iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

gas engine replacement for Detroit 353

Started by mjeselskis, February 28, 2015, 08:27:27 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

mjeselskis

I'm toying with the idea of replacing the 353 in my tree farmer. It runs good, but it's loud, sloppy, leaky, and did I mention loud...?  I have the 4 speed transmission behind it.  I like the idea of gas since they start well in the cold, they are quiet, and simple.

Has anyone done a similar swap?
2006 WM LT28  1993 John Deere 5300
Husqvarna 562XP & 365 X-Torq

mjeselskis

I just found a 4.3 carb'd v6. Thinking that would be a good swap.
2006 WM LT28  1993 John Deere 5300
Husqvarna 562XP & 365 X-Torq

Southside

How do the torque / rpm values of the two engines compare?  That would be my concern with the swap.  What about going with a 4BT Cummins? 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

dgdrls

I have not done it or seen it done.  I suspect you would not be happy with the end result of a gas trade.
Understanding its a Detroit 2 cycle its inherently a loud motor, however  since it runs well perhaps it would be worth looking
at a bigger muffler/resonator system, and some sound deadening mat material in the engine bay?
Turbo charged??

Best
DGDrls



mjeselskis

I thought about a 4bt, but I'd still be faced with a hard starting engine in the cold. Most of my logging is fine in the winter and gas engines seem to always start. The 4.3 has more power, but I think if I kept the rpm low and maybe limit it to the max rpm of the Detroit, is be OK. I know some people have swapped in 350 V8's so a 4.3 should be doable
2006 WM LT28  1993 John Deere 5300
Husqvarna 562XP & 365 X-Torq

Corley5

C4s were available with 4 cylinder Ford industrial engines.  302 V8s would bolt to that bell housing  8)  More than one of those conversions was done up here.  I had a Franklin 120 with a 350 Chevy.  Liked gas but would pull wood.  With the divorced transfer case you can put just about anything in there you want  8) 8)
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

mjeselskis

Yeah. The options seem pretty endless, especially if i picked up a engine/ttans combo. I think this trans is a T18, which i think came in skit a lot of old ford trucks.

If I was really adventurous, I'd swap in a fuel injected engine... I have a TBI 305 with 50k sitting in the corner of the garage...
2006 WM LT28  1993 John Deere 5300
Husqvarna 562XP & 365 X-Torq

MT logger

My 4bt started the other morning -24 no preheater or starting fluid.

lopet

What if price of gas goes up again or higher where it has been ?  Just a though.
I understand a older V8 would be pretty thirsty.
Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
Also remember, it's not the fall what hurts, its the sudden stop. !!

North River Energy

FWIW, my old IH loader has a 263 gasser, starts remarkably well in the cold despite it's age.  The DD353 is listed as the alternate in the service manual.
Then again, you might not have the room for an inline six, and probably want something newer.
Regardless, try to find an engine with a similar torque curve to what you have.

mjeselskis

Fuel consumption is a concern, but only a small one. This only gets used 50 hrs/year
2006 WM LT28  1993 John Deere 5300
Husqvarna 562XP & 365 X-Torq

sprucebunny

I'd be looking at a Ford 300/6 for the low end torque. Chrysler Industrial 251 has low end torque also. Newer engines have a higher rpm power band which also makes them relatively thirstyer.
I have these engines in older equipment and have put electronic points on them. Very dependable.
MS193, MS192 and an 026  Weeding and Thinning. Gilbert Champion sawmill

mjeselskis

The Ford 300 is a good pick. I'm thinking it would be too long for the engine bay? Did Ford make a 4 cyl "baby brother" of the 300?  The 300 makes good torque and they seem to run forever
2006 WM LT28  1993 John Deere 5300
Husqvarna 562XP & 365 X-Torq

timberjack 240a

Fwiw, if the machine only gets used 50hr per year I would leave it alone. If you want to quiet it down though, I have a 353t in my machine. Quietest detroit around. I believe you could put a turbo on any of them. There are a few other differences than just the turbo but it would still work. Get a little more power and quiet it down.
When all else fails, cut it and see what happens.
2016 kenworth t800, rotobec elite, timberjack 240a, deere 450j, kobelco 70sr, mahindra 4035, to many saws to count

mjeselskis

I'm also concerned about the cost when if the 353 did break. I'm thinking I can get decent money around here if I sell the good running Detroit and use that money for the swap.
2006 WM LT28  1993 John Deere 5300
Husqvarna 562XP & 365 X-Torq

chester_tree _farmah

Hi mj. My C4 was converted to a 75 300 6 industrial. It fits. I have seen the 300 conversion in quite a few old skidders in these parts. A friend had a TJ with one too. Legendary engine. If the 353 still runs good I would wait till she caves though. IMO.
254xp
C4B Can-Car Tree Farmer
Ford 1720 4wd loader hoe

bushmechanic

I put a 250 straight six chevy in my 201B Timberjack. It runs ok but not big on torque, I don't think it starts as good as a diesel wintertime. I use mine for snow clearing and my firewood. Now your right about the quiet, I plow along by my father's house and if he don't hear the chains clinking he don't  hear the machine. I had to put 7 inches in the frame to make it fit and use a 4 speed from a 1/2 ton pickup. It was a lot of work and I don't think I would do it again, not with a gasser. For the amount of time you use it I would not bother just get a big 3 inch truck muffler or ear plugs and ear muff's.   

ga jones

380c timberjack c4 treefarmer international trucks jonsered saws. Sugi hara bars d31 komatsu 350 tj grapple

Maine logger88

I personally wouldn't do it I wouldn't wanna give up the diesel reliability for a gasser. As far as loud goes I would put a big muffler behind the spark arrestor and run it.
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

nk14zp

Quote from: mjeselskis on March 01, 2015, 07:17:13 AM
I'm also concerned about the cost when if the 353 did break. I'm thinking I can get decent money around here if I sell the good running Detroit and use that money for the swap.
What part of Me are you in and how much for the 353?
Belsaw 36/18 duplex mill.
Belsaw 802 edger.
http://belsawsawmills.freeforums.org/

tantoy

1968 Garrett 20 Skidder
1991 Ford 1920 Tractor/Loader
2000 Takeuchi tb135 Excavator
Stihl 020, 041 Super, 084
Husqvarna 61, 181SE, 357XP

Woodhauler

Quote from: mjeselskis on February 28, 2015, 08:27:27 PM
I'm toying with the idea of replacing the 353 in my tree farmer. It runs good, but it's loud, sloppy, leaky, and did I mention loud...?  I have the 4 speed transmission behind it.  I like the idea of gas since they start well in the cold, they are quiet, and simple.

Has anyone done a similar swap?
You may try and find a power plant out of a toyota prius! No noise and green as you can get! :D ;D
2013 westernstar tri-axle with 2015 rotobec elite 80 loader!Sold 2000 westernstar tractor with stairs air ride trailer and a 1985 huskybrute 175 T/L loader!

treeslayer2003


mjeselskis

Hmmm... Apparently not a popular swap. People seem to love the Detroit engine, just not sure why.
2006 WM LT28  1993 John Deere 5300
Husqvarna 562XP & 365 X-Torq

Maine logger88

It's good cheap horsepower that just seems to run day in day out. They are not my favorite engine but there a good one. Easy on fuel to
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

Thank You Sponsors!