Synthetic Oil

[Stihlowner]

I told a friend about a synthetic oil for his saw.
One mix for any 2 cycle engine.
71/1
He has been using it for about two weeks now and said the saw doesn't have exhaust smoke anymore and the engine revs up better and runs a lot smoother.
I told him I have been using it for over 15 years in all my 2 cycle engines and that was enough for him to try it.
He was a little worried about the gas oil ratio but said if your engines have run on it that long it must be pretty good stuff.
No need for gas stabilizer either because it's already in the oil.

[Gearbox]

I use Amzoil Saber at 50/1 . A plus is that the mosquitos leave when you start the saw and don't come back .

[Stihlowner]

That is a good thing!!!

[Stihlowner]

I use Amzoil Saber at 50/1 . A plus is that the mosquitos leave when you start the saw and don't come back .

You should never have an oil problem at 50/1 if that is the oil that I'm thinking about.
I believe that oil is recommended for a 100/1 mix.
Factory tested at 400/1 with no problems.
Some day people will be adding oil to the gas with an eye dropper.
Old days we poured in a whole can, someday in the future we will just add a few drops.

[Gearbox]

That's what it say's 100/1 . But I am old school

[gspren]

  Stihlowner, what brand are you talking about?

[Stihlowner]

Amsoil Saber Professional  100/1

I have been using OPTI-2 for over 15 years  71/1

[Al_Smith]

Do I detect a new player in the ever present oil wars per chance? If so a few questions .

Firstly how does one go about measuring precisely 71 to 1? Rather odd ratio I would think .Secondly why in the world would anybody make a claim that a ratio of 400 to 1 would provide any protection what so ever ?  ???

[ZeroJunk]

Also, what is the point ? Are you actually going to save enough money to make a flip in the scheme of things ? I can't detect any smoke at even 32 to 1. Maybe I'm just blind.

[weimedog]

Do I detect a new player in the ever present oil wars per chance? If so a few questions .

Firstly how does one go about measuring precisely 71 to 1? Rather odd ratio I would think .Secondly why in the world would anybody make a claim that a ratio of 400 to 1 would provide any protection what so ever ?  ???

You do know these boards do prove that those pesky trolls are alive and well...

[sawguy21]

Metric  ;D

[thecfarm]

Come on Al,I see nothing a matter with 400:1. As long as it's not my saw that is tuned to 40:1.  ;D I would gladly do a trial with someone else's saw. Might take a couple years to get the results.

[Stihlowner]

Do I detect a new player in the ever present oil wars per chance? If so a few questions .

Firstly how does one go about measuring precisely 71 to 1? Rather odd ratio I would think .Secondly why in the world would anybody make a claim that a ratio of 400 to 1 would provide any protection what so ever ?  ???

OPTI-2 can be bought in many different size containers.
I use the 1.8 oz pouch for a small batch.
I pouch per gallon of gas will make a 71/1 mixture.

I didn't make the claim that the oil was tested at 400/1 and performed well.
Amsoil did so you should send them a email and ask them.
Please post their response.

[Al_Smith]

 :D I'm slow on the take up but I think I've got it .About like a dry martini ,you just dump in the gin and whisper vermouth over it .---- Soak a q-tip in oil and drop it  in a 5 gallon can of gasoline  and call it a day .

[Stihlowner]

Also, what is the point ? Are you actually going to save enough money to make a flip in the scheme of things ? I can't detect any smoke at even 32 to 1. Maybe I'm just blind.

Money is not the point but since the gas stabilizer is in the oil I don't have to but it anymore.
The point is OPTI-2 can be used in any 2 stroke engine  no matter how old or new.
This way I just have one can with 2 cycle mix for my chainsaw, snowmobile, weed eater and my outboard.
Some of those engines called for a different mix using conventional 2 cycle oil.
The new synthetic oils with the leaner mix make life simple with just one gas can with one mix and the engines run better.
Carbon build up is a thing of the past.
I had to change the spark plug in the snowmobile several times in a season.
The plug in it has been in it for years now using this oil.
Noticed a rpm gain in the snowmobile since using it.
Can't say on the others because they don't have tachs on them.

[Al_Smith]

I've got 2 cycle engines spanning over 50 years and they  run just fine on 32 or 40 to one .Being such a modern guy I even ran a now two year old Stihl weed wacker on 50  to one .Of course they had thrown in a little 6 pack of Stihl ultra in the deal when I bought it . I think I've got 3 bottles of it left .

Funny I mixed a jug of gas up at 32 to one with ultra and it didn't smoke on the Stihl weed wacker, nor the Stihl blowers nor on a 40 year old McCulloch chainsaw .You don't suppose it might have something to do with the carb setting do you ? 8) Oh I do love the great oil debate .

[Stihlowner]

I've got 2 cycle engines spanning over 50 years and they  run just fine on 32 or 40 to one .Being such a modern guy I even ran a now two year old Stihl weed wacker on 50  to one .Of course they had thrown in a little 6 pack of Stihl ultra in the deal when I bought it . I think I've got 3 bottles of it left .

Funny I mixed a jug of gas up at 32 to one with ultra and it didn't smoke on the Stihl weed wacker, nor the Stihl blowers nor on a 40 year old McCulloch chainsaw .You don't suppose it might have something to do with the carb setting do you ? 8) Oh I do love the great oil debate .

That's great!!!

[Stihlowner]

I've got 2 cycle engines spanning over 50 years and they  run just fine on 32 or 40 to one .Being such a modern guy I even ran a now two year old Stihl weed wacker on 50  to one .Of course they had thrown in a little 6 pack of Stihl ultra in the deal when I bought it . I think I've got 3 bottles of it left .

Funny I mixed a jug of gas up at 32 to one with ultra and it didn't smoke on the Stihl weed wacker, nor the Stihl blowers nor on a 40 year old McCulloch chainsaw .You don't suppose it might have something to do with the carb setting do you ? 8) Oh I do love the great oil debate .

[Jeff]

Okay, if you must use the quote function, please learn how.  Put your respones OUTSIDE of the quote tags. It's aggravating as all get out to try and read anything, and because I am here to check on a report to moderator email, I couldn't give a rip about it now.

[Gearbox]

I won't get into a oil debate . I just know the mosquitos don't bite when I run 50/1 Saber and that's a good enough for me to keep using it .

[Stihlowner]

Okay, if you must use the quote function, please learn how.  Put your respones OUTSIDE of the quote tags. It's aggravating as all get out to try and read anything, and because I am here to check on a report to moderator email, I couldn't give a rip about it now.

Sorry I wrecked your night.

[Stihlowner]

No smoke is a good thing

[Stihlowner]

I've got 2 cycle engines spanning over 50 years and they  run just fine on 32 or 40 to one .Being such a modern guy I even ran a now two year old Stihl weed wacker on 50  to one .Of course they had thrown in a little 6 pack of Stihl ultra in the deal when I bought it . I think I've got 3 bottles of it left .

Funny I mixed a jug of gas up at 32 to one with ultra and it didn't smoke on the Stihl weed wacker, nor the Stihl blowers nor on a 40 year old McCulloch chainsaw .You don't suppose it might have something to do with the carb setting do you ? 8) Oh I do love the great oil debate .
[/QUOTE]


That's great!!! No smoke is a good thing.
My snowmobile always left a trail of blue smoke at 32/1, recommended mix and the outboard also always had some exhaust smoke.
Not a bit of smoke from either of them now with the synthetic oil at the leaner mix.
My posts were not intended to tell anyone to change what they are doing.
I just posted info and results of using different products.
I do find that a few on here have a problem with people trying different products and posting the results.

[Stihlowner]

I won't get into a oil debate . I just know the mosquitos don't bite when I run 50/1 Saber and that's a good enough for me to keep using it .

That is an excellent reason!!!

[Bandmill Bandit]

Ive been using the BelRay 2 cycle synthetic oils for so long I can't remember when I started. Think is was probably in 78. Also have the Husky little bottles of synthetic but mostly for the purpose of refilling with BelRay so its easy to mix in a gallon gerry can.

No problems at all with the synthetics and I use the 50 to 1 mix   

[Gary_C]

Here is some information for you synthetic 2 cycle oil addicts.
Does a 2 Stroke Engine  Really Require a Synthetic Oil?

And if you want a little more detail, here is another.
The late Great Oil Debate

Here is what synthetic oils are good for:
1.  Resist prolonged high temperature conditions without breakdown.
2.  High viscosity index. (means they don't get thick at cold temperatures nor thin at high temperatures)
3.  Better film forming ability. (superior lubricating ability)

Here is what synthetic oils are NOT good for:
a.  Burning.
b.  Your pocket book.

So 1. and 2. are of no value in 2 cycle engines and a. is a strong negative that is offset somewhat by 3. which allows somewhat less quantity. All things considered, it's a wash and so then the disadvantage of b. tilts in favor of the seller.  ;D

Oh by the way, there are no effective standards on the amount of actual synthetic in each proprietary blend for the manufacturer to claim the 2 cycle oil to be "synthetic." So in the interests of better burning, it's better if there is a higher content of regular distilled petro oil. Plus the petro oil is cheaper.  There is that pocket book factor that's working against you again.

[SwampDonkey]

Do I detect a new player in the ever present oil wars per chance? If so a few questions .

Firstly how does one go about measuring precisely 71 to 1? Rather odd ratio I would think .Secondly why in the world would anybody make a claim that a ratio of 400 to 1 would provide any protection what so ever ?  ???

It's the homeopathy woowoos, only this time oil and not medicine. The more dilute the stronger it is.  ;D :D

[Al_Smith]

ho·me·op·a·thy
ˌhōmēˈäpəTHē/Submit
noun
the treatment of disease by minute doses of natural substances that in a healthy person would produce symptoms of disease.
 
Thanks  Swampish,I learned a new word. ;D

[Stihlowner]

Here is some information for you synthetic 2 cycle oil addicts.
Does a 2 Stroke Engine  Really Require a Synthetic Oil?

And if you want a little more detail, here is another.
The late Great Oil Debate

Here is what synthetic oils are good for:
1.  Resist prolonged high temperature conditions without breakdown.
2.  High viscosity index. (means they don't get thick at cold temperatures nor thin at high temperatures)
3.  Better film forming ability. (superior lubricating ability)

Here is what synthetic oils are NOT good for:
a.  Burning.
b.  Your pocket book.

So 1. and 2. are of no value in 2 cycle engines and a. is a strong negative that is offset somewhat by 3. which allows somewhat less quantity. All things considered, it's a wash and so then the disadvantage of b. tilts in favor of the seller.  ;D

Oh by the way, there are no effective standards on the amount of actual synthetic in each proprietary blend for the manufacturer to claim the 2 cycle oil to be "synthetic." So in the interests of better burning, it's better if there is a higher content of regular distilled petro oil. Plus the petro oil is cheaper.  There is that pocket book factor that's working against you again.

Dang, I might as well throw all my oil away now.
I can't live without standards.
The pocket book factor is probably the reason I don't have any money left over for chewing tobacco after I buy synthetic oil.

[weimedog]

So much theory, and I've also run Bel-Ray since the 1970's and dealt with them when working for a Motorcycle company back around 2000-2002. And also the folks at Mobil who sell the base stock that so many tweak and put their label on. Had some interesting conversations then and nothing has significantly changed. And these oil debates come and go and have since there have been places to post.

Without going into any theory, all I can do is relay experiences. I could unload theory but it doesn't matter. Only results do. So a few "highlights" of 45 years of two stroke experience.

Early Caster Oils were dirty but left the motors intact. Klotz still sells a caster based oil as of five years ago. There is a reason. (Klotz is an awesome company BTW)

Bel-Ray MC1 at 50:1 ran well with the 125 race bikes. At 32:1 left a tar in the exhaust. At 50:1 the motors were clean but dry ( but usually OK ) on tear downs. A theme that repeated it self until now. Saws I tear down that have run 50:1 are dry inside as well....so nothing has changed there in 45 years.

There are two basic types of Synthetics, Paraffin and Ester based. There is a difference and I'll let the experts pontificate. Ester's usually were preferred in high performance apps. but would pick up water. Enter Bel-Ray H1R

I converted to Bel-Ray H1R and was able to run 32:1 without tar in the exhaust. Pickup up both power and internal engine parts life over a season easily offsetting the additional cost. Oil is a fuel and has more BTU's per unit volume than gas. AND all the tear downs yielded a "moist" look with an oil film through out the internals. A trend that also hasn't changed in 30 years as all my two strokes are run with 32:1 and when I test and tear down they are always wet. I like that. So I still run 32:1 in all my two stroke equipment.

Where I work the guy who over see's all things mechanical bought some magic purple  two stoke oil to save money. 4 dead 357xp's later decided something was wrong....blamed it on the operators officially! Went to Husqvarna Synthetic per dealer and 32:1 per me. The new 550xp's didn't die yet of that "operator" disease.

And finally there is this mathematical concept called statistics. I can imagine certain conditions where a minimal amount of oil could survive a period of time for a manufacturer or marketing department to make a claim. Look at all those video's over the years of motors running with no oil or some magic additive until they melt. And remember all the discussion around Yamaha's oil injection systems. I tend to try and do things that push the statistics in my favor in my world where there are no steady state conditions.

There is a difference between controlled conditions to make a marketing point and the varied conditions of the typical two stroke user. From weather conditions to fuel conditions. From service cycles to rest cycles where chemistry plays a role.

Nothing being posted here or anywhere else over the years has changed the physic's  and chemistry of the discussion. The manufactures have tested for warrantee purposes and get acceptable results at 50:1, that's a good starting point. 40:1 is better in my very humble opinion. And I put my dollars where my opinion is and use 32:1 after all these years and have yet to see or hear anything to convince me that either the chemistry or physics have changed.

To those who choose to run 100:1 or even 400:1 all I can say if it works for you, please continue.

That is the sum total of my knowledge and input on the subject.

[SwampDonkey]

ho·me·op·a·thy
ˌhōmēˈäpəTHē/Submit
noun
the treatment of disease by minute doses of natural substances that in a healthy person would produce symptoms of disease.
 
Thanks  Swampish,I learned a new word. ;D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiwaGnj8kPU

[Gary_C]

Dang, I might as well throw all my oil away now.

I am curious as to how you came to that conclusion from what I wrote and you quoted. I agree with what was written in one of the articles I linked.

So, what's the best oil to use?

I truly believe there are no bad oils anymore (well, maybe a few really cheap ones are not so good). Most problems with oils are the result of misuse. 

A better conclusion is that the synthetic oils do work as long as you are very careful in how you use them. Plus synthetics are a great marketing tool for the manufacturers that will increase their bottom line significantly.

[49er]

Here is some information for you synthetic 2 cycle oil addicts.
Does a 2 Stroke Engine  Really Require a Synthetic Oil?

And if you want a little more detail, here is another.
The late Great Oil Debate

Here is what synthetic oils are good for:
1.  Resist prolonged high temperature conditions without breakdown.
2.  High viscosity index. (means they don't get thick at cold temperatures nor thin at high temperatures)
3.  Better film forming ability. (superior lubricating ability)

Here is what synthetic oils are NOT good for:
a.  Burning.
b.  Your pocket book.

So 1. and 2. are of no value in 2 cycle engines and a. is a strong negative that is offset somewhat by 3. which allows somewhat less quantity. All things considered, it's a wash and so then the disadvantage of b. tilts in favor of the seller.  ;D

Oh by the way, there are no effective standards on the amount of actual synthetic in each proprietary blend for the manufacturer to claim the 2 cycle oil to be "synthetic." So in the interests of better burning, it's better if there is a higher content of regular distilled petro oil. Plus the petro oil is cheaper.  There is that pocket book factor that's working against you again.

Gary_C, I think you are right on with this post.
   Only thing I will add is a low ash oil is preferred over ashless boat oil.
I also truly believe that long term the bearings is what needs the oil the most. 32/1 ratio
for me.
FYI, Bel-Ray mineral oil is group I & II oils, not the best. That info came from Bel-Ray.
I am about to order 4 gallons of Legend zx-2sr mineral oil. My 5 gallon bucket of Bailey's synthetic is about gone.
   
   Stilowner, I have done the quote mistake too, all I can say is so what. ;)

[Stihlowner]

Dang, I might as well throw all my oil away now.

I am curious as to how you came to that conclusion from what I wrote and you quoted. I agree with what was written in one of the articles I linked.

So, what's the best oil to use?

I truly believe there are no bad oils anymore (well, maybe a few really cheap ones are not so good). Most problems with oils are the result of misuse. 

A better conclusion is that the synthetic oils do work as long as you are very careful in how you use them. Plus synthetics are a great marketing tool for the manufacturers that will increase their bottom line significantly.

I was just busting on you.
All in fun I hope.
As far as the best oil to use you will have to ask the experts on here because when I post some positive results from oils I have used it ruffles their feathers.
On another note it makes for some amusing reading.
If it wasn't for them the world would be a boring place.

[AdkStihl]

You don't suppose it might have something to do with the carb setting do you ? 8) Oh I do love the great oil debate .

Say it can't be so Uncle Al   :D

[Al_Smith]

 :D Well quite frankly I run synthetic in my car if that accounts for anything .Of course I don't mix it with the gasoline at 71 to 1 .

Then again there is gent ,on another site who  owns a fishing camp in Ont. I think,remote  location .They had a Chevy pickup they ran since brand new on premixed boat motor gas mixed 50 to 1 .Said it ran like a top .

[HolmenTree]

I remember those years back in the early 1980's when the 100:1 German engineered Optimol hit the scene in those little plastic pouches.
Pictures of magnified steel surfaces before and after  polished with this gas mix.
But later when unleaded gas  was only available at the pumps, the 100:1 theory kind of lost its wind in its sails.
It's obvious the lead in the gasoline  was a safety blanket
;)

[Gary_C]

I was just busting on you.
All in fun I hope.

Yep, that's what I was doing too.  ;D

There is no doubt that synthetic oils have superior traits for many applications. I will not use anything but 5w-40 full synthetic in all my diesels because of the excellent cold starting abilities and better lubrication. But most of the advantages are lost on 2 cycle engines and you can argue the best 2 cycle oil is a blend of regular oils with some synthetic. So because of the higher cost of synthetic oil, best advice is to use a good synthetic blend that is not one of the extremely high priced labels the chain saw manufacturers are selling.

The companies that make chain saws do not make oils, they buy blends just like everyone else. But they do make more money when they sell their blends.  :

[square1]

Pennzoil Marine Premium Plus Outboard 2-Cycle Oil, Synthetic Blend, TC-W3

Just bought 4 gal of this stuff at $6.25 per qt. for a direct injected outboard  :-\  Based on this discussion I should throw it out or use it at somewhere between a 1:1  and 500:1 mix  :laugh:

[Bandmill Bandit]

Pennzoil Marine Premium Plus Outboard 2-Cycle Oil, Synthetic Blend, TC-W3

Just bought 4 gal of this stuff at $6.25 per qt. for a direct injected outboard  :-\  Based on this discussion I should throw it out or use it at somewhere between a 1:1  and 500:1 mix  :laugh:

:D
Some how I think either of those extremes will leave you very frustrated! AND rowing back to the dock!

[WmFritz]

I like these discussions. I will never change my brand of oil or mix ratio for my 2 strokes, but I like to look over people's shoulders to see what they'er doing.

Nice articles Gary.

[Babylon519]

I was testing the 15hp outboard in a barrel last weekend. All fresh fuel, 50:1 as it calls for. After about 30 minutes of start-stop-run, I emptied the water barrel. If I had used a putty knife to scrape off the oil ring around the top of the barrel, I'm sure I would have recaptured about 6 oz of oil (blacker, due to burning, but seemed just as viscous).
It made me wonder a bunch of things: a) if that is really wasted oil, what would happen if I halved the mix to 100:1? b) would this be a case for synthetics, which I've never used before? c) no wonder there's controversy about 2-cycle engines. The 50:1 mix is used in my 120hp bowrider, the 15hp kicker, the weedwhacker, and several chainsaws. I'm beginning to feel like a pariah. Add that to my two old tractors, couple of trucks, cars and my VW trike, and I'm thinking I can't call myself a very good environmentalist. I want to be, but I just can't get there from here.  ???
Jason

[Gary_C]

If I had used a putty knife to scrape off the oil ring around the top of the barrel, I'm sure I would have recaptured about 6 oz of oil (blacker, due to burning, but seemed just as viscous).
It made me wonder a bunch of things: a) if that is really wasted oil, what would happen if I halved the mix to 100:1? b) would this be a case for synthetics, which I've never used before?

In answer to a), I would say to absolutely follow the instructions for the oil you are using. In answer to b), synthetic oils do not burn better. Actually they do not burn as well.

So what should you do to be more environmentally friendly? Read this from the link I posted earlier.

Since all 2-stroke engines partially burn and expel their lubricant in the exhaust, the resulting exhaust residue must be rendered harmless to the environment (air, water and land).  All 2-stroke oil intended for marine use and many intended for land recreational use contain Biodegrading agents. These complex chemical compounds allow the microbes found in water and in the soil to consume the hazardous chemicals and oil from the exhaust as they fall in the water or on the ground.  These Biodegrading agents do nothing for the performance of the oil (sometimes they even hinder it), but they help assure us that 2-stroke engines will be around for a while.

Best overall answer to you problem is to make sure you are using a 2 stroke oil that is rated for marine use and follow the instructions on the label.

Don't be like this guy in the story from the same link.

I had a friend once that insisted on mixing STP with his premix. He swore his motor made more bottom end with STP in the fuel. Well, it may have, but he invested considerably more $$ in spark plugs than just about anyone else on the planet. He was also responsible for single handedly stunting the growth of the entire mosquito population in southeast Texas (thank God he quit riding).

I'm not sure that bit about the mosquitoes is a bad thing but moral of the story is always follow the instructions.

[Babylon519]

Thanks Gary,
I feel a little better now... It was a bit alarming to see that ring of sludge. I use Shell Nautilus low-ash oil. It seems to produce less obnoxious exhaust fumes.
Jason

[Stihlowner]

Gary_C, That is good advice.
Mix the oil the way the oil company want's it mixed.
I wouldn't lean out just any oil.
Like I said before the oil I use is said to be mixed at 71/1.
I just didn't take any oil and mix it that way.

[Stihlowner]

Another product, Dura Lube for 4 cycle engines.
A friend had an old car and he put in a quart of Dura Lube.
After a few days of driving it with the Dura Lube in it he drained the oil and started it up.
After a half of hour of running it without any oil it wouldn't blow up.
He said the heck with it and filled it back up with oil and sold the car.
He told the new owner it has a tough engine it it.
.

[John Mc]

My posts were not intended to tell anyone to change what they are doing.
I just posted info and results of using different products.
I do find that a few on here have a problem with people trying different products and posting the results.

Stihlowner -  I don't think the reaction was necessarily to your post specifically. You have to know the history of the "great oil wars" debates which have raged here (it also helps if you know the history of Al). A simple comment can bring it all back up again: hours of reading from folks who claim that the ONLY thing that anyone with half a brain in their head would run is 16:1 dinosaur oil, with a vehement response that 32:1 is the only way to go, or 40:1 or 50:1 (because that's what the manufacturer recommends), 80:1 or 100:1. So many people claiming that they have found the BEST magic ratio to make their saws run like they are 20cc larger and last forever and anything else is sheer idiocy.

I'm not saying your post was at ALL intended this way. It's just that once it comes up it seems we're always in danger of setting it all off again. Al in particular likes to point this out (and probably coined the term "oil wars"). In fact, once someone sets it in motion, he has been known to chime in with his own preference, then sit back and watch the drama unfold. Generally, Al is harmless, rarely bites, and at any rate has had all his shots. He is also a rather knowledgeable guy, just don't mention oil mix ratios around him - he may start twitching and muttering

[Stihlowner]

Thanks John.
I was born at night but not last night.
I know that when someone tells others about something they have tried there will be others with their opinions.
Remember opinions for the most part are not based on fact or knowledge.
Every forum has it's keyboard commandos.   pc_smiley  tank-smiley
Every forum has it war topics.
That is what keeps many coming back.
They look around and get in on the action.
Thanks again for your interest.
This is not my first rodeo.

Anyone want to get in a HeliCoil verses Tine-Sert war???

Hey, If you want to have a blast sometime go on a garden forum and tell everyone how great Miracle-Gro made your plants grow and then hold on to your seat.
Some of those people on those forums should wash their mouths out with kerosene.
They are one angry bunch of carrots!!!
Wasn't it said that gardening helps people be more relaxed???

[John Mc]

Just didn't want you to feel jumped on as a new user. That's not what this place is all about.

[Bandmill Bandit]

Yes this is one topic that tends to be a bit divisive!

When it come to 2 cycle oils and MY 2 cycle equipment, I use what has been a reliable product and has not cost me major repairs along the way and is readily available at what I consider a fair price.

I see many posts from people that take the same approach AND I have looked for the product they talk about. In some cases it is not easy to get so I stick with what I know works for me. In other cases I have tried a product and I just straight up don't like the "stink"!

Bottom line I like what I like cause I am too lazy to do  the work to find something equivalent or better. Why would I want to?

It ain't broke so it dont need fixin!

[Stihlowner]

Just didn't want you to feel jumped on as a new user. That's not what this place is all about.

No problem but a few on here don't know "That's not what this place is all about"

[Stihlowner]

Yes this is one topic that tends to be a bit divisive!

When it come to 2 cycle oils and MY 2 cycle equipment, I use what has been a reliable product and has not cost me major repairs along the way and is readily available at what I consider a fair price.

I see many posts from people that take the same approach AND I have looked for the product they talk about. In some cases it is not easy to get so I stick with what I know works for me. In other cases I have tried a product and I just straight up don't like the "stink"!

Bottom line I like what I like cause I am too lazy to do  the work to find something equivalent or better. Why would I want to?

It ain't broke so it dont need fixin!

I always liked trying different things.
One reason I like the newer oils is the one mix, one can for all my 2 cycle engines.
My next adventure is running an old 2 cycle engine on Amsoil Saber oil at 400/1.
There goes the one can thing out the window.
Have to get another can for the 400/1 mix.

[gspren]

Stihlowner, I prefer the threaded insert repair over Helicoils anytime that there is room to use them, and I have used hundreds. ;D

[Stihlowner]

Stihlowner, I prefer the threaded insert repair over Helicoils anytime that there is room to use them, and I have used hundreds. ;D

Me too.
I use Time-Sert.
Really strong.
I use some red Loctite on them even with their locking feature.
Never had one come loose.
You do have to invest a little money but sometimes there just isn't enough room for a larger hole.

I have had some HeliCoils come out with the bolt but it was my own fault for not installing them correctly.
I left the coil to close to the top of the hole.
Now I cut the coil so the top of it is down in the hole more.
Never had them come loose after that.
I also install them with red Loctite.

I have a lot of HeliCoil sizes so I use them first because I already spent the money on them.
I'm not sure but I think the tap is a special size so you have to buy their tap.

[Mooseherder]

There's been oil discussion here but the oil wars were not held at the Forestry Forum.  It probably spilled over from members who frequent other sites but forget where they're at.
It's also apparent some don't really want to know what others think just throw some bait out to start a so called war.  That ain't gonna happen here.

[Stihlowner]

There's been oil discussion here but the oil wars were not held at the Forestry Forum.  It probably spilled over from members who frequent other sites but forget where they're at.
It's also apparent some don't really want to know what others think just throw some bait out to start a so called war.  That ain't gonna happen here.

I didn't post my thoughts, results or anything else about the oil I am using to get anyone upset or to start any war.
They did that all by themselves.
I really thought in this day and age there would be some that also use it.
I guess not many.
It is also apparent when new products come out that work and someone makes a post on them the old school folks on here get     Funny!!! to say the least.

Getting pretty good using the quote function.

[Mooseherder]

There's a whole community here that already knows flare ups usually occur in the chainsaw board.
Breathing too much oil must have an effect on thin skin. ;)

[Stihlowner]

Well I think I'll just go hide behind the barn now and let you guys do your thing.
Got to head over and see what is happening on the garden forum.

[danbuendgen]

Oil is oil so who cares. Just run the cheap stuff in saws. When you stop and think about saw fuel, I dont care what ratio you mix it to, saw fuel is cheap. I just run the Husky pro mix from my local saw shop/logging supply store. I mix it 45:1 for a hair more oil and my saws (3 562xpg and 1 390xp) seem to like it fine, I have 6 years on my 390 and 3 years on my 562's and I run saws everyday. Again, saw fuel is cheap, and saws are cheap. Run em' when they blow, buy a new one.

Now diesel fuel and oil changes and diesel engine rebuilds are the real cost to a logging business.

[Paul_H]

Well I think I'll just go hide behind the barn now and let you guys do your thing.
Got to head over and see what is happening on the garden forum.

Thank you

[Gary_C]

Thank you

Paul is a man of few words. A real Calvin Coolidge of Administrators.  :D :D

[Ada Shaker]

Every forum has it's keyboard commandos.   pc_smiley  tank-smiley
Every forum has it war topics.
That is what keeps many coming back.
They look around and get in on the action.
Thanks again for your interest.
This is not my first rodeo.

Anyone want to get in a HeliCoil verses Tine-Sert war???

Forget helicoils or nutserts, "Stud" mounted exhausts are the way to go, you have to stop molesting the threads on that little jug.
And brass nuts to finish the job off, come back we're missing you overthere.   

[Al_Smith]

Well now the great oil  discussion isn't really a war is it? It's more so a great debate and amusing at least to me .

Never fear in the by and by someone will start the great gasoline debate anew.All kinds of knowledge on that one .From AV gas to non ethanol marine gas which is 90 miles away for  me. Then you have the ready mix super duper stuff that Stihl sells in little cans . Then of course is racing gas which everybody needs to cut a face cord of firewood once a year ----gotta have it ---- 8)

[ZeroJunk]

I can buy Sunoco 260GTX right down the road for $8 a gallon. That's the ticket.

[gspren]

  I recently found a station about 10 miles from me with Vallero 89 octane ethanol free for $3.19, same station 89 with ethanol is $2.59