Husky brush cutters

[LeeB]

I know they aren't chainsaws, but anyone have an opinion on the differences between a 525RX and a 323R brush cutter?

[joe_indi]

I think the 323R is an older gen 24-25cc regular 2 stroke. The 525RX is a newer gen XTORQ 2stroke. The R denotes that they both have bike handles and are good for professional work. I might be wrong since I don't have any handy brochure to refer to right now

[LeeB]

Thanks Joe.
Didn't get many replies on this one. I'll try one more question. Any opinions on a choice between the 525RX and the 336FR. I considered the Stihl FS 240 or the FS 310 but I guess I just partial to husqvarnas.

[coppice]

What kind of brush are you planning to cut and with what sort of cutting attachment? 

26cc will happily spin line and a saw blade on small stuff - finger-size saplings, for example.  But if you are planning to cut larger, denser brush using a tri-blade, more power will come in handy.  I had really good luck with the old Stihl FS200 (predecessor to FS250 and then 310) clearing scrub and invasives (ailanthus, buckthorn, honeysuckle, grape vines, etc.) up to 3" diameter.  In smaller material, this machine was overkill, but in the larger stuff a 26cc machine would be tedious.

[joe_indi]

Have a look at the FS120 and whatever has currently in place of the 333R. Both are bigger than the 25cc range, 1.8hp (I think), good for heavier bushes, both in the >30cc category.

[LeeB]

Thanks for your replies guys. I ordered a 336FR. I'll give reviews when it comes in. I was tempted by the 525RX but decided to go with a little more umph.

[SawTroll]

What kind of brush are you planning to cut and with what sort of cutting attachment? 

26cc will happily spin line and a saw blade on small stuff - finger-size saplings, for example.  But if you are planning to cut larger, denser brush using a tri-blade, more power will come in handy.  I had really good luck with the old Stihl FS200 (predecessor to FS250 and then 310) clearing scrub and invasives (ailanthus, buckthorn, honeysuckle, grape vines, etc.) up to 3" diameter.  In smaller material, this machine was overkill, but in the larger stuff a 26cc machine would be tedious.

I have been very happy with my FS200 as well (with one exception), and agree on going with at least 35cc or so for anything more demanding than lawn type grass. If memory serves, the FS360 is the closest replacement in todays Stihl model line-up.

The exception mentioned above is the vibes, that my arthritis riddled hands doesn't like (I need to use a thick glove on the right hand). I don't know how the newer Stihls are in that respect.

The 336FR no doubt will do the jobb, but I would have opted for the 535RXT for a better harness, less vibes and a little more power (than the 336). Both are "strato" though.

[LeeB]

As far as I could tell, the 535RXT is not available here. I would have rather had it also. The 545 is available but I just wasn't ready to lay out that much cash at the moment. No matter now. I've already ordered the 336FR.

[LeeB]

Went and picked it up yesterday evening. Gave it a short try down at the cow pasture gate on the way home but my back is too screwed up right at the moment for an extended run. Has plenty of power. Only tried out the string trimmer for now. The stuff at the gate is/was  pretty rough and tough and really should have used the blade. It did ok though. It will for sure need to be used with the harness as it is not particularly well balanced, being heavy toward the engine end.

[DeerMeadowFarm]

I have the 555FX clearing saw and I love it. I bought it to reach the goals of my NCRS contract to remove invasive species.

[Mogg]

I've just got a Husky 135R, very happy with it, plenty of power, string line tackles most light undergrowth, tri-blade very good on thicker stuff.  Do need the harness tho, 'tis a heavyish beast.

[LeeB]

So far I've been real happy with the 336XR. Haven't used the string as much as I have the tri blade. The blade does great in heavy weeds and small brush up to about 3/4". The saw blade if great for anything over that up to about 3". You do have to watch it though on the bigger stuff because it is kinda grabby and it cuts fast. X2 on the harness. I wouldn't want to run it without. Takes a little getting used to on the hand placement for starting with the handlebar controls.

[Ox]

I have the 555FX clearing saw and I love it. I bought it to reach the goals of my NCRS contract to remove invasive species.

Please share what NCRS stands for?  Does removing these invasive species involve whacking them down before they go to seed?

[pine]

Please share what NCRS stands for?  Does removing these invasive species involve whacking them down before they go to seed?

Natural Resources Conservation Service

Yes it can; and so much more but is not just standalone but requires a comprehensive plan.

[Ox]

Thanks for that info.  Is this contract a paying one (you're an employee) or a contract that is forced and you as a landowner are responsible for?

[pine]

The NRCS EQIP contract is a cost share contract. 
I am not certain I follow your question on it being a paying one where you're an employee or one that is forced on you and thus are responsible for. 
You are responsible for ensuring the work is accomplished and you are reimbursed (paid) for the cost share amount. Nothing is forced upon you.  Matter of fact you have to apply and you are ranked with other applicants and you only get funded if you rise up high enough in the heap to get funded.  There is a finite amount a money available.

You enter into a contract to accomplish specific forest practices.  There is also a version for agricultural practices but that is not my bailiwick. Those forest practices are to be accomplished on a specified and agreed upon timetable.  Once the practice is accomplished the NRCS rep inspects to verify it and then pays the contractual cost share amount.

I find that it is a good deal. 
Removal of unwanted competing vegetation is one of the items that can be line itemed.

I used a Stihl FS 450 for years doing a lot of the work by hand with the chisel and the tri blade.  I still use it but have now also acquired a FECON forestry mulcher  which I use as well.   NRCS does not specify what equipment you use.

[Ox]

Gotcha, thanks. 

[CTYank]

Been doing a bit of reclamation at local Audubon preserves. No shortage of multiflora rose/privet/barberry/porcelain-berry, some in tangles up to ~10' high. We've experimented with tools & tactics, and found:

It's easiest overall to effectively mulch everything in place, cutting it progressively downward in small pieces. Has the same effect as forestry mulcher. Often done in three (or two) stages.

Bringing anything above thigh-height down to there is best done with polesaw, 12" b&c, with Granberg "Clip-N-Trim" bolt-on attachment, so it fundtions as an enraged hedge-clipper. Cuts stems up to 1" diam.

Then best tool is Husqy 525ls brushcutter with Husqy 12" 3-knife, or 20-tooth carbide blade. Alternately, a 21 cc Echo trimmer/brushcutter from the '70s can get that done with 10" 3-knife or 20-tooth carbide. Both are D-handle, thus flexible in vertical movement. This stage takes it down to shin-height or all-the-way. If going all the way, good to wait a few days, so what resprouts can be whacked.

In some hard cases, with really thick lower stems or vines, the final whack can be administered with a 9" chainsaw-cutter blade in a 27 cc bike-handle Tanaka brushcutter. Face shield required, or swallow chips.

Once we get some avenues opened into the thickest site, to speed it up, we're looking to iteratively clear 6' swaths alongside, down low enough so rocks and logs can be spotted, then finish them off with a DR mower. For the brushcutting part, we've found that weight of the brushcutter is the critical parameter, having major impact on operator endurance. And, 25-27 cc brushcutters have more than enough power for our purposes, with the right, sharp blades. (Those Tanaka and Husqy engines are workaholics.)

[newforest]

I'll just bump this thread as I am in the process of updating my fleet of clearing saws / brush cutters.

I still run a Husqy 245. It is solid with great compression still, 12 years after I bought it, maybe a few more. That is mostly because I left it as a back-up saw to my 3 copies of the Husqy 345Fx. I did update the throttle cable on the 245 to a newer design.

The 345s were fairly good in service. Once the Ethanol disaster hit they became frustrating. As I replaced one rubber part of the fuel system I would learn a month or three later that another part of the system existed and now it had a pinhole somewhere making it impossible to tune the saw. I could never talk a shop into just helping me replace the entire fuel system at once. I should have done it myself but I realized that too late. By this point however I have worn the saws out and compression is down below 50% of new.

I would say the paddle trigger design Husqvarna uses is a weak point. It is not hard to use but it is easy to break. If a little too much force hits that paddle a little too quickly, the spring inside will pop. A lot of fine dexterity motor skills work to repair the system --- if the throttle cable doesn't simply get too stretched to repair.

I much prefer the Stihl trigger design and have wanted an FS560 for a long time. Four model years into the M-Tronic fuel system, these should be perfectly dialed in now. Downsides of the machine to me were the 3 lbs of extra weight over the similar Husqy model, and a few hundred more in costs up-front. I heard the harness was not as good as the newly updated Husqy "Balance XT" design but that was OK as I just bought two of those new early this year, hardly used. So I didn't actually need the Stihl harness...

...which was good because they didn't even bother to include their own "Forestry" harness, just their 'Universal' harness. The difference is the Forestry harness has a buckle across your chest to help distribute the weight, which would have been very helpful for a 23 lb machine. The Universal harness is not so good for a heavy duty clearing saw, though you can use it if you have to. It made it much more difficult to lift the saw for things like nipping off a low branch, etc. If you order an FS 560 I would insist that Stihl include the Forestry harness - why do they even make such a harness if they don't include it with their heaviest saw? Makes zero sense.

(And by the way I believe the FS 560 is their second most expensive item in the entire Stihl line around $1400 US - so they should get the details right).

Meanwhile I didn't totally want to walk away from decades of using Husqy products. I just bought a 550XP and a 562XP (chainsaws) this summer and I like them both very well so far. But it hasn't seemed like they have been updating their brush saws lately - in particular they have not created a brush / clearing saw with their "AutoTune" technology which is the future of 2-stroke engines. Just recently I finally learned of their 555 clearing saw. Similar cc engine to the Stihl. Upsides are 3 lbs less weight and about $200 less up-front. Downsides are still the paddle trigger.

But the FS 560 has a solid reputation from what I can tell and I wanted something that worked out of the box. A big problem with buying clearing saws in the USA is that most dealers have never seen one. They vaguely know they exist, but that is it. So I went with the 560 for now, with vague thoughts of picking up a 555 next before deciding what to buy for a 3rd and 4th as I hope to re-build a crew running these in the next few years. The work is there for them if I want it.

Aside from the BS with the weak harness, I am headed back to the dealer for a 3rd time tomorrow to ask for a refund or a new saw. The 560 I have has an assembly defect, in my opinion. I do not believe the entire saw should shake violently as you load it up into a cut on a 5" Pine. Perhaps there is something I don't understand about breaking in the M-Tronic module and things have to seat-in by running them in or something, but I doubt it. As you load up the RPMs the stability of the saw should smooth out from the shakiness at idle. Instead this turd of a saw I have increases in vibration. The head has already slipped down some showing a shinier metal even though it is tightened down with a lot of torque (more than I can easily put on it with the included hand-held wrench without really really working on it). It gets hot to the touch after 15 minutes as well. There is no way this saw is going to last shaking this hard in a cut and I feel the shaft isn't seated properly.

But my local Stihl dealer, who has never even seen one of these saws before my purchase, disagrees. He is willing to have his company rep take a look and consult with the factory, but I need to work.....

.....I think a Husqy 555 is in my future if I can get my money back from the Germans for a while. I hope.

I look forward to running a properly constructed 560 as soon as possible. We'll see.

[SwampDonkey]

First off when we buy a 560 we get the forestry harness, no other, because they are the pro saw. But I don't like them, others do. They are not as touch a harnass as a Husqvarna one. The rivet system holding the hook on the pad is a pour design from the get go. It simply fulls through in maybe 3 or 4 weeks of working 40 hrs a week. It also will rub me raw, others it has as well and some not.

As far as the saw, I don't know what vibration your getting, but it should not be a violent one. Never experienced that and we use a lot of these saws on the crew. One thing though, and on any of the brands, the spark arrester will choke the saw for air within a couple days. There is no man I know going to clean a spark arrester twice a day. That sucker comes out from the get go.

One week point is the handle bar bolt, way under sized, but they are just as week on the Husqvarnas according to the guys running them. The bolt on the 550 was 3/4 and never broke, in fact the tower it attached to would crack after years of use and that bolt never flinched. But I do like the handle bar being one piece now.

When cutting bigger stems and clumps, feed the blade into the wood, don't swing the saw like a sythe.

[pine]

One thing though, and on any of the brands, the spark arrester will choke the saw for air within a couple days. There is no man I know going to clean a spark arrester twice a day. That sucker comes out from the get go.

The DNR folks will fine the operator if they catch you running a saw in the woods without the required spark arrestor out here. 

It surprises me that you seem to have to clean the arrestor twice a day.  I find that I first notice the reduction in power at about 40-45 hours and do a cleaning at that time.  Most of the time I have a spare clean one in my kit if I have to swap it out.   

Mostly do it at the shop at end of week.  A small propane torch does a great job and it is just like new again.

It would be interesting to know what causes your cleaning cycle. 

[SwampDonkey]

No one checks here even if required. There is no fine either. DNR or company can ask you to leave the job site, but they can't fine anyone over a spark arrester. I thin anywhere from 75-120 acres a year since I mark out land with GPS as well, never even a close call of a fire with a saw.

I know someone on the crew that just bought a new saw, run it 2 days now and no power, not enough air. Not happy at all. Guess what's gonna happen?

[newforest]

Yes I would be in contract violation to run saws without a spark screen.

I would say that on the FS 560 it looks to be pretty deep in there.

On my Husqys I have only ever needed to clean them annually. I run the highest octane no-ethanol I can find and Stihl HP Ultra mix oil.


The only time I would ever swing a clearing saw is in heavy Raspberry/Blackberry. I use them with a great deal of finesse - I would say that a point I don't like about the 560 is the extra hardware around the locking nut under the blade, I don't see a need for that and it just hangs up more than the Husqy design. I cut very low on deciduous work, the foresters are impressed as compared to Hispanic production crews. I am currently cutting Scotch Pine out of Red Pine and have to cut very low on the Scotch as it likes to set buds at ground level and grow shoots up through the dirt. You have to actually wait a few years to cut that species for some of those to shade out.

My 14 year old Husqy 245 is nearly 5x smoother in operation than this new FS 560. I have a hard time believing that is the best Stihl can do, though that is what the dealer suggests. I think the saw is going to destroy the shaft and/or clutch in short order, most likely because it was made on a Monday morning or Friday afternoon back in Germany (rare item not manufactured here in the Stihl USA line). I have just never had a 2-stroke engine in my hands with this much wobble.

The Stihl rep says they sell "a lot" of those saws but I have never yet been in a shop that knows what they are or has one in stock. As I run Stihl oil in my travels, I have been in plenty of Stihl shops that have never heard of them. I suspect the rep has never run one either, and it was his idea to put in the "Universal" harness thinking that because it is more expensive than the "Forestry" harness it is automatically better.



Next up, blades - what is the latest news there?

I can't see anywhere that sells the Stihl blades ending in part # 4207.

I have run their #4204 blades for many years. My Husqy blades were always cracking very, very quickly, and that is not acceptable in a clearing saw blade. The Stihl 4204 is currently made in Japan however, not Sweden.

On my old 245 I have a blade from Carlton/Windsor that is the best I have ever run. I think it was made in Sweden. It does have those U-shaped gullets in front of the teeth, unlike the "Maxi" blades.

I would like to order some of those "Maxi" style blades, if I can ... ???

[SwampDonkey]

That nut guard is always removed when we run them. I've run them with it on, but it's just something to fiddle with when replacing blades. I found it is somewhat useful in rocky ground. The spark arrester screws in, easily taken out. On my old 550 I put in a SS drain screen, which allowed good air flow, never clogged.

They do sell a lot of them saws, but in Canada and Europe mostly. And sales are way down because budgets are slimmer and less ground to thin than 20 years ago.

We are suppose to keep stumps 6" or shorter, that's what I aim for. And our perimeter can't be brushed into adjacent woods or trees hung up all over to the point it bends crop tree tops.

I run the best gas you can get and Stihl or Husqvarna XP mix oil.

Maybe the air is different up here causing it to plug quicker, but we have run brush saws for a long time in this part of the country.  Encounter a problem and we find the easiest solution I guess, and never have lost a tree to a fire, just a sharp bade. ;D

My Maxi blades by Stihl are Japanese, but all the other brands are Swede. I can't cut 6" butted fir with U shape gullet blades. ;D

[SwampDonkey]