Sawing Painted salvage beams questions?

[Jim_Rogers]

I am currently doing a job where I'm re-sizing some painted salvage beams, after de-nailing them.
They are, at least I was told, long leaf pine beams.
The problem I'm having is that I'm only getting one cut per sharp blade and then the blade is too dull to continue.
I've guessed that it's because I'm sawing threw the paint, as I'm not hitting any nails or hardware.
I'm currently using a .045 blade with 10/30 profile with a 19 to 21° set.
My question: Is there another profile or set that would work better?
What other blade could I use? Carbide tipped?
Where can I buy some carbide tipped blades for a WM?
Thanks for you help and advice.
Jim Rogers
Jim Rogers Sawmill
Georgetown, Ma

[fabrik]

My advise is to try a stellite or carbide tipped band. I've used carbon steel and silicone steel bands on my 36" Oliver vertical bandsaw and they don't last long cutting seasoned wood. Standard blades are basically designed for sawing green or near green lumber. Their kerf and hook are designed for that purpose. There are reasonably priced narrow bands (1 1/4", 1 1/2") that are used for pallet dismantling (hard tips that will hold up to hitting an occasional piece of hardware). All of your pro band dealers can help you. A couple name brands are Symonds and Laguna Tools has a stellite tipped band from Europe that is reasonably priced. And one thing nice about them, they're resharpenable and retippable (weird word!) if the band hasn't been fatiqued.

[Jim_Rogers]

Thanks for your advice.
What I'm looking for is a dealer or company that sells these type blades. A link to a web-page or an 800 number so I can call them and order some, if the customer whats me to continue to the next phase of the job.
That is re-milling these beams into flooring for the house.
Jim Rogers
PS ( I haven't called WM yet as I didn't think they sold them).

[Jeff]

You might try Menominee. They might have them, and if they dont, they can tell you where to get them.

[Murf]

Not that I have much clue about the sablades, but when I have that problem with used lumber in my planer I use a very aggressive disk on a big angle grinder.

I have some big nasty discs that are so rough they don't even clog with the old paint, it is messy though, the sort of thing you want to do outside on a breezy day.

[Jim_Rogers]

Thanks Jeff.
I guess I should have just looked at the left side of my screen, hey.
I went to their site and filled out a "Information request form"
and hopefully they will be able to help me.
If I don't hear from them in a day or so, I'll call them.
Murf: thanks for that tip, I'll pass it on to the fellow who has to plane them, maybe he has an angle grinder already.
What type of disk should he look for?
Jim Rogers

[shopteacher]

A friend of mine use to resaw gluelam and microlam beams for a forestry products company. He told me he use to get his blades from DoAll.  They're mainly a metal cutting blade, but apparently worked when cutting through all that glue. Just a thought.

[beenthere]

If DoAll makes a blade with teeth for wood, it should work. But a blade with teeth for cutting metal will not, IMO.

[Had an experience once with True Temper (before being ought out by Wilkinson Sword), and working with hickory axe handle blanks. We were looking at internal defects that would end up lowering the strength of handles if they ended up in the critical strength areas, and they were trying to rip them open with metal cutting DoAll bandsaws. Surprisingly slow, at best.]

[Brad_S.]

Jim,
I've had to resaw timbers on my bandmill. My first mill didn't have a debarker, the second does. It makes all the difference. Perhaps you could just use the grinder to clear a narrow path for your blade entry. I never tried carbide, but my guess is it would slow but not prevent the inevitable, and sharpening would be more expensive. That's just speculation, though.

I can deal with paint, it's the pitch in those things that frustrates me! :D

[Murf]

Jim, Murphy's Law strikes again, I don't have any in packaging still, but they are an open mesh.

Sort of like a Scotch-Brite pad, but in a disc format, they are VERY open kind of like a hard pot scrubber squished flat and made into a disc, the open mesh format is what makes them work, anything else just clogs with paint in seconds and is useless.

I can lay out a plank or beam and just walk along it with the grinder and it leaves a clean strip about 3" wide with each pass. Once the paint is gone it just like working with any other wood.

You might also want to look into the stuff the wood floor guys use, it's much the same.

I just found it easier to grind away the paint than try to cut through it.

[Kelvin]

I'm looking at sawming old oak barn beams.  Would ;you suggest the pallet dismanteling blades?  CAn i sharpen on my WM band sharpener?  I'm worried about all that sand and dirt blown into the checks.  Whats a good set?  THinner?  9 degree?  4 degree?  Anybody?
Thanks
kelvin

[Jim_Rogers]

Murf:
Where did you get those disks? What type of store? Welding supply or auto body supply?
I can find any store if I know what type to look for.
Thanks for all your advice.
Jim Rogers

[gmmills]

Jim,  
   Can't comment on the paint causing you the premature blade dulling. If those beams are as dry as a think they are the 10/30 profile is too agressive  for the hardness of the wood. Even though the beams are supposedly pine. The extreme dryness of the wood will make it cut hardwood.  You may want to try a less agressive 4 deg hook angle. I use them when I cut frozen hardwood.  Call WM and see if you can get a trail blade.  

   Gary

[Buzz-sawyer]

Just a thought..........that may be lead paint...it will make you crazy as a pet coon if you breath it...its deadly poison

[Jim_Rogers]

Thanks to all for all your advice.
Buzz, I took precautions, and the customer is responsible for sawdust disposal.
Jim Rogers

[Buzz-sawyer]

Good deal.....hey we gotta watch out for ourselves

[Murf]

Jim, I get them at an industrial supply place, they are for stripping paint, rust and debris.

I called the place I get them and was told they are made by 3M and any place that sells "Scotch-Brite" products should be able to order them.

I have also, in a pinch, used the 'cheese-grater' type discs, basically a circular wood rasp, but they are way too aggressive for me, they certainly do remove material though.  

[Jim_Rogers]

Jeff:
It's been several business days since I filled out and sent in a request for info to the sponsor you suggested, and I haven't heard a word by phone or email.
Do you know if they check their emails regularly?
Some companies don't do a lot of internet business, and don't have an internet rep, but if that's the case why do these guys have a request for info forum on their site?
I don't want to say anything bad about them I just want to understand how they do business so I can get some info.
If they don't have what I need or something that will work, then ok, just tell me and I'll continue to look else where.

Does anyone know of a company that sells carbide tip blades?
Some one out there must have bought them before?

Jim Rogers
Jim Rogers Sawmill
Georgetown, Ma

[Bro. Noble]

Jim,

There are a lot of free trade magazines------about all advertisements.  There are ads in these for tipped blades.  I don't have one nowbut maybe one of the other members does.  

As soon as they arrive in the mail I will send you websites both for the blades and the magazines.

I'll make a post on the magazine addresses------I figured about everyone gets them,  but maybe not.

[raycon]

Maybe check out McMaster Carr seacrh "band saw blade"
they offer a carbide bands looks expensive. The steel cutting bands you can get in coils down side is you  need a band welder. My DoAll band saw has  welder but it only goes up to an inch in width.
All the shop catalogs I have sell the blades in coils and you need the welder /annealer or access to one to keep it cost effective.

http://www.mcmaster.com/

[Fla._Deadheader]

  Have you tried Suffolk Machine,. in NYCity??? That have all kinds of blades .

[Bro. Noble]

Jim,

The free trade magazines started arriving in the mail today.  I'll make a post in the 'general ' section listing some of them,

The 'American Lumber and Pallet'  magazine lists 'Saw Service and Supply Inc."  as selling bi-metal blades for pallet dismanteling.  phone 800-735-5604,  e-mail sawservice@aol.com

also:

Blums Saw Inc.  has stellite tipped bandsaw blades.  Phone 800-664-6168,  e-mail wblum@earthlink.net

And:

Country Saw and Knife Inc.    carbide tipped blades.
1-800-253-7379   www.countrysaw.com

[rick3ddd]

I don't think the paint is an issue at all in your problems. We saw antique lumber as our business and use 1-1/4" 7/8 pitch Simonds Red Streak blades with a .025" set. We do a lot of heart pine and the wood is just tough on blades. It's worse than doing green oak by far. We sharpen our own blades with a Wright grinder but any of the ones on the market will work fine. You don't need stellite or carbide blades. We use diesel fuel for a lubricant.