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Reality check: How inexpensively can someone get into hobby bandsaw milling?

Started by DeerMeadowFarm, February 23, 2015, 01:30:31 PM

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Magicman

Cheap is not always economical.  :-\

Quality, reliability, serviceability, and accuracy have to enter into the equation.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

york

Cheap is not always economical.
That is true,you will pay for that cheap,many times over and when it all said and done,you have a crappy mill...
Albert

homesteader1972

But there are values to be had, you just have to look and be patient, and be ready to buy when its available. Not every mill owner uses the internet, especially the older farmers. I'd talk with farmers in the area and you may be surprised what you find.
Woodmizer LT40HD20G

Nomad

     Beat the bushes and look around hard.  I did a job for a guy last year who had a Cook's MP32 (IIRC), several years old, with zero hours on it.  He bought it new and had never even started the engine.  But he was hiring me to saw some logs for him!  Go figure. ::)
Buying a hammer doesn't make you a carpenter
WoodMizer LT50HDD51-WR
Lucas DSM23-19

Joe Hillmann

Quote from: DeerMeadowFarm on February 25, 2015, 09:25:39 AM
I've been looking around Craigslist on all of the New England states and there isn't much out there. The cheapest one I see is a Hudson HFE21 for $2500...?

Make sure you are searching for sawmill, and saw mill,  also bandsaw and band saw

homesteader1972

Joe is right. CL search you must type every possible way something may be listed, spaces too. Also for common misspellings. Anytime I look for a Belgian horse, I also look for a Belgium, as well as a Belgum.
Woodmizer LT40HD20G

GAB

Quote from: Magicman on February 25, 2015, 09:53:46 AM
Cheap is not always economical.  :-\

Quality, reliability, serviceability, and accuracy have to enter into the equation.

Cheap, economical, quality, reliability, serviceability, accuracy and a quality product all in the same equation.  Sorry do not look at me to balance that one.
Gerald
W-M LT40HDD34, SLR, JD 420, JD 950w/loader and Woods backhoe, V3507 Fransguard winch, Cordwood Saw, 18' flat bed trailer, and other toys.

GAB

W-M LT40HDD34, SLR, JD 420, JD 950w/loader and Woods backhoe, V3507 Fransguard winch, Cordwood Saw, 18' flat bed trailer, and other toys.

Magicman

I won't and I can't.  When you add the necessary elements, cheap will fall by the wayside. 

Of course, we all have different definitions of cheap.  In my mind, you may get away with inexpensive for a hobby sawmill which was the title of this thread.  :)  Cheap and inexpensive also have different meanings.  It depends upon the need.

Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

4x4American

Boy, back in my day..

lamimartin

Quote from: DeerMeadowFarm on February 24, 2015, 03:34:57 PM
So to answer some of the qualifying questions I have a 4WD tractor, skidding winch and a set of grapple forks for it. I have a couple of Husky XP saws. I have a couple of older peaveys, chains, cables, trailers, and a 1 ton 4WD dump truck. I have a bunch of hand tools and even a metal detector (helped out this summer when I lost an arm from my tedder!) The mill could be portable, but doesn't really need to be. I have a 42 acre wood lot; mostly hard wood: red, white oaks and ash. I have a stand of maples and a stand of white pine. The majority of the trees are less than 24" DBH; maybe 18" or so. Most of the pine I would eventually mill would have to come from off-site as my pine stand is pretty small in numbers but the ones that are there are maybe a little bigger on average in DBH than my hardwood trees.

I'd like to be able to mill material for outbuildings, sugar shack (someday!), wood shed, wood storage crates, farm stand, ground blinds, as well as projects like tables, benches, etc. My brother in law has land in Vermont's NEK and he has a cellar hole/camp there that at some point will be turned into his home. I'd also like to be able to sell molding at some point. Part of it will be for fun.

And Beenthere, my wife loves the smell of fresh milled wood!  ;D

Since you are already quite experienced with chainsaws and looking for affordable milling equipment to produce modest volume of lumber for your own use, I would suggest considering Logosol M8 chainsaw/electric driven portable sawmill. http://www.baileysonline.com/Forestry-Woodcutting/Portable-Sawmills/Logosol/Saw-Mills/Logosol-M8-Chainsaw-Sawmill-Kit.axd  It is currently on promotion. It is easy to find refurbished Stihl MS660 (92cc /7HP) below 900$ including shipping on Ebay.  This allows you to make any lumber size from logs up to 24" diameter and 18 feet long.   If you don't use the sawmill, it won't take much space and can is light enough to be handle by a single person.  It would allow you to make timber out of any soft or hardwood you have and you can sharpen the chainsaw blades yourself as opposed to a bandsaw woodmill to reduce operation cost. I bought one used kit for 2000$ including a used MS660 to build my garage structure and use rot resistant wood to build outdoor deck and eventually a greenhouse. I also have mostly maple and white pine on my property.

Have a look at youtube for Logosol M8 and M7 demos... It can even be equipped with a remote control electric motor for higher volume production or to eliminate chainsaw smell  :D  One thing for sure, every time you will need the MS660 to fall an oversize three, you will appreciate  how quickly you can manage it with such powerfull chainsaw.  I use my lighter 50cc saw (MS261) most of the time, but on hardwood and 24" pine, the MS660 works twice faster... no kidding !
1964 Oliver 550 tractor, 41hp with custom loader and roof. Interforst SW6600 PTO driven 3tons winch. Stihl MS660 for Logosol M8 Sawmill and Stihl MS261 for firewood.

Southside

For what its worth, I started off with pretty much the same exact question you have.  I was looking at DIY kits, then the lower priced manual mills, even a couple hand set circular mills.  I went and visited a bunch of mills, and looking at things with no brand or specific features in mind I weeded out the DIY and strictly manual mills.  Every body I spoke to talked about the back pain, work load, etc.  Plus I know exactly how hard it is to roll a 16' pine with a peavy just to nudge it, never mind flip it four times just to make a cant. 

In the end I found a lightly used Wood Mizer LT 35 Hydraulic for the price I was looking to pay, does not have every growth option as the 40's but it was a compromise on what I wanted to pay and what would hold its value in the event I decide to sell it.  I honestly believe running a manual mill would have become more of a chore than an enjoyable event pretty soon.  I will pick up my mill next week - was not going to work out very well hitching it to the wife's mini van. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

bandmiller2

Check your area for band sawyers selling or doing custom sawing, quite often their just looking for an excuse to trade up to a larger more mechanized mill. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

DeerMeadowFarm

Feeling overwhelmed and slightly discouraged....  :(

I need to do some more homework I'm thinking....

Verticaltrx

Quote from: DeerMeadowFarm on February 26, 2015, 11:00:03 AM
Feeling overwhelmed and slightly discouraged....  :(

I need to do some more homework I'm thinking....

Just buy a good entry level mill and trade up when you are ready. Woodmizer LT10, Norwood Lumberman MN26, Woodland Mills HM126, Hudson HFE-21/Oscar 121, etc. Take your pick and get started, you could be setup and running for $3-4K.
Wood-Mizer LT15G19

Ianab

QuoteJust buy a good entry level mill and trade up when you are ready. Woodmizer LT10, Norwood Lumberman MN26, Woodland Mills HM126, Hudson HFE-21/Oscar 121, etc. Take your pick and get started, you could be setup and running for $3-4K.

Agreed. Any of those mills will have you up and sawing pretty much out of the box, and will do the work you currently want.

There are three possible outcomes in the future.

1 - You get hooked and sell the hobby mill, and upgrade to something better. What you learn running the small mill still applies.
2 - You decide sawing isn't really for you, and you sell the mill. Recover a good % of your cash, and at least you know, and have sawn some lumber in the process.
3 - The mill does all you need, and you keep using it.

So whatever the outcome, it's not a disaster.
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

justallan1

I'd definitely hit CL and put ads in your local yard sale sites. Hit the manufacturers for used or demos.
I got my Hud-Son HFE-21 from a sales rep. a couple hundred miles away. He had taken it to 3-4 county fairs and built a 2 rail fence with about 5-6 posts. It still had a lot of the packing foam taped to it, plus I got about a dozen blades. He  wanted something bigger to show folks and I got a great deal on it. I sold it a couple days ago and definitely made my money back.
If I had known about the HF mills then I would have just bought one of them, it's looks to be pretty much the same thing other than that color.
Something else I always consider when getting used stuff is bartering. Some folks just want to get some of what they spent on something, others don't need your money. I've seen folks that will let something rust to the ground before they'd sell it, but if you can waive something shiny in front of them they get to feeling just like you are right now wanting a mill.LOL

DMcCoy

It all depends on what you want to do and for how long.  Beware of project creep.  Getting a mill is like getting a tractor - suddenly you can do more and likely you will.

I built mine for under $1,000.  It was a big project for me, and used a fair amount of my "good junk" hoard.  A few times I wondered why I didn't just buy a mill.  Lots of detail to pay attention to.  It cuts well, and I am happy with it.

Reselling a home built mill will likely have liability issues if someone gets hurt.  A manufactured mill that isn't your concern, it's the manufactures.  So if you are going to get fancy with a home built mill, hydraulics etc. that could end up costing a fair amount.  You can save money but not time by building.   Building was a bigger deal than I thought.  If you are not going to keep the mill a long time or if it doesn't work the way you want, are all factors to carefully weigh.

Someone advised getting the biggest mill you can afford.  I would tend to agree, but I have tractors to move logs and lumber.  Flipping a 16" x 16" squared Douglas fir cant brought back memories of getting my head whacked by a peavy when I didn't quite get a large cant over center many years ago.  I didn't need stitches but I did want some pain relievers and I quit for a couple of days, that one hurt enough I never did it again.

Mills take room around them.  Lumber, sawdust, slabs and trimmings. 

Having said all that....there is nothing like sawing lumber.  Chances are you wife will come out and Ooo & Ahh at the fresh boards.  I like the smell of fresh cut lumber.

fishfighter

Well today started off bad. Checked everything, so I though. Was set up to edge some 4/4 boards. First cut of the day with a new blade. Blew that $20. :'( Forgot to drop the backstops. New blades overcome backstops easy. :D Just about cut it in half before I new what was what. Trashed that blade. :-[

pineywoods

 ;D fish, that didn't take long  ;D Don't feel bad, we all do that sooner or later..There's them that has and them that's gonna...and maybe a few liars....
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

thecfarm

You don't think you would try that with an old dull blade,do ya??   ;D
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Percy

GOLDEN RULE : The guy with the gold, makes the rules.

fishfighter

Quote from: thecfarm on February 26, 2015, 09:23:42 PM
You don't think you would try that with an old dull blade,do ya??   ;D

Of course not. Wouldn't be fun if I did. :D

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