saw build ???

[breazyears]

I have started a build. I have settled on a 167 inch blade, this is a size that is readily available to me. its that or 144, and I feel 144 is to small with the 21 inch tires I will be using. With the 167 blade I will get 30 inches between the tires on their center, considerably more at the blade.
I have chatted with a few of you on this build on another thread I started a while ago... thanks for the help.
The engine is 13HP, im using a 3 inch centrifugal clutch off the engine, to a 12 inch driven pulley, this will give me a FPM speed of approximately 4700... if I did my math right??? Does this speed seem OK? My free wheeling tire is mounted to a 2000LB hub with a 1.500 inch stub nested in two heavy duty pillow blocks. The driven wheel is a 2500LB hub with a 1.750 stub. This will be welded to the tension, and tracking mechanism... This will be better explained with photos once it is done.
I have drawn up the plans for the build, and gone over them many times tweaking, and recalculating, tweaking, and recalculating.... Im pretty sure im good to go on this. Keeping everything nice and square when welding will probably be my biggest challenge.
A little warning ahead of time. Their WILL be questions. I hope you guys don't mind.

[sumday]

Looking forward to following your progress. I, for one, am enjoying the many recent build threads. It's really getting me to looking at all my junk/treasure piles and exploring possibilities.

[CaseyK]

Welcome to the forum and congrads on taking the plunge and starting a build.

[Ox]

It sounds like your basic bases are covered.  Those shaft setups sound solid enough.  The harmonics that build up in shafts is incredible.  I've seen tractor PTO shafts broken right off just because of the time on them and amount of revolutions.

[gww]

I welded my wheel bearings solid to my frame and tension bars.  I had only tack welded the wheels so was able to grind them lose and readjust the wheel alignment (bottom or the wheel) in or out based on the blade on the wheel and the head on the track.  My opinion is this adjustment is important after the mill is mounted on the cutting rail and a blade is on.  Only after the blade is on was I able to be sure of its alighment to the track and so the adjustment at that point before making too solid seems important.  Others may not have even needed this but I must have been off a bit cause I believe this was one of the things when adressed really made my mill better.  I hope this is understandable and helpfull. 
Good luck and how exciting'
gww

[Ox]

Following along with gww's post, it IS a good idea to test fit everything with tack welds in case something is off.  This is what I did with my build.  It takes longer but I think it's worth it, especially when I make all sorts of mistakes and don't realize it until I go to assemble things.  You may not have the problems I do with seeing things backwards, but I think it's just good practice to test fit things before you make it solid with good welds.

[breazyears]

Yes, tack welding first is in my plan of attack...Thanks guys.
Going to order the steel for the head build today. going to go pick up blades at Norwood on Friday. Its nice having them close.
Ill be taking pics soon, and compiling a journal of sorts. Ill post here as I go.

[gww]

breazy

Ill be taking pics soon, and compiling a journal of sorts. Ill post here as I go.

Something to look forward to.
gww

[Hilltop366]

  Thanks for posting!

[Ox]

A build journal is priceless to people.  It can answer so many questions and put peoples' minds to rest when they see things like this.  Thank you for doing so!

[breazyears]

Got looking at my engine today, and noticed that my drive pulley is a 3.7 inch. I thought it was a 3 inch. This is going to change my build.
I don't want to change the drive pulley as it is a centrifugal clutch, and I really don't want to go any bigger than 12 inches on my driven pulley. Both of these options would be expensive.
if I was to leave things as they are and use a 12 inch pulley with that clutch I would get 6105FPM. I could however... go from my drive to a 3 inch, and on that same axle a 4 inch, witch would intern drive a 12 inch at my wheel giving me 4578FPM.
To me...from what I have read. 4578 would be a much better speed. My concern would be... how much torque am I loosing???
Any thoughts?

[Ox]

You would actually be gaining torque this way.  Think of it like shifting gears to a lower one to climb a hill.  You would be losing a fraction of a horsepower when running the jackshaft but it'll be pretty much unnoticable.  You're on the right track with your thinking and the plan you just came up with will work fine.  The blade speed is fine with this setup.  6000 is too fast.  Our member gww had a problem with too fast a blade speed and used a jackshaft to slow it down and is now cutting well.

[york]

Hi,do it right and order the larger pulley from Cooks,they are cheap.....

[gww]

breezy
To be honest, I like the ideal of direct drive much better cause you are only using one belt.  I had trouble with the tightness of my build when I added the jack shaft.  I didn't have room to align the pullys to compleete perfection.  That said, when I had direct drive from the motor to the wheel, it seemed to put more stress on the tensioning of the blade and flexing of the mill.  When I added the jack shaft it changed the dynamics and the mill is better flex wise.

I to went the jackshaft rout cause I already had the parts for free and my mill is cutting really good. I do think that a direct drive is simpler and only one belt but I am cheap so went the way I went.  As far as the torque.  I only have a nine horse and not a thirteen and I can't kill the motor cause I would get belt slippage before that happened.  I was over 8000 and maby at 9000 fps and now I am at your target and I noticed no issues with a loss of torque.  Either way you go will work well if your mill is strong enough to tension the blade well and your belt alignment is good.  If you are going to cut lots and lots of wood, It might be worth it to end up with only one belt to deal with.  My mill is working good now (knock on wood) with two belts.

Things to think about from you perspective but like ox says,  speed does matter and it will work good if you go with the jack shaft.  Align the belts well, get as much belt surface as posible to ride on the pully and you will be golden.
Good luck
gww

[breazyears]

York.. To get me to my desired FPM, I would need a 16in pulley. The cheapest I could find is $125 US. Add the shipping, and convert to Canadian $$$ and im in over $200 just for a pulley. I wont pay that just out of principle lol. ant seem to find anything local.
Trust me, I would much rather do the direct drive.
I am going to continue a search for a pulley as their is a lot of other things that I can work on before I get to that.
Thanks.

[gww]

Breezy
You mention a 3 inch pully.  I am guessing that won't fit your motor clutch in any way.  I saw on another build where some one had two pullys riding on a motor clutch.  If you could put the three incher on your motor in some way, you would be home free with just one belt.

Here is the thread and hopefully it takes you to page 6 which is where this is discussed.

https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,82853.100.html
Good luck
gww

[breazyears]

IM back,
I have made a lot of progress with the mill build. The entire head is built with engine, jack shaft, tires, lift mechanism, etc.
I still need to make the guides. I am thinking about making the actual roller part with thrust bearings. My concern with this is, the coolant will quickly wash the grease from the bearings and ruin them in no time... at least that's what im thinking.
I have a good mind to bite the bullet on this one and purchase the rollers from Norwood as they are not far from me. Does anyone out their have experience with making their own blade guides? What did you do? How do they work for ya? Have they held up?
My camera will not shake hands with my computer, and thus I cant post pics yet. I will try and figure this problem out and get some pics up for everybody.
Thanks.

[gww]

breezy
Leggman made me a set of guides.  I can't tell you how long they will last because I have only cut 15 or so logs.  I can tell you they work absolutly great right now and I absolutly love them.  I have heard on high production mills that even the cook hardened roller guides will wear down on the front.  If you go to leggmans profile and find the post on his mill build he says what bearing he is using and he makes the roller guide on his lave.



 

The above picture is what he gave me and I have installed on my mill.  This is one of the best gifts I have ever recieved and it came from a stranger that I didn't know at the time and has made my boards come out exceptionally well since installation.

I really hope this helps give you some kind of ideal that may be helpfull.
gww

[Buffer]

Princess Auto has 16" weld on pulleys for 60 dollars Canadian, and the weld on hubs of various ids' are $7.50 Canadian. Oh, Welcome to the forum, great place to be.

[breazyears]

going to try posting a photo.

  

 

[breazyears]

 OK... guess that worked TWICE.
Ill post some pics from start to where im at now. Going to try re-sizing them a little first.

[breazyears]

Going to try this.


 
Made a little jig to drill into the corners


 
Clamped everything up , making sure its all square, and everything is where its supposed to be.


 
Made these dewdas to keep things even on the up and down. They can be "jacked" in or out to center the head on the vertical beams.


 


 


 
These are the guides I made. They will have to do for now until I can get some proper ones. They are fully adjustable. I plan on drilling, and tapping the 5/8 bolt to accept a grease fitting.


  
Here's a pic or my drive. As you can see I used a jack shaft. The clutch is 3.7" this drives a 4"on the jack shaft. A 3" (also on the jack shaft) drives a 12" on the wheel axle.This gives me a FPM of aprox 4500.


 
This is my tesion set up. The tracking is also on this side. The axle stub is welded into 2.5"x.230 wall square tube that has a 2"square tube with a 1/8" wall welded into it, this gives me a 1 3/4" square hole that the axle stub fits snugly into. Then a 5/8" pivot hole is drilled threw the whole thing, and is cinched down with a bolt on the opposite end... Make sense??? The drive side tracking is achieved by simply jacking the pillow blocks in or out.


 
I am working on the guarding now, then its on to the bed.
If you have any suggestions, or questions please feel free.

[gww]

This is not a critical comment at all as you look like you are doing great work to me.

I had seen a mill design like yours where they had the shaft coming all the way through the wheels and then had bracing with pillow blocks on each side of the wheel and it looked really stable.  My mill is built with two poles for the head like yours is and my metal is much thinner then what you are using and it cuts just fine.  I just didn't know if you have seen all the designs that are out there and thought I would mention it.

I noticed your welds.  I really weld bad so it always kind of draws my eyes to good ones cause I am jelous of that skill.  Your welds look great.

Good job on the pictures.
Good luck
gww

[Den-Den]

Looking good, nice job on the fabrication.
My guides are a lot like yours, they work great.  I see no reason to change them until the bearings wear out. 
You will have to keep the second belt quite tight to transfer full engine power.  My mill is running slower band-speed and more power so more torque on the jack-shaft; it takes two "BX" belts fairly tight to avoid slipping.
I like the adjustable rollers you put on the vertical travel, a slick set up.
It takes more tension on the bands than I realized before building, you will want to lube up that tension screw and plan on putting quite a bit of torque on it.
You will be cutting wood pretty soon.

[Ox]

Thanks for taking the time to post pics.  We all like them.  Your mill is looking nice and rugged with neat ideas built in and I see no reason why it won't work just as you're hoping it will!