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Log storage?

Started by Timster, April 10, 2016, 11:04:27 PM

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Timster

Well I have decided to buy a mill and have been gathering all the logs I can from the power line project. I have a limited time to gather the logs due to their next phase of the project which is to do restoration. Before they regrade and plant the area i have to gather what I can. My question is how do I best store the logs? The ones I have gathered I have stacked off the ground and some are covered with tarps.

Most of what I gathered is eastern hemlock, however, there is some cherry, hard and soft maple, eastern white pine, beech and birch. I have left them in the longest lengths I can and will decide how to buck them when I know what lumber I need. My plan is to mill the hemlock and extend my garage and make a shed for the mill.

What can I expect as a time frame i have for the stored logs? It will take me at least another few weeks before I am ready to start milling. I figure it will take a few months or more to mill what I need to extend my garage.

Im told its best to mill the hemlock and start using it soon if not right away. I will be working alone so production will be at my usual slow pace. The hemlock was cut last November so it has been down and drying for a few months already. Does this time on the ground effect the mill and use soon suggestions?  If I need to get the lumber I mill graded for a building inspector how does one go about this process?

Ron Wenrich

Have all the logs been cut in November?  Logs cut in the winter can lay awhile. Your major problems with long laying logs is blue stain and boring bugs.  That won't start to be a problem until the weather warms up.  We would stack our hemlock and cut that when we had an order.  For the most part, they were ok, even after laying for a long time. 

It always seemed that fresh cut logs would be more of a problem for the blue stain, and you only get it in the sapwood.  Soft maple would be more of a problem than the others you have listed, with cherry sapwood being second.  In my experience. boring bugs are more prevalent in ash and oak.

Stacking logs off the ground is always a good choice.  They stay cleaner, and they don't trap any moisture underneath them, which will cause rot.  I see no reason to tarp them, and it could be worse for them.  Humid conditions encourages blue stain.   Blue stain doesn't ruin lumber other than appearance.  But, it is a precursor to rot.

As for lumber grade, you'll have to see what your local building code is.  Some places allow you to use local wood, some places not.  I've used it for roof trusses and siding without it being graded.  But, our building code is pretty lax, and we don't have inspectors for that type of building.  You need to be aware of shake in hemlock.  Those pieces you can't use. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

GeneWengert-WoodDoc

In addition to Ron's comments...

Eastern hemlock logs oftentimes give a lower yield of useful lumber than most other species..this is due to a bacterial infection that causes ring shake, very high initial moisture (logs sink and do not float in water), funny odor, and very weak lumber.  So, look at your logs for ring shake. 

Smaller eastern hemlock logs often have a lot of knots and compression wood, both which also weaken the lumber.

So, you may find that the hemlock logs you have will not make the strong pieces that you need or the inspector requires.

This is also why we do not see much hemlock lumber on the marketplace...other species are better for sawing, selling and using.
Gene - Author of articles in Sawmill & Woodlot and books: Drying Hardwood Lumber; VA Tech Solar Kiln; Sawing Edging & Trimming Hardwood Lumber. And more

Luke_Eames

Any maple that I get in I try to get it on the saw then to the kiln as soon as possible.  When it's warm, the sap starts running and the white sap wood starts to stain.  The finish mills that I deal with don't like the staining in the white wood.

I saw a lot of Hemlock and yes watch out for the ring shake, especially in the larger trees.  It's nice when the large logs hit the mill hoping for a lot of lumber then half of it splits due to the shake...  >:(
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Timster

While walking through all the down logs I did notice some ring shake on the stumps. Does this defect effect the entire log or will it be board by board? I don't think I will need  a building permit for under a thousand sqft, however, I don't want to build with inferior lumber. Part of my decision to buy a mill was that I would be able to mill all the wood necessary for the garage extension. Would I be able to mill up the lumber, check for ring shake, then use individual boards or will the whole log be considered defective and become siding or other non structural use?

What would be considered a "smaller" log? Most of what I have stacked is in the 10"-12" range with a fare amount of 12"-16" and few ~20". I have the larger ones cut to 16' to use as rafters. I plan on sawing them to 2"x8" for a 12' span 16" on center. The actual building plans are still not finalized. If I can learn more about timber framing and post and beam I just may give that serious consideration.

Ron Wenrich

I could box out a lot of the shake that I had.  Rarely would it extend all the way around the growth ring.  But, I wouldn't use anything too close to the shake for a structural piece.  For example, if you have shake in the top part of a 2x8, you could rip a 2x4 or 2x6 and probably get a decent piece.  A lot depends on how the shake runs.  We also used 1x8 and 1x10 as sheeting.  If there was shake in an end, we trimmed it off.   

You will be able to see the shake in the end of the log.  When you saw through it, the piece will fall apart.  Keep your defect in the corner of your piece so you can trim it out and have the best possible yield.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Brad_bb

The beech and maple should be ok off the ground with airflow and preferably out of the sun.  Maybe put some shade cloth over them.   I don't know anything about Hemlock or birch.  The cherry you might want to peel the bark.  It might hold moisture and start to rot the sapwood.  A few months isn't long if you keep them as mentioned above.  I just milled 5 ash logs and one cherry that were down on the ground for 11 months.  the small cherry has one spot that the sapwood just started to decay showing white mold. I debarked them as soon as the winter broke and we got some warm days. The cherry bark was holding moisture.  You might want to consider treating them with timbor or something.  I keep a bunch of logs in my pole barn and I've fogged them when I fogged my cut lumber. 
You may still have some powder post beetle larvae attack while they are still wet enough. 

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Kbeitz

I've had Hemlock on the ground for 6 years and it was still good.

Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

GeneWengert-WoodDoc

With eastern hemlock, most shake is in the butt log.  It can be up the log only a few feet or 6'...  At 100 year old trees, I have seen it 12', in which case the butt is trash.  As a rough rule of thumb, 16" and larger is a nice log and 20', small end, is a larger log.
Gene - Author of articles in Sawmill & Woodlot and books: Drying Hardwood Lumber; VA Tech Solar Kiln; Sawing Edging & Trimming Hardwood Lumber. And more

Kbeitz

And then sometimes you get this... When i cut this Hemlock down the first 6 feet was solid.



 

Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

Timster

Will the drying time on the hemlock be shorter now that it has been cut six months ago or does the drying time start once its sawn?  I understand it will accelerate the drying once its milled but was wondering if the drying process has gotten a head start while it has been sitting.

Thanks for the info on storage. Most of the beech is off the ground and covered as well as some of the cherry and maple. I was just concerned if I should spend time gathering and covering all of logs before I start milling the lumber for the garage. I hate waste but some is inevitable given the situation and working alone.

Still have a lot of dirt work to do before I set up the mill. Have a good amount of fill and leveling to the area behind the garage and the area designated for the mill. Its all good relaxation therapy time for me, on the tractor and soon with the mill  :D

Kbeitz

Some of the Hemlock that I cut thats been down for years is still wet inside.
So I would say the drying starts after it's cut.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

Timster

Had a helper for the day and gathered what I could. I have about 120 logs gathered and piled next to the road now I just have to order the mill! Seems that Woodland mills is offering a newer upgraded WM130 and now I need to decide to upgrade and buy the slightly bigger and newer mill. Any thoughts? The increased cost will set my plans back a month or two but may be worth it in the long run.


Time to finish leveling the site for the mill, have to switch to dirt work for a few days and take advantage of the warmer dry weather they are predicting for the next few days.


Last load of logs for the day. Took inventory seems I will have enough to keep me busy for a while.

Timster

While waiting for the mill I have been researching and securing all the other stuff that I think I may need. Ordered 5 gal of Anchorseal 2 and some Tim-bor for when I start milling the hemlock. A thought crossed my mind. Some of the logs are still in tree length >20' or more. I know I will be bucking them down to mill and have left them as long as possible so far. When I buck them down should I seal the ends with Anchorseal? And the logs already short enough to mill and already stacked should they be sealed as well?

I have noticed that some of the hardwoods in my stacks are starting to check on the ends is it too late to seal them? They have been cut and stacked for a few months already.

Any ideas on other stuff to have around that I should start gathering? Working on my tool list  :P

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