New Chainsaw Thoughts...

[kantuckid]

I'm an experienced user-maybe too experienced at that!
First some info-I much prefer Stihl saws. Current saw is a Farm Boss 034 that I bought new in 1989 and two years ago I rebuilt the saw due to normal wear on piston/jug,etc.. I bought a jug set and that juiced the saw up to the next cc's. That saw has no compression release-and I never needed one until lately! I had a full left side rotator cuff surgery on 12/19/14. I'm back to full service (that surgery takes about a year to just feel fairly normal -in the joint- FWIW) but when I hold the saw with my left surgery arm it's now become a PITA to start the saw. It starts like it always did, other than the increased effort from newer compression and like any Stihl. It's a jewel of a saw-I feel badly even looking for another saw! Like they say, gettin old's a pain!
I'm ready to move to a lighter, easier saw for both starting ease and operation based on overall weight.
I can get by fine on our land with a 16" bar as I will keep the bigger saw for larger trees as I have 16 & 20" bars for it.
In my area which is a huge hardwood market area (near Morehead) of E KY,  Stihl, Husquvarna and Echo are the main saws-and by far. A local dealer sells and services Echo, so parts are easy. I have owned two of their professional saws in the past and liked them well!
My "pick of the litter" so far, from a brief web search is the Echo CS-355T saw. I'm basing this on dry weight @ 8#'s, "easy start feature" and being a "pro level" model in Echo lineup. The top handle is OK with me too. MSRP is $349 and often discounted.
Ideas for my next "Senior years" chainsaw?  Lets keep this civil on brand choices! HA! :D

[kantuckid]

My web search so far shows the mfg.'s online sale through a local dealer pickup or via $23 ship to me sale as the best price? I had it in my head that Echo line was often discounted? The web sellers are marking them up a bunch over the Echo-USA price, ~ $100 or so. I often go by my nearest seller, a hardware/lumber/gas station spot & plan to ask what their price point is as sold from the store. yes, I expect them to profit but like most a good deal is nice. I see zero refurb's of the Echo brand. Google searches lead to Husky in every case.

This thread has lots of views and zero comments ???

[Ox]

I'm thinking lots of guys are looking for an answer as well but don't have the first hand experience with a smaller lighter saw?  I was here looking for info, too.  I wish I had a suggestion, but I've only ever used old Homelites, Echo, and Stihl saws.  My current saw is an 034 Super AV and it seems to get heavier every year.  I liked the old Homelite Super XLs back in the day.  They always started and ran excellent and were tough as nails.  Had so much torque that I could file the rakers down so much the chips felt like small pebbles hitting your legs and could keep up with the newer Husqvarna saws the boys were using.  They always just shook their heads in amazement!  But your arms and hands would be buzzing for hours after working. 
I've heard good things about the smaller pro Echo saws, if that is any help.  If you have a dealer close by - additional bonus points!

[kantuckid]

When I moved to KY in 1973 the Homelites were popular with loggers. As those wore out that changed over to Stihl and a few Huskies. The Stihl dealers sway the choice as Husky tends toward box store and web parts around here. Echo is common but not like Stihl.
As for the "hand buzz"- I had CTS release surgery in 2000 & 2001, helps a bunch and even was able to start riding MC's again! There's zero actual "fix" for CTS but so far surgery has been bought me some great senior time using my hands. Your 39 with buzz and I could have said the same back then. I stopped MC's in 1990(age 47) based on both hands were "dead" and unsafe to ride.  For the record I'm a lifetime rider.
There is more to C TS than just occupation/hobbies,etc., as the actual carpal tunnel varies with people-one person will never get it, another might be fairly young. When I was the admissions guy for my tech school, there were many sewing factories nearby(now gone overseas, save one that does uniforms for military) and it was a weekly event to have a lady come in with CTS-some couldn't hold a glass of water anymore! 
String trimmers were probably invented by hand docs? I wear winter Carhartt gloves all year for engine driven tools.
Tip of the day-When I ride MC's for long distance touring I wear the thin poly- propylene liners under my leather riding gloves-they really help with sweat and as a vibration absorber! Sold at any sporting store like Dick's, as many outdoor sports folks-skiers,etc., use them.
I built my cabin in 1979-80 with a small echo saw i bought new for the purpose-memory's weak on model but was a top handle, 14", red case, maybe CS3XX? model.  Zero complaints after many, many starts/restarts, all day long & much ladder & climbing walls to use. I cut all my corner joints with it, etc.. Sold to buy larger Echo to log with, also a great saw.
I'm still after Echo CS-355T talk... :D

[Cycledude]

I've rented Echo saws a few times and was always impressed by how easy they were to start, usually one pull but if it didn't start on the first pull they for sure started on the second pull.

[Greyhound]

The Echo CS-355T is a terrific saw.  Many a pro arborist chooses them.
If I were you, I would also learn to start my bigger saw on the ground with a foot in the handle (or between the legs) and pull with the right arm.  Your left shoulder is just too precious to ruin.

[ehp]

I know what your going threw , I have had both shoulders rebuilt , 52 pieces of steel in left shoulder 31 pieces in right shoulder , First if it was me and you like Stihl then look at the 362 as its basically took the 034/036 place years down the road , if your wanting something abit lighter then look at the 261 , the 261 is not going to have the power of your 034/036 top end but will still cut lots of wood , I know this is just me but I stay with the pro models not home owner . I have no idea on what top end you put on your saw , is it OEM or aftermarket but does the cylinder have a place to put a decompressure in the cylinder , even its its just the slug spot in the cylinder, pretty much any machine shop could drill, tap hole and put decompressure in your cylinder so saw would start a lot easier , its pretty easy to do , I have done lots of other saws

[gspren]

   The 261 Stihl is quite impressive after a few tanks to break it in. My 261 has a compression release although I seldom use it. I have heard that the 241 is really nice for a small/light saw in smaller wood but I never ran one myself.

[gfadvm]

I have an Echo CS-400 with an 18" bar that I am really happy with. It sees a lot of use felling and bucking hardwoods for my mill and is the easiest starting saw I have ever used by far. (if it doesn't start by the second pull, you need to flip the switch to ON). Cost $300 new and I have a great dealer/service guy 3 miles from me. I've had it for 6 years so far and no breakdowns.

[kantuckid]

The Echo CS-355T is a terrific saw.  Many a pro arborist chooses them.
If I were you, I would also learn to start my bigger saw on the ground with a foot in the handle (or between the legs) and pull with the right arm.  Your left shoulder is just too precious to ruin.

Thanks for the well meant comment-I do know how to safely start the saw.

Cold, I've always done a foot start but when hot in the past was often guilty of a free handed start-not now! For the record, even started on the ground the shock of the right handed/non-surgical side pull, when saw's cold is more than I'd like to experience. Think along the notion of your shoulders working together somewhat as you pull and the shock transfers- I suppose it's a personal thing but it is what it is...

I'm still wondering if the Echo "easy start" they advertise is based on the number of pulls or the ease of the pull"? It would seem to me that only a compression release or lower engine cc.'s would provide "physical effort" ease of starting. I own a Redmax 12" saw that I use when climbing, bought for one handed operation some years back. It doesn't start any faster than my Stihl saw but is far easier  handle pull- as would be expected. On switch, yeh  :D

Gosh, how do you put that much metal in a shoulder? I do know a guy that has his shoulder joint replaced but only a few parts, much like hip I got. I have 4 titanium screws 9long ones @$399/short ones @ $299- :D) that hold a "special cord" which is placed in a sq. pattern with an X pattern inside the sq.. I can still "feel" the cords in there ans some pain now and then-part of life, huh? I was told that it was barely possible to stitch down the "cuff" & lucky to even have a repair. Many here on this forum that are active in physical work have what are called "self healed" shoulders. mine had done that several times. In PT I also witnessed the number of younger people that have genetic "loose shoulders". Girl volleyball & softball players are highly at risk.

The compression release possibility is something I need to look at-before I buy anything else! I can still handle the overall weight of my bigger saw OK. As a retired tech teacher, I have the skill set/tools to do that myself. Never thought about it at the time just after rebuild as I was good to go "then", now not so much. FWIW, I had left hip anterior replacement surgery in Dec., so shop works tempting me now as off walker and cane  but still a no-no to bend over too far, extend leg, etc..

[ehp]

I got 2 plates but in left shoulder to hold the arm together and every tendon has major work done to them, I have my old bones as Surgeon thought it was best for me , Fun part is when you go for a xray and the person taking it doesnot know you had this steel put in , they sure come back and look to see why the xray is so bugger up , lots of times they donot take the shirt off so cannot see the scares . The 034/036 is a good saw and if you can put a decompressure in it I think I would

[kantuckid]

I went to courthouse to get new DL & vehicle taxes yesterday. When I went through the detector the deputy asked if I was carrying? He was my 3rd baseman long time back so not like we don't talk easy. I told him I was out to show off my new hip and no on the firearms thing.  :D

On the decompression valve: my Tecomec jug has a "slug spot" in the casting where "I think" (but don't really know) the valve goes? It's inline with the plug and centered between the shroud attachment stud and the rubber shroud bumper. Does anyone know if the threads are metric "pipe" or machine threads?
I don't have many metric pipe taps around, maybe two. Sure don't want to mess up the jug but it looks like the right spot to me as somewhat of a guess. The Stihl parts schematic for the 036 lacks detail to see the exact valve location. Aftermarket jugs photos also lack detail I need.

[fordf150]

decomp valves use a uncommon metric thread. 10x1 comes to mind but cant remember for sure.

try a snowblower handle on it. they are a little big and clunky on a saw but i have installed them on some older customers saws that had problems getting them started because of shoulder issues or arthritis in their hands. just a cheap and easy idea that might be worth a try. not sure why but being able to wrap your whole hand around the handle seems to make it much easier to pull over.

[kantuckid]

I have short fingers and like a sure hold on a chainsaw, so a thicker grip is the wrong direction for me but then I have no idea what a snowblower handle involves diameter wise, I use a shovel or a tractor blade only. I never go larger than OE on MC grips!

The two common metric machine threads are 10x1.25 & 10x1.5 and the coarse 1.5 is common on metric machines. I have encountered the fine on metric MC's.

HELP?
I need a look/see of the 036 jug:
What would help me confirm the placement of a valve hole in my Tecomec jug would be a picture of the top of a Stihl 036 OE jug where the hole location is shown. Thanks for the ideas so far. :new_year:

[DaveinNH]

x2 (and 3 and 4) for the 261. I have a 460 with a 20, 25 and 36 inch bar. Over the last 10 years I have used it for everything including a little milling when I was in between sawmills. My wife would use a 70 when I was not around but wanted a bigger saw. Since she had just gone through a bad rotator cup repair on her dominant shoulder we opted for the 261. She loves that saw and can start it with the decompression valve with no problems (she is also 57). At first I kind of ignored the "little saw" but I have fallen in love with it. It starts great without having to use the decompression valve for me and is my go to saw now if I don't need the extra horsepower for something big. The light weight is a joy to use. My dealer keeps telling me I would really love it with a more aggressive chain, but since it is supposed to be my wife's I keep anti kickback chains on it. Last year I was losing about a third of an acre to the state for a highway widening project. It had a lot of Oak on it so my step father came over several days to help me clear it. he is well over 20 years older than me. We dropped the trees and cut all of them to 18 inch lengths for firewood so I could haul them out with my 6x6 Polaris. Due to the terrain we would not have been able to skid them out even with a full size truck. After a few 8 hour days of cutting (me with the 460 and him with the 261) he loved the saw as well. So that's 3 people of different ages and genders who really like the 261

[ehp]

there 10mm by 1 for threads , Well at least most are this thread . Just remember if the decompressure is to be put in the combustion part of the cylinder so up by the spark plug make sure you use a decompressure that is meant for that style and from that cc size of motor , if you use a valve from say a husky that's off the side of the cylinder the hole in the valve will be to big and let off to much pressure and saw will not start as compression will be to low . all so when drill the hole that goes into the bore/combustion chamber make sure that hole is smaller than the end of the valve that moves in when you push the decompressure on, Reason is if you break the valve this way the valve end cannot fit threw the hole and get into the motor and also lots of the stihl decompressures have 3 steel balls that the end part pushes threw in the valve and if the end part get broke also the 3 balls will be loose as well and get into the motor

[DonnerParty]

I don't know if you bought another saw yet, but I'll throw in another vote for the 261 C-M. Lots of power for its size, really easy to start, and sips gas.

[kantuckid]

I wonder what dealers will do on a new 214? I ask because I found a lightly used 241 and with shipping it's not far from a new one. The echo that comes in @ 8#'s is tempting too.
In taking a hard look at my old saw it looks dicey to clear a flat spot where a decompression valve will seat in my jug top and not be too close to the spark plug. Requires removal of at least part of a fin in the top of the jug. I got my taps and now getting cold feet to mess up a very good saw!

[rick carpenter]

Kantuckid, I had "SLAP Lesion" surgery (Superior Labrum, Anterior to Posterior = torn upper glenoid labrum on the shoulder socket) on my left shoulder in summer 2012, but with apparently the same recovery issues as rotator cuff surgery. I went completely through the physical therapy but didn't really feel like it accomplished anything. Same range of motion issues, pain, etc. Until...

In Nov 2014 I took on a bookroom warehouse job which entails plenty of regular unloading/lifting/moving/sorting/reloading pallet-loads of 30+lb boxes of books at different heights and odd angles. After just a little time of that, I noticed my left arm felt better than it had in many years. Now, it still makes popping sounds but I know I'm healed.

Bottom line, try a lot of "regular irregular" exercise for your arm.

[kantuckid]

From my full rotator cuff tear rehab on 12/19/14 I was released from PT in PT center sessions to twice a day home sessions in mid April/2014. They told me I was the fastest to gain full ROM to their memory. As a former HS & college athlete, I had done sveral rehabs prior but all were when much younger, stronger, etc.. 8) At 72 years it all comes more slowly-if at all. Not everyone's "fixable" for the condition they're in.
As soon as I was told I was OK to pursue "somewhat" normal activities, I was back in my game as land owner and more. We/I do everything but fix our TV around here. Angie's list doesn't even exist, if we did want it. Believe me, I've tried many times to get a HS kid to help with my jobs! They have in KY, "Youth Service Centers" located within all schools that help low income, high need kids stay in school and have things they need. Given that my wife & I are retired teachers, were safe around kids too! Not only that but I taught several trades so a kid can learn around me & things I pursue. Throw in that I live in one of the poorest counties in all the USA,really! It's been years since I had one kid to help and I pay decent too. Thus, it's a "me, myself and I operation" here?  :D
So last spring I started a huge log home refinish job. House was re-chinked, chemically cleaned with sodium percarbonate(the goodie in oxyclean) and just prior to finish application, I sanded the entire 2 story,3,000'plus house with a 5" Makita random orbital sander and 120grit. I used both hands when on the ladder to avoid toting the ladder too much. In certain directions I'm still far from full strength and will likely never regain what I had IMO. I also get the pains that come with having a "specialized cord" wrapped around 4 titanium screws in my shoulder. Some pains are probably age related like others all seniors get.
My total hip replacement doc asked me in fall 2015, prior to hip surgery, why don't you just get someone to do it! I was into a "somewhatish pity party/description" about the "issues" of refinishing my home what with 3 each, 6-8 week "sessions" of sciatica during the job and thrown in my left legs splayed out at an angle as hips far gone.
I could have told him that the $20,000 a log home restoration company would have charged but why embarass him over our income difference... ;D

Hows that for "regular irregular exercise" my shoulder? Actually there's more.
My newish Stihl 241 saw came in 2 days ago but given fact now my tractor doesn't start and there's ~15" snow all over it (from where I moved it to the house with blade installed for the new snow) I guess it'll sit a bit, like the saw.
I'm ahead @ our latest scrabble game!

[kantuckid]

 Bump on my new saw:
Stihl MS 241 C. I cleaned it up, took a look @ the piston/cyl. and it appears to have been owned a very short time by a total rube. Saw was very dirty as it came to me in the mail. Guy must have downed one tree then attacked the stump as it had soil where most get wood dust,etc.. The inside of jug & piston look brand new and once cleaned up the saw does all it should. I love that decompression valve dearly! That saw has a 'throaty growl" that makes you think of power which it seems to have plenty for 43cc's. I ran it on a piece of firewood outside the shop and I'm gonna like this one me thinks!
Ordered some Leftcoast chains & smaller files & I'll be good to go here.
The saw has much of the general feel and outward look of the red Jonsereds @ TSC which had become my 2nd choice if my bid on this pawnshop saw(no I didn't pay $ 550 for this one) had fallen through. I'm happy with my new toy! 8)