneck, mounted a Greenlee toolbox on the neck, reinstalled the lights, and made it more conspicuous.

I had a line on some Greenball Transmaster tires but after reading some reviews on them, we decided to hold off on purchasing new tires.  We did replace the three worst ones with some others I had.

  

 
I appreciate the guidance provided on our trailer project.  Which heavy duty 16" tires are providing good service at a reasonable cost?  The ones we have on now are 7.50x16" bias ply.  Last spring I put radials on my equipment trailer but I am not sure I like them as well as the bias tires yet.

[scsmith42]

I've switched all of my trailers to Maxiss Commercial LT tires (Load rage E). About three years in and no failures, which is more than I can say for all of their predecessors.

They are not cheap, but are worth it due to their longevity.

I run them at maximum pressure all the time (80 psi), and they frequently operate at maximum recommended loading.

[rasman57]

Nice work on that trailer project.   You did it right and will appreciate the effort and expense down the road.  Looking great!

[caveman]

Thank you.  We still need to paint the wheels but will probably hold off until I repaint my bumper-pull trailer or when we get new tires (I don't want to take all of the tires off of the wheels to paint them and then put old tires back on newly painted wheels).