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Blackgum Behavior

Started by chickenchaser, February 13, 2016, 07:23:39 PM

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chickenchaser

I started this as a reply to Hackberry Jake's thread in another section of the Forum, but opted for a new topic here...

I have a few blackgum logs - nice looking...straight and uniform. I was getting anxious to put toothed steel into them. Now, after reading some posts concerning said species, I'm not as optimistic for great lumber.

One of the logs has no bark left - none whatsoever. It came out of a bamboo thicket and has been down probably 5-6 years. I actually was hoping for cherry or white oak at the start, but decided it was red oak until I cut the butt end off. Also, I was surprised at the weight and soundness of the log.
The other logs were from a storm damaged blackgum I finally was able to take down back in November. It was less than 50' from the "barkless" log so I have eliminated most other possibilities and am 90% sure the mystery log is blackgum. All are under 16" diameter.

Can anyone tell me what to expect from the logs (lumber) when sawed?
Should old log behave any better than newer ones?

Nothing critical here. It can always be firewood. I just had - maybe unrealistic expectations.  :D

CC

WoodMizer LT35HD

JD 3720 w/loader. 1983 Chevrolet C30 dump. 1973 Ford F600 w/stickloader. 35,000 chickens.

Den-Den

Black gum is great wood for carving.  As lumber it will usually tend to be bland in color and grain pattern and prone to warping as it dries.  It is extremely difficult to split for firewood.  You already have the logs, not much to lose by sawing them.  I would suggest cutting somewhat thick so that some warp can be planed out.  Watch out for decay in the older logs.
You may think that you can or may think you can't; either way, you are right.

YoungStump

 You don't really have anything to lose by sawing it but I would consider it to be one of the ugliest woods I've cut, like den den said very bland and at least in the ones I cut you normally get very little clear lumber before your boards are covered in black knots, many of them partially rotten.
Echo Enterprises 45HD2 production series band mill, Cook's Edger, sawing mostly pallet cants, rr ties, and grade lumber.

drobertson

  trailer decking of heavy thicknesses,  keeping from twisting seems to be an issue during drying,, just checked google after remembering some folks do use it for flooring and some of it is veneered and used with laminate,, so, if you have them you can do some research and or experimentation, best knowledge is what comes from first hand experience. 
Images looked good to me,, and I know for fact its a durable wood surface from the trailer deck I've sawn, albeit sweet gum rather than black,, not real sure of the difference with these, but figure gum is gum,, so, go for it after you figure how to,,
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

WDH

It has spiral grain.  Flatsawn, it will almost certainly twist and warp, especially the first few boards off each of the four faces of the log.
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

POSTON WIDEHEAD

I saw a lot of Gum. Money wise, I get the most bucks out of a log by milling a log into a bench.
9 inches thick x 13 inches wide x 10 foot long with the top 2 edges beveled.
The legs are 2 Gum blocks 9 inches tall giving me an 18 inch high bench.
I get $200 for these benches.
No twisting or bad behavior at all.

Not a bad return on Gum.
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

YellowHammer

I've sawn a decent amount, it's very strong, and I use it for things that get banged up, such as my wood racks, farm lumber, and even my log deck.  I have customers ask for it as boards, and when I get enough requests I'll saw up a bunch of it, dry it, sell the half of the load that turns into potato chips for low cost project wood or make it into pallets, and take the half load that turned out OK and sell it at poplar prices. 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

dustyhat

Trailer decking , gives me a good idea sense i got gum and a trailer needing floored. how would it act bolting it in green?

YellowHammer

Quote from: dustyhat on February 13, 2016, 11:17:53 PM
Trailer decking , gives me a good idea sense i got gum and a trailer needing floored. how would it act bolting it in green?
As long as the trailer frame is stronger than the boards you are bolting in, it should work great. ;D  The black gum cross ties I've been using for my log deck have been laying on the ground for about three years, and they are still tough as nails.  No bugs, or significant rot yet.  The logs drop on them and bounce, and I've only run over them with my tractor about a hundred times.  They remind me of hard, heavy, tough rubber. 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

terrifictimbersllc

Quote from: POSTONLT40HD on February 13, 2016, 10:28:10 PM
I saw a lot of Gum. Money wise, I get the most bucks out of a log by milling a log into a bench.
9 inches thick x 13 inches wide x 10 foot long with the top 2 edges beveled.
The legs are 2 Gum blocks 9 inches tall giving me an 18 inch high bench.
I get $200 for these benches.
No twisting or bad behavior at all.

Not a bad return on Gum.
Pics?  I've been sawing out similar for another sawmill.  Love to see. 
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on February 14, 2016, 10:14:37 AM
Pics?  I've been sawing out similar for another sawmill.  Love to see.



  

  

 
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

chickenchaser

Quote from: Den-Den on February 13, 2016, 07:40:31 PM
Black gum is great wood for carving.
Sorry to be a bit "under informed" here. When you say carving, does that also mean it would be good or acceptable for turning? Especially for a prospective beginner?
WoodMizer LT35HD

JD 3720 w/loader. 1983 Chevrolet C30 dump. 1973 Ford F600 w/stickloader. 35,000 chickens.

terrifictimbersllc

Quote from: POSTONLT40HD on February 14, 2016, 02:40:13 PM
Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on February 14, 2016, 10:14:37 AM
Pics?  I've been sawing out similar for another sawmill.  Love to see.


  

  

 
Very nice, thank you. 
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

chickenchaser

WoodMizer LT35HD

JD 3720 w/loader. 1983 Chevrolet C30 dump. 1973 Ford F600 w/stickloader. 35,000 chickens.

Magicman

Black/Tupelo Gum was/is the choice species for making dough bowls.

 
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

chickenchaser

Thanks, Magicman.

I was shopping for a short cant hook at our local flea market couple weeks ago and looked at a dough bowl (oblong) dated by previous owners - supposedly.
1907...1930something and 1967. One of the topics was wood composition and I was trying to remember if he said blackgum. It was noticeably thinner (lighter) than the one my wife uses. He was asking $125. I didn't figure she needed two.  ;)

CC
WoodMizer LT35HD

JD 3720 w/loader. 1983 Chevrolet C30 dump. 1973 Ford F600 w/stickloader. 35,000 chickens.

Dan_Shade

Magicman, was that a flatsawn board left to its own devices?
Woodmizer LT40HDG25 / Stihl 066 alaskan
lots of dull bands and chains

There's a fine line between turning firewood into beautiful things and beautiful things into firewood.

landscraper

How soon in the air drying of black gum would one know whether there was going to be trouble with the lumber warping?
Firewood is energy independence on a personal scale.

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Quote from: landscraper on February 15, 2016, 04:10:58 PM
How soon in the air drying of black gum would one know whether there was going to be trouble with the lumber warping?

Get you a moisture meter. I like to get mine air dried down to 9%....Thats about as low as I can get it outside.
Then you can take the wood into your temperature controlled shop or even in the house and the MC will drop even more. I have worked with wood around 9% but like better around 4 or 5 if I can get it.
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Alligator

Quote from: Magicman on February 15, 2016, 08:41:59 AM
Black/Tupelo Gum was/is the choice species for making dough bowls.

MM do you see Black and Tupelo Gum as the same spices? They are real hard to tell apart.
Esterer Sash Gang is a  Money Machine

landscraper

Poston - Thanks, I'll check with my meter.  It's been stickered 2+ months and no warping yet, but with the winter weather it's probably not drying much at all yet.  It has been very windy this winter though, so maybe a little bit.

Checked it with my cheapy pin meter - 16-20%.  We shall see.
Firewood is energy independence on a personal scale.

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Quote from: Magicman on February 15, 2016, 08:41:59 AM
Black/Tupelo Gum was/is the choice species for making dough bowls.

Lynn, was this a family hand me down?
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Magicman

Quote from: Dan_Shade on February 15, 2016, 03:54:29 PMMagicman, was that a flatsawn board left to its own devices?
It was carved out, but I like your response/description better.   :)


Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Magicman

Quote from: Alligator on February 15, 2016, 05:22:16 PMMM do you see Black and Tupelo Gum as the same spices?
I am not a "tree-ologest", but to me they are cousins and their wood use is interchangeable.

Water Tupelo (tupelogum, sourwood) scientific = Nyssa aquatica.
Black Gum (black tupelo, sour gum, pepperidge) scientific = Nyssa sylvatica Marsh.
Swamp Tupelo (swamp blackgum, blackgum) scientific = Nyssa sylvatica bilflora
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Magicman

Quote from: POSTONLT40HD on February 15, 2016, 05:45:14 PMLynn, was this a family hand me down?
Yes, from my Mom.  Before that, I have no idea.   ???
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

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