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Larch?

Started by Evergreen Man, February 23, 2015, 08:06:34 PM

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Chuck White

We've used Tamarack for framing material and put it up "right off the mill".

Haven't had any problems with it!

I redecked my 6x12 flatbead trailer with Tamarack in 2006, or 2007 and it has stayed well through the Summer through Spring.

As soon as the weather turned warm and the boards dried out from the Winter's snow and the Spring rains, I painted the boards down with used motor oil, and in 2011 I painted them with another coating, and they're still doing good!
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
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Evergreen Man

I was going to use White Pine as Board and batten and stain it, to side our cottages with. But I can buy the Larch for the same price, if this stuff looks like it will behave ok I might switch to Larch, I put my siding on with 2" deck screws, has to be a really stubborn board for me to not be able to push it into place.
But maybe the Larch would just crack on me?
I used to think I was crazy, then I realized: I'm the only normal one.

Southside

I built a big barn back in Maine out of Tamarack, some called it Larch - the needles fall off in the winter -  Anyway the second floor hay mow was decked with 2" T+G Tamarack, that stuff was excellent.  Yes one or two pieces had some slivers that peeled up - sort of a shake flaking effect I would say, but better selection of those pieces would have fixed that problem.  I was very, very, happy with the wear and appearance of that floor and ceiling.  We put it down green - and it was heavy, but nailed with a framing nailer through the tongue with no issues. 
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SwampDonkey

Eastern larch grows across the country here except the west coast, but it is in the upper Fraser valley. So there is no scarcity of it. However when you look at the texts between tamarack an western larch, the tamarack is mentioned for poles, ties, posts, pallets, pulp and crates. Western larch is more prized, and the first thing mentioned is timbers, planks and boards, rough sawn lumber, glue laminated beams, flooring, interior finish, veneer on and on. An entirely different outlook. ;D
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1 Thessalonians 5:21

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rooster 58

I love to see a larch grove in the fall. The needles turn a beautiful golden yellow,  not unlike quaking aspen. And the limbs up sweep somewhat cathedral style. Yup, larch is beautiful on the stump and on the wall or floor ;)

Bandmill Bandit

i have sawn some larch for barn floors and for skids for sheds and small cabins. One guy used 2x4 T&G larch for the cabin floor with screw rails attached to the skids and then screws from bottom up. Larch Skids on 16 inch centres on a 12X20 cabin.

Then 8x8 squared pine logs with a 3/4 x 3" ply wood tounge glued into a 3/4 dado in top and bottom of each log with dovetail corners. 4"X8" rafters on 48" centres with 2X4 purlins and a green steal roof. Walls are 10 foot which made a nice sleeping loft on the back half. Front porch is all larch including the support poles but they are the round pole with bark pealed is all. Stiles and rails are larch as well. I need to get out and take some pics of it when he's is done.

I did the milling for him in September and all the lumber was dry stacked on a couple of rigmats inside of a white canvas covered arch type temp shelter. 2 x6' fans running at low rpm 24/7one intake one exhaust.

He had a half dozen very nice birch logs that I cut into 4/4 X 6" X 8' that will be his cabinets and a 1x 26" X 10' birch log that was cut into large 2" and 3" slabs for the fire place mantle and kitchen table.
         
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Evergreen Man

That sounds pretty Bandit!

I made a visit to a local sawyer in the area, he had a Mbf of  dry Larch beautiful looking wood, straight and flat. He gave me a couple boards so that I can play with them and see how I like it.
I used to think I was crazy, then I realized: I'm the only normal one.

Brucer

The key to durable flooring is to use edge grain lumber. The summerwood (narrow part of the growth rings) is harder than the springwood. With edge grain the harder material is evenly distributed. With flat sawn you will get large patches of the softer material and these will wear much more quickly.

I've only used Western Larch. It's deciduous (i.e., loses it's needles in the winter), it doesn't tolerate shade (so the branches die when it's in perpetual shade), and self-pruning (meaning the dead branches break off in the winter. This means that trees that weren't growing in the open will lose their lower branches at an early age. That gives you a lot of clear wood on the lower trunks of the taller trees -- excellent for making edge-grain flooring.

The Western stuff can have big pitch pockets -- if you hit one of these without the blade lube turned up full, the blade will dive almost instantly.

In some stands, Larch is prone to shake. I can easily spot shake in Douglas-Fir once it's been cut. I've had no luck at all spotting it in Larch. It's not uncommon to saw some really nice looking wood, only to have it separate along the rings when it's dry.

I don't know how the Eastern Larch compares but these are the kinds of things to watch for.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
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Evergreen Man

Thanks for the info Brucer! ;D
I used to think I was crazy, then I realized: I'm the only normal one.

SwampDonkey

Yes, I've read that it's edge grain you want and watch out for the ring separation. This was Western larch. I think your in for some work myself with tamarack flooring. Don't let that deter you. Everyone likes to try something. ;D

Here's a fellow in NS.

http://www.larchwoodcanada.com/larch_flooring

Have a look at his cutting boards.
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

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thecfarm

My Father has some hackmatack,I guess it woold be what you are talking about,the needles turn yellow and fall off,milled for the floor for the garage. We always kept hay up there. It was only nailed enough to keep it in place. After 30 years of sliding hay across it,the floor was smooth. Due to him building it in a wet hole and not having a good foundation it started to lean,alot. We tore it down and I used the lumber for a outdoor addition at my other house. The larch was used for the floor. There was no trouble with the floor. The boards was all straight. Maybe he got lucky.  :)
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johnnyllama

 I think larch would be an excellent choice for flooring, I would just keep the widths fairly narrow, 4-6" wide. Definitely not go to engineered wood flooring. Engineered wood flooring is laminated similar to plywood construction with a thicker top veneer. It is more stable than solid wood in most cases such as over radiant flooring but is not a good choice for a wetter location in my experience. I think the amount of moisture you're talking about you will see some cupping and eventual delamination issues. I haven't milled larch(tamarack) myself but have seen it used and think you will be fine with it for flooring.
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Evergreen Man



http://www.larchwoodcanada.com/larch_flooring

Have a look at his cutting boards.

[/quote]

Looks like they do thier narrower floor boards Flat sawn and the wider one's edge grain. But I'll do it like you said and aim for edge grain. ;D Those are some cool looking cutting boards. Did you see the prices?! :o

@thecfarm and @johnnyllama Thanks Guys! I'm feeling very confident now. :)...oops... shouldn't of said that, now I'm sure to fail. ::)

I used to think I was crazy, then I realized: I'm the only normal one.

Jeff

I used larch for my barn floor after I moved it two years ago. Its just two by stuff. I'll go take a picture when I go out. Its still -22 so I aint in any real hurry to go out yet. :D

Eastern Larch is finicky from tree to tree. Look for the ones that are not spiral. If you get bigger straight trees the wood is less likely to twist, but when it twists, it does it better than Chubby Checker.  I have seen finished eastern larch flooring in the U.P. and it is absolutely gorgeous.

I still have a stack of two by 6 and some two by four that burlkraft and I sawed out a few years ago after our's was wiped out by the eastern larch beetle.  I pull some boards out of there every now and then and they have remained straight, and it is a wonder seeing as how they are stacked out in the weather and poorly snickered.  I also made some raised gardens with some several years ago. 2 by 10's nailed in a square and filled with dirt. They look as good as the day I screwed them together, other than oxidized.
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Evergreen Man

Quote from: Jeff on February 27, 2015, 10:15:26 AM
I'll go take a picture when I go out. Its still -22 so I aint in any real hurry to go out yet. :D



I don't blame you for not wanting to go outside, I'm picking on whatever inside job I can.

Just finishing up this little renovation


  

 
I used to think I was crazy, then I realized: I'm the only normal one.

YoungStump

Good Lookin stuff right there Evergreen Man.  :)
Echo Enterprises 45HD2 production series band mill, Cook's Edger, sawing mostly pallet cants, rr ties, and grade lumber.

Jeff

Okay, not much of a picture, but it has made an adequate floor.


 
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Evergreen Man

Quote from: Jeff on February 27, 2015, 09:45:34 PM
Okay, not much of a picture, but it has made an adequate floor.


 

It looks good. I don't see much wear and tear

Thanks Stump!
I used to think I was crazy, then I realized: I'm the only normal one.

Brucer

Another reason for using edge grain for flooring is that it's more stable with changes in humidity. Flat sawn Western and Eastern Larch both expand twice as much across the width as the humidity increases.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

Brucer

Quote from: SwampDonkey on February 27, 2015, 05:15:04 AM
Here's a fellow in NS.

Have a look at his cutting boards.

I recognize those! A couple of years ago the owner of the local kitchen shop called me up and said I'd be interested in the cutting boards she just got in. I went and had a look, and that's exactly what they had. They look even nicer "in person". I figured out how to manufacture them, and worked out how much I could earn if I charged the same prices. Not bad at all -- except for one little old thing. I figured I'd saturate the market pretty quick in this region and the volume wouldn't be there to make it pay.

I must have been right. Dawn sold most of her supply pretty quickly but sales started to drop off toward the end.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

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