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Felling my 1st Big Ash

Started by ReggieT, October 15, 2015, 12:46:19 AM

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ReggieT

Headed out to a friends pasture...he has an assortment of oak & white ash.
He'd like me to remove a 45 ft Ash that has a slight forward lean...nothing within a 100 ft of the felling direction, easy escape routes, no other tree with 30-40 ft to either side.
YET, my skill set is bucking to firewood length...not felling.

Just fired my old friend who can't stay sober  smiley_alcoholic_01..but was a Wizard in the woods and at felling trees!!!  :'(
So my main experience is now a goner.
My primary concern is everything I've read about Ash being prone to "barber chairing" :o

Any advice or suggestions you guys could provide would be appreciated.
Dolmar 116si is in the shop AGAIN...so it will be the MS390 20 in bar & the 025 for limbing.

Reg

beenthere

Make yourself a good notch, then plunge bore in behind the notch and then enough toward the notch to carefully make a good 1-1½" hinge. Then cut out toward the back leaving some holding wood.
When all is clear, cut just above the holding wood and the tree will drop fast. 
There will be no barberchair.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

ReggieT

Hmm...sounds just like some of the bore video's I've been watching and reading...do I plunge in through the narrow face cut?

beenthere

Answer depends on diameter of the tree at the cut. You said you had a 20" bar.

south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

petefrom bearswamp

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nitehawk55

With the lean would doing a trigger cut be a good method ? Google is your friend
I AM NOT BRAND LOYAL !

John Mc

Quote from: ReggieT on October 15, 2015, 01:24:16 AM
Hmm...sounds just like some of the bore video's I've been watching and reading...do I plunge in through the narrow face cut?

Ditto what Beenthere said.  Forward leaning ash is the perfect place to use a bore cut. Here's a bit more detail:

Make a normal notch, avoiding any bypass in the notch cuts. I'd put a good opening (70˚ or more included angle in the notch, so it doesn't close too early as the tree is on the way down).  The bore goes parallel to the hinge. I usually do the bore back a bit away from where I want the back of the hinge to be. THis give a little insurance that you don't cut accidentally cut into your hinge when boring. Once I'm through the tree, I cut back toward the hinge to set the desired thickness of the hinge (usually about 10% of the DBH - Diameter at Breast Height). Then I'll cut towards the back, leaving a strip of wood at the back to hold the tree in place (the trigger or holding wood). When I'm ready for the tree to fall, I cut the trigger and back away.  Don't hang around the stump admiring your handiwork as the tree falls. No method is fool proof, especially the first time you try it. It's a good idea not to retreat straight back from the stump opposite the direction of fall. If it barberchairs, that piece is probably coming straight back, so you don;t want to be there.

The idea of the bore cut on a forward leaner is that it lets you set up your hinge just the way you want it while the tree is still fixed in place, then go back and release it to let it fall. This works well on a forward leaning tree. If you just cut in from the back, the tree may start to fall before you've established the proper hinge thickness - and that can cause barber chair, especially on ash.

If the tree is too long for your bar to reach all the way through on the bore cut, you can bore in from both sides, just behind the hinge. It's not necessary that the two bore cuts meet up exactly, as long as you have severed all the fibers (i.e. if one bore cut overlaps the other but is 1/2" above it, that won't hurt anything).

If you haven't done a bore cut, you might want to practice it on a log or a high stump first, especially to get the hang of starting the bore. IF it's not done right, you may get some chatter and bounce the nose of the bar around as you try to start the bore. If you need pointers on that, let us know.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

BenTN

Great advice in the above posts. One thing I would caution. If this is an eab kill and has been standing dead a couple years, ash tends to go punky very quick. I would be careful once you finish the bore cut and move to cut the trigger. If the trigger is not thick enough then the tree may fall before you release it. Always have an escape route as stated and definitely  wear some head gear.  Ash drop a lot of branches on the way down if they have been dead for a while.

John Mc

Good point, BenTN.  I hadn't thought about the possibility of it being dead (EAB hasn't hit here yet, so we still have quite a few healthy Ash).

A tip to consider if you are cutting a dead tree - cut a higher stump that allows you to stand more upright when cutting. You can get away more quickly if something goes wrong, and you present a smaller target to falling limbs (and a good bit of that target is covered by a helmet).
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

Pine Ridge

Reggie t , lots of good information and tips about bore cutting from members here. You might also think about taking the game of logging class, it teaches the open face bore cut. The instructor i learned from was a wealth of knowledge. Hands on training under the watchful eye of an experienced instructor will pay huge dividends in the long run.    Be safe, pine ridge.
Husqvarna 550xp , 2- 372xp and a 288xp, Chevy 4x4 winch truck

John Mc

I don;t think there's a Game of Logging training organization down Reggie's way (AL).  There are other organizations doing similar things in the SE US.

Tim Ard at Forest Applications Training comes to mind. He used to be associated with the Game of Logging, and teaches a lot of the same techniques. I have no personal experience with him or his organization, nor do I know anyone who has been through his courses (he doesn't operate much up here in the Northeast). I've just heard/read about him online. Might be worth checking out.

I'm not saying GOL is the only way to fell a tree, but getting yourself some sort of formal instruction is a great way to get some experience safely and quickly. One of the things I like about GOL is that they don;t just say "do this". They explain the reasoning and the "physics" behind what they are doing. This makes it easier to adapt the techniques to the many different situations you find working in the woods.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

ReggieT

Great advice guys...especially about the classes.
I'll be back out by this tree tomorrow...I'll post some pics.
I've really fallen in love with tree's, chainsaws, nature, and firewood...due to a blown HVAC systerm years ago right at the end of summer through the cold of winter.
I was laid off, drawing unemployment...and I had to get out and really hustle for heat...
The rest is history! :D
Already looking at taking some small engine repair classes as well...any particular school or course work you guys would recommend?
Enjoy the pic! 8)


 

North River Energy

QuoteAlready looking at taking some small engine repair classes as well...any particular school or course work you guys would recommend?

The approach taken depends a bit on how you, as an individual, learn best.
Mechanical repair work, is, by nature 'hands on'.  So the most effective way to become proficient is to get your hands on a small engine that runs, take it apart, then put it back together.  If it doesn't run, repeat the process until every part looks familiar, and until you have an understanding of how each part affects each other part.
At which time it should probably operate as intended when you give the rope a tug.

Then find an engine that doesn't run, (best if you don't know why), and repeat the process.

If you can build a fire, you can probably fix an engine.  The underlying principles are more or less the same.

ReggieT

Thanks...I'm a pretty quick study went back to school after a 32 yrs hiatus & destroying tons of healthy brain cells and finished with a 3.80 GPA...BUT that was all book stuff...
Mechanical ability/prowess has never been my strong suit! :P smiley_crying

I see some decent online offerings...hmm
I will try the engine breakdown & re-assembly

SFires

Just a quick input. When you practice your plunge cut like beenthere said please practice on a tall stump.  There is a difference between a horizontal and a vertical plunge
A man can always use more tools, more space,more wood, and a whole lot more time.

ReggieT

****PICS****

  

  

  

 
Now what method of felling would you Lumber Studs employ??? ??? popcorn_smiley
...err that is a white ash correct?? :P

BenTN

Without a closer look at the leaves, I would say that is hickory. The nuts on the ground give it away, unless they are from another tree. Not a bad lean at all from the pics. I would just drop it with a standard notch and back cut.

ReggieT

Here is a leaf...what type of Hickory do you think Ben."mockernut, pignut..etc?

  

John Mc

If that's a hickory, then you have only part of the leaf. Hickory is a compound leaf. Pignut Hickory usually has about 9 leaflets, Mockernut Hickory has about 7.  From the bark, I'm guessing that's a Mockernut Hickory.  I'm no expert on hickories, however.

You might try an online search under tree identification, or visit LeafSnap, click on the "species" tab and type hickory in the search bar. It will give you about 4 choices of Hickories in their database. See if Mockernut matches up with what you've got.

Any special plans for the wood?
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

BenTN

I would guess that it's mockernut. With the tight diamond furrows in the bark, especially if the leaves have 7 leaflets per leaf (full leaf). 6 - 1/2 dozen if it's firewood, great btu's in a couple years. Not my preferred hickory for BBQ but it works ok. I prefer a white hickory like shagbark for smoking.

ReggieT

Quote from: John Mc on October 26, 2015, 09:49:10 AM
If that's a hickory, then you have only part of the leaf. Hickory is a compound leaf. Pignut Hickory usually has about 9 leaflets, Mockernut Hickory has about 7.  From the bark, I'm guessing that's a Mockernut Hickory.  I'm no expert on hickories, however.

You might try an online search under tree identification, or visit LeafSnap, click on the "species" tab and type hickory in the search bar. It will give you about 4 choices of Hickories in their database. See if Mockernut matches up with what you've got.

Any special plans for the wood?
Not for sure...I'm thinking some of the Bar-B-Q joints/ Restaurants might be a prospect since I have about 7 tree's like this...if not I'll just, "drop em, buck em, split em & stack em" for next year's firewood.
Thanks for that link...checking it now! 8)
~Reg

ReggieT

Mockernut it is gents!
Thanks...I have some pignut saved from another wood gathering venture...Excellent Smoking Material...I mix it with cherry and it's hard to beat!! smiley_clapping dancing-jack

John Mc

You might get a good board or two out of that tree, if you had a project to use it in?

We have some Hickory cabinets in our kitchen that look great.
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

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