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Hydraulic valve type quation

Started by DMcCoy, February 08, 2016, 08:38:17 AM

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DMcCoy

I'm looking to add hydraulics to my home made mill. Specifically I was wondering about what valve to use on my carriage motor to raise and lower the blade.  I want forward and reverse but also to allow the motor to free-wheel when the valve is in the neutral detent so I could adjust it manually for fine adjustment if needed.

Thanks in advance

pineywoods

www.surpluscenter.com. If they don't have it, you probably don't need it. I like the stackable type. You buy the 2 end plates and then ever how many valves of whatever type you need stack between the ends. 3 long bolts go through the entire stack. This gives you the option of different valve types in the same stack. Also makes it easy to add another valve when you later discover the need for a loader or clamp. The neutral option you mentioned for head up/down is called float, but I would question the need for it
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

Ox

An adjustable flow control valve plumbed in would work well for small and fine adjustments and controlling speed.  It's basically just a knob or valve that restricts the amount of oil allowed to pass through to a certain hydraulic function, sorta like a dimmer knob on your house lights.  One for carriage and one for head height would be ideal!
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

DMcCoy

Sorry post should have read question - (note to self don't type in dim light).

Yes, one for carriage travel and the other for height adjustment.
I'm also a big fan of Surplus Center - will be buying my parts there for sure.

Piney & Ox
No float?  and with flow control - will the motor stall at low speed?

I know zero about what I'm trying to accomplish.  The carriage travel I feel more confident about than the saw height.  My saw height right now is through a 40:1 gear box and 1 revolution of my handle gives me 1/8".   


 


Ox

With a flow control valve, you can adjust it from wide open (fast) to off (slow) and anything in between.  If you want a float position for the mill head height, you'd better make sure you have some heavy duty springs helping hold that baby up or you'll be holding the entire head weight by hand!  There are hydraulic gear motors and valves available ($$$) that will automatically keep the speed you choose without any further input from you.  If it encounters a heavier load, it'll add more fluid to keep the speed the same, kinda like cruise control.  I guess I'd keep it cheaper and simple.  A single valve for forward and back and another single valve for up and down, with a flow control running ahead of each one to control flow (speed) before it gets to the valve.  Select forward or back, turn the flow control valve to whatever speed you want and vice versa.  Same with the up and down.  You'll be able to finesse with this setup.
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Kbeitz

Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

Ga Mtn Man

I know a picture is worth a thousand words but in this case a few words word sure be helpful.
"If the women don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy." - Red Green


2012 LT40HDG29 with "Superized" hydraulics,  2 LogRite cant hooks, home-built log arch.

DMcCoy

The saw head holds as is, the gear box (worm drive) keeps it in it's place. 
Thinking a slight reduction between the hyd. motor and the gear box @1:3 or 3:1 motor faster than gear box input,  and leaving space for a handle to flip around.  I'm hoping the motor will go slow enough to skip the handle part completely

Any reason I couldn't use a ball valve to regulate flow?  Seals, pressure....?


Kbeitz

Quote from: Ga Mtn Man on February 08, 2016, 07:45:56 PM
I know a picture is worth a thousand words but in this case a few words word sure be helpful.

Thats a picture of a hydraulic flow control valve. Thought people would like to see what everyone is talking
about. Not everyone knows what one is.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

Ox

Maybe think of it this way:  In the picture Kbeitz posted is a hydraulic flow control valve.  This would be plumbed in ahead of a hydraulic drive motor (not a hydraulic pump).  You would use this flow valve the same way you would use a hydrostatic lawn tractor transmission.  You want more speed/power you move the lever further, just like you would step on the pedal on a foot-operated hydrostatic tractor.  Some searches on Youtube will likely give some nice videos of this stuff in action.
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

DMcCoy

Maybe I'm asking the wrong question.
I understand the flow control valve function.
My concern is when you drop the RPM on a DC motor the speed isn't smooth compared to higher RPM.
So with hydraulic motors can I reduce it down to say 10 rpm, will the speed be smooth enough to adjust the height or will it jerk and I will want a manual adjustment option.  Or do I need to set it up for higher speed for smoother operation.

Ox

Of course, this will depend on many factors, including the torque rating of the hydraulic motor.  However, the best and safest way is to, yes, gear it down so it's running fast and smooth.  You've got it.  :)
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

ladylake

 

On my mill with hyd feed with a flow control valve it feeds nice and smooth from o rpm and up.   Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Kbeitz

hydraulic pulses can also be smoothed out with a hydraulic accumulator inline.
Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

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