Other equipment from China.... anyone have any?

Jeff · September 16, 2016, 08:26:32 PM

And then there are the out and out thieving counterfeiters. I'll ban every Chinese iP address I can here and never approve a Chinese registration app again because every single one i gave a chance turned out to be spammers. I hate this topic because I know what the thieving Chinese have cost our sponsors which in turn costs all of us.
http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2016-09-16/lucas-mill-family-fight-to-stop-chinese-copies-of-sawmill/7848394

Ox · September 17, 2016, 06:52:59 AM

I've heard that, apparently, in their culture they will always try to take advantage of you. If you don't catch them trying to scam/spam/get one over on you it's not their fault they're trying to cheat you - it's you're fault because you weren't smart enough to catch them. :

I get that different cultures are just that - different. But this seems over the top. Nothing like taking wrong and twisting it around so it's slightly justified and you're fault you just got cheated.

Are politicians going to school in China? ;D

John Mc · September 17, 2016, 09:08:39 AM

There are good and bad companies in China, just as there are in the US. There is a well-known US business based not far from me that often blatantly copies the designs of other companies (though they do at least have the sense to wait until the patent runs out). They then present their clone as the product of extensive research and development and act like they invented the concept.

SuperSplit was one victim of this approach. In fact when the cloner first came out with their flywheel-based splitter it looked identical to the SS machine except for the stickers - so much so that I emailed asking if they were manufacturing these themselves or just rebadging the SS machines. (They since modified the design to put a bit of their own styling into it.)

So it's not just the Chinese that are doing this, they are just a whole lot more blatant about it.

John Mc · September 17, 2016, 09:19:46 AM

I had not seen the story on the Lucas Mills that Jeff posted. It's scary, and it's also an endless battle. If you shut down one violator, there are other factories just waiting to step in. Often there are multiple competing Chinese factories already cloning the same product.

Didn't something similar happen to LogRite? I know that certain mass marketer whose name is a bad word on this site was selling a hookaroon that closely matched the LogRite product (as long as you didn't look too closely, or actually try to use it). Someone else copied one of their arches. The copy had a few differences that someone familiar with them could spot - which made it all the more telling when their advertising used a picture of the LogRite arch instead of the clone. At one point, I saw a LogRite video showing the differences between their arch and the clone in use - seeing that crappy clone in use would have been funny, if it wasn't so infuriating.

Jeff · September 17, 2016, 09:45:40 AM

Not once have we had someone from china sign up and turn out to be a good faith member of the forestry forum. NOT ONCE. And over the years we have given many many chances. We review these registration applications manually. We check where they come from, the email addresses, usernames against like usernames used elsewhere on the web, and the biggest thing we check is the reason for joining. In each and every case, anytime we gave one a chance, they abused it the very first chance they got logged on. It would be wonderful to have a legitimate member from that part of the world to learn some things about their forests and forest product industry, but because of their lying and conniving , they won't be allowed again on my watch. although I am sure more will still find a way to slip through as they improve on their deceitful ways.

Ox · September 17, 2016, 12:27:59 PM

I agree with ya, Jeff. It would be interesting to find out their logging practices, types of trees, quality of wood/lumber, etc. I realize this info could probably be found online somewhere but it's just nicer to hear it from a live person, so to speak, with real world experience. It's truly a shame. :-\

schmalts · September 18, 2016, 12:18:59 AM

So I got my hydraulic upgrade mostly done. The new front loader valve with power beyond now supplies the crane instead of the pto pump. I literally doubled the speed it moves. One I get the QR bracket made up and installed next weekend I hope some dry weather will allow me to cut and lift a bigger oak. I'll take pictures at that time.

John Mc · September 18, 2016, 08:01:46 AM

That's interesting. I had always assumed that PTO pumps put out more than most tractor hydraulics. I know it's true on my compact tractor.

schmalts · September 18, 2016, 08:50:20 AM

Quote from: John Mc on September 18, 2016, 08:01:46 AM
That's interesting. I had always assumed that PTO pumps put out more than most tractor hydraulics. I know it's true on my compact tractor.

normally they do. They sent me a pto pump sized assuming I had a 1000rpm pto option. My bad for not specing that out. A different pump was only 150 bucks but I'd rather just plug in to the tractor, way easier. I was very happy when I saw how fast everything moved after my upgrade. I went from a stack valve to a monoblock joystick with an extra lever that controls a remote in the rear. That will control the steering cylinder.

logman81 · September 18, 2016, 06:31:01 PM

Looking forward to seeing it done and loading logs. I really want one!

schmalts · September 18, 2016, 07:10:21 PM

Well I couldn't wait. I cut that heavy leaner oak. I'm just starting to walk but I ran like he'll when that started going down. The plate and screws were felt in the leg. Rutted up my trails. ..but I got to test it. I didn't measure the diameter but some over 15 for sure. 20 feet of the 22 inch butt log way to big and will sit until freeze up. It lifted no problem. Scary moment climbing a hill, had to offload 2 logs to make it. Now if the thing stays in one piece.

timberlinetree · September 19, 2016, 05:48:53 AM

Just be sure to check your welds. The NEW radiator from CHINA that had a bad weld/soder is still not fixed after two attempts( time and money wasted) but it is leaking less. What a hassle!

Puffergas · September 19, 2016, 12:29:50 PM

Some tractor pumps run off the engine timing gears and can fail under hard use. Just saying. Nice rig!!!!!!!!

logman81 · September 19, 2016, 01:43:34 PM

Looks like it is working well for you those are some good size logs, cant was to see more pics!

schmalts · September 19, 2016, 09:30:38 PM

Quote from: Puffergas on September 19, 2016, 12:29:50 PM
Some tractor pumps run off the engine timing gears and can fail under hard use. Just saying. Nice rig!!!!!!!!

The pump fails or the timing gears?

Corley5 · September 19, 2016, 09:45:18 PM

Farmalls were known for timing gear failure with live hydraulic pumps. M&W made heavier aftermarket gears to solve the problem. When the Super and 100 series came out the factory gears were heavier to solve the problem.

jd540b · September 21, 2016, 06:24:14 AM

Figured I'd share my two cents. I am in the process of getting a small pellet mill up and running here in Maine. As part of this, I travelled to China last February to visit a company and look at a pellet production line. It all looked ok-certainly good enough to get the mill started. So, I bought the line-which was about 10% of the cost to do so domestically. The lower initial cost was the only was I could attempt the business due to limited capital. Long story short, I had it all imported using a customs broker, built a shop for it, etc. etc.
Things were going as good as expected and the Chinese company was great at communicating as we navigated through assembly and construction of production line. Until.....after test running the chipper for 5 minutes it had a complete and catostophic failure. Bearings were loose and never tightened on the drum and the knives came around and struck the anvil plate. This was nearly the end of the line for me as knife pieces were flying around the shop like a bomb went off. Chipper was completely destroyed. Called the company to discuss the "year warrantee" and they were going to send replacement. Well, replacement never came and never heard from the company again. Will not return calls, e mails, etc. They got me. Played a good game they did.
Zhengzhou Whirlston Machinery-spread the word that they are not to be trusted.

China stuff boils down to this for me. The value is there as long as the cost is very low and you assume you will be fixing and repairing the stuff. It would be nice if we could all buy top of the line equipment right out of the gate, but that is not always reality. You do get what you pay for-but sometimes all we can afford is "cheap Chinese junk".

By the way, after going to China...they can make very high quality stuff-they just send us what we ask for, and the number one order is low cost.

JustinW_NZ · September 26, 2016, 05:57:07 AM

I have to agree with this.
The real cheap stuff the chinese dont use themselves...
we got a 10 ton wheel loader - has nearly 400hours on it now over the last 12 months and no major issues.
Company checked in with me a couple of times, made sure all was ok etc..
Was it the cheapest loader on the market in china - no, i was hoping this might help...

I would have also loved to have bought a volvo or cat, but after watching my friends almost new volvo spit its gearbox in 100 hours (replaced under warrenty) and CAT wanting a fortune and not having the exact config we wanted without a painful wait I decided to save the money on the purchase but sat some aside for 'oh bugger' breakages.

Just my 10c..

Cheers

Cheers
Justin

Quote from: jd540b on September 21, 2016, 06:24:14 AM
Figured I'd share my two cents. I am in the process of getting a small pellet mill up and running here in Maine. As part of this, I travelled to China last February to visit a company and look at a pellet production line. It all looked ok-certainly good enough to get the mill started. So, I bought the line-which was about 10% of the cost to do so domestically. The lower initial cost was the only was I could attempt the business due to limited capital. Long story short, I had it all imported using a customs broker, built a shop for it, etc. etc.
Things were going as good as expected and the Chinese company was great at communicating as we navigated through assembly and construction of production line. Until.....after test running the chipper for 5 minutes it had a complete and catostophic failure. Bearings were loose and never tightened on the drum and the knives came around and struck the anvil plate. This was nearly the end of the line for me as knife pieces were flying around the shop like a bomb went off. Chipper was completely destroyed. Called the company to discuss the "year warrantee" and they were going to send replacement. Well, replacement never came and never heard from the company again. Will not return calls, e mails, etc. They got me. Played a good game they did.
Zhengzhou Whirlston Machinery-spread the word that they are not to be trusted.

China stuff boils down to this for me. The value is there as long as the cost is very low and you assume you will be fixing and repairing the stuff. It would be nice if we could all buy top of the line equipment right out of the gate, but that is not always reality. You do get what you pay for-but sometimes all we can afford is "cheap Chinese junk".

By the way, after going to China...they can make very high quality stuff-they just send us what we ask for, and the number one order is low cost.