Trapped

[FarmingSawyer]

This came up because someone here on FF commented in the past day or so that they had cut a 1000 trees and wondered at what point they could consider themselves expert (to crudely paraphrase).

I've lost track of how many trees I've felled. I learned to fall on the West Coast. The smallest trees I dropped there are among the biggest I ever fall here. I am by no means an expert. 9 out of 10 falls lands where I want it to. I've cut and bucked 10000's of BF of blowdown pick up sticks.

And yet........last week I got pinned to the ground by a smallish gnarly beech.

A beech and a rotten maple were within 2ft of each other. I tried dropping the maple first as it had a clear shot. But the butt was too rotten and it didn't want to hinge and went over backwards and hung in the beech. Now I had to fall the beech the wrong way....... Got the 2 trees on the ground safe. Around a chord of wood.
I felt that was enough and a good way to end a long morning of felling and I went and hauled logs out of the woods for a while.

The next day I skidded the whole beech and maple out a ways to limb them. Cleared the maple and went back for the beech. The top of which was over a rock wall and down in a gully. I would have pulled it further out, but didn't want to completely flatten the stone wall. Standard stuff. Limbing away. Suddenly I'm on the ground....on top of my running saw, hard hat knocked 20ft away, surrounded by a cage of 6" thick limbs and stuck.

No phone--back at the landing so I didn't loose it in the snow..... After recovering from the shock for a minute and thankfully realizing my chain break kicked on when I hit the saw and I wasn't really hurt Panic set in. Fortunately the snow was piled against the down hill side of the stone wall and I dug down in it a bit and freed myself and was able to crawl out.

I think what happened was as I cut limbs from the tree, the way they were twisted and growing, they caused the tree to spin and loosen some stones on the wall--even though earlier I had walked out on it to cut several limbs away and felt it was solid.

I got lucky. Really lucky. This is only the 2nd time in 25 years of part-time timber work that I've ever come this close to something serious. If that tree had pinned me down to where I couldn't move, or if I had been injured more than a bruise or two it might have been days before I was found. And I was on my own woodlot. Across the street from my ex's farm......

I am a careful faller. A careful logger. Accidents happen. Pride goeth before a fall.....etc. And I wasn't being cock-sure or anything limbing. Just moving too fast. Working in a bad spot.

So this is a warning of sorts.....there is no level of expertise which will keep you from every harm in the woods. What we do is such a mixed bag of hazards at all times. I  listen attentively every time some one warms me to "be safe" in the woods. And I heed the warnings in others' close calls. This work is not for sissies or wannabes......

[78NHTFY]

So glad you made it out safely FS--All the best, Rob.

[pine]

I got lucky. Really lucky. This is only the 2nd time in 25 years of part-time timber work that I've ever come this close to something serious.
--------------------------------------
Accidents happen. Pride goeth before a fall.....etc. And I wasn't being cock-sure or anything limbing. Just moving too fast. Working in a bad spot.
----------------------------------
So this is a warning of sorts.....there is no level of expertise which will keep you from every harm in the woods. What we do is such a mixed bag of hazards at all times. I  listen attentively every time some one warms me to "be safe" in the woods. And I heed the warnings in others' close calls. This work is not for sissies or wannabes......

Glad you are not injured and got out OK.

Your sentiment is absolutely correct and on target.  I sit here typing with some level of difficulty. 

Yes I got lucky as did you.

I should have lost part of my hand 5 days ago in an accident.  Everyone involved feels horrible and feels responsible but accidents happen.  I also was moving too fast, was not being cock-sure but turned my back for a second.  Next thing my hand was trapped between over 2000 lbs of steel and wood.

When my hand was extricated I expected to remove my hand from the glove and a finger would fall out.  It did not.  I was lucky. Visit to ER and medical work done and more visits to come likely but I should not lose any function.

As Farming Sawyer said and his sentiments are true and accurate. We all have to be mindful of what we are doing and work smart.

Taking a phrase from Sgt. Phil Esterhaus (1981):

"You all be carefull out there"

[Southside]

Glad to hear you both are OK, it can happen so fast.  Last week I got hit in the back with a dead branch that I swear fell from an airplane as I did not see it in the canopy before I felled a pine, luckily it just resulted in bruising and soreness, but it could have been much worse.

I left that 1,000 tree expert comment alone but it bothered me.  I was doing some math in my head and figured that would be at most a month of felling, honestly it was two years before I felt like I knew what I was doing and felt confident that I could usually get a tree to go exactly where I wanted it, but even today some of them still do what they want and not what I want. 

[WH_Conley]

My neighbor is 48 years old, grew up in the woods, Daddy was a logger. He was cutting trees from the time he could pick up a saw. About a year ago he was limbing and a limb got him. Couple surgeries, a rod or 2 and some screws he is getting around pretty good. I got knocked over a hill one time, only thing hurt was my pride. It can and will happen. Don't think for a second that it can't happen to you.

[mad murdock]

It is fortunate that we can live to "tell the story"!  I have had my share of close calls as well.  As was so wisely stated before" it is not a matter of if, but when something goes wrong in the woods", hopefully when the "when" occurs, a guy is fortunate enough to get out and be able to piece him/her self together to have learned a valuable lesson, and it does not end up any worse than that.   

[jd540b]

Glad you are ok man.  Seems as though sometimes the longer you cut wood, the scarier it can be.  In the beginning-you don't know any better kind of the arrogance of ignorance. 

[FarmingSawyer]

I was once putting the carriage return spool back into a Tie mill. There was only room for one of us under the mill, and the sawyer needed to put the bolts in the bearing mount holes. I had the thing resting on my thighs using them to adjust the postion--it must have weighed 200lbs--and I was on my back holding onto the shaft with my hands. As I lowered it into place I didn't realize where my hands were and rested the entire weight of it on both hands at once. I was young and stooopid and reacted fast pulling my hands out from under the shaft, and loosing a couple of fingernails. What I also did was pin my self under the spool. There's no teacher like experience. I had to wait for 30 min stuck there til the sawyer could get some help to lift the spool off of me. I had a lot of time to think how I could/should have done things differently. After a trip by boat to the clinic and an some xrays showing no broken bones I rested the rest of the day and we got that @&!#^(!@# spool mounted the following day and finished milling an order.

What ever doesn't kill you only makes you stronger.....I'm not sure how many lives I have left.....

[Mandothis]

This came up because someone here on FF commented in the past day or so that they had cut a 1000 trees and wondered at what point they could consider themselves expert (to crudely paraphrase).

I've lost track of how many trees I've felled. I learned to fall on the West Coast. The smallest trees I dropped there are among the biggest I ever fall here. I am by no means an expert. 9 out of 10 falls lands where I want it to. I've cut and bucked 10000's of BF of blowdown pick up sticks.

And yet........last week I got pinned to the ground by a smallish gnarly beech.

A beech and a rotten maple were within 2ft of each other. I tried dropping the maple first as it had a clear shot. But the butt was too rotten and it didn't want to hinge and went over backwards and hung in the beech. Now I had to fall the beech the wrong way....... Got the 2 trees on the ground safe. Around a chord of wood.
I felt that was enough and a good way to end a long morning of felling and I went and hauled logs out of the woods for a while.

The next day I skidded the whole beech and maple out a ways to limb them. Cleared the maple and went back for the beech. The top of which was over a rock wall and down in a gully. I would have pulled it further out, but didn't want to completely flatten the stone wall. Standard stuff. Limbing away. Suddenly I'm on the ground....on top of my running saw, hard hat knocked 20ft away, surrounded by a cage of 6" thick limbs and stuck.

No phone--back at the landing so I didn't loose it in the snow..... After recovering from the shock for a minute and thankfully realizing my chain break kicked on when I hit the saw and I wasn't really hurt Panic set in. Fortunately the snow was piled against the down hill side of the stone wall and I dug down in it a bit and freed myself and was able to crawl out.

I think what happened was as I cut limbs from the tree, the way they were twisted and growing, they caused the tree to spin and loosen some stones on the wall--even though earlier I had walked out on it to cut several limbs away and felt it was solid.

I got lucky. Really lucky. This is only the 2nd time in 25 years of part-time timber work that I've ever come this close to something serious. If that tree had pinned me down to where I couldn't move, or if I had been injured more than a bruise or two it might have been days before I was found. And I was on my own woodlot. Across the street from my ex's farm......

I am a careful faller. A careful logger. Accidents happen. Pride goeth before a fall.....etc. And I wasn't being cock-sure or anything limbing. Just moving too fast. Working in a bad spot.

So this is a warning of sorts.....there is no level of expertise which will keep you from every harm in the woods. What we do is such a mixed bag of hazards at all times. I  listen attentively every time some one warms me to "be safe" in the woods. And I heed the warnings in others' close calls. This work is not for sissies or wannabes......

That was me who made the comment about 1000 trees.  However, are you really taking that comment litterally like the fool who replied first about it?  Obviously its not like i sat there counting every friggen tree i have ever dropped.  I pulled 1000 out because its a safe number where I know I would not be lying.  I have literally lost count on the number of trees i have dropped. 

The way you speak its like there is this huge difference between someone who drops 1000 trees vs 10000 trees.  Simple math would indicate in even that nice round number of 1000 trees a person should experience any number of hazards and dangerous senarios.  Which obviously I have, I have probably just as many stories as the next guy where close encouters happen.  To think or insinuate I am just some green behind the ears back yard wood cutter because i used 1000 as a general number of tree cuts is just silly.

Thats like me saying well I have driven a car or bike for 20000 hours and you have only driven the car or bike 1000 hours.  I am sooooo much more skilled and experience than you and I have seen things you couldn't of possibly seen in your little 1000 hour experience when really for those 20000 hours you could of just been going around a simple track where the one with 1000 hours was doing donuts, jumps, drifting, smashup durby and actually be more skilled.  Or someone who flys alot vs doesn't (like me).  Pretty sure if i go fly 20-100 times I will experience just about everything a person experiences after flying 2000 times does.  Yet i am sure there are people with far more hours than just 2000 hours flying commercial and still have less experience than someone who does crop dusting or stunt flying based on the same number of hours.

You have no idea if those 1000 trees were easy, hard, insane dangerious or what.  What a smart person would of done is read into the context of every reply i made and realize A. This guy is a family man and conveyed a patient personality with a fair ammount of experience from childhood to today.  Also, felling a tree is not the same as climbing a tree. there are so many aspects to this lifestyle its insane to pick on technicalities the way you so called "loggers or forestry guys" are doing. 

However, glad to hear you are still alive and didn't get hurt that day.  Before I cut down any thing I am always in prayer and start my day off with it.  If i meet my maker who am I to miss the appointment? 

[coxy]

glad your ok    I got hit in the shoulder yesterday by a big fat gray squirrel that must have been in that or another tree while it was falling had to check  and make shur I dident mess my pants  as I first thought it was a limb coming at me don't know whos blood pressure was higher his or mine  :D            don't think there was any thing nasty in what FS was saying or said    and you come out with both barrels blazing and start with this US SO CALLED LOGGERS AND FORESTRY GUYS CRAP

[clww]

Glad you are okay FarmingSawyer. Most times I've had close calls it was my either unexpected or my fault.
For the newer poster that seems to always have a chip on his shoulder, I have a feeling he won't be around here much longer.

[WH_Conley]

Looks like Jeff has already escorted him out the door.

[clww]

Looks like Jeff has already escorted him out the door.

Well how about that? I had no idea, so I may be psychic!  :D :D :D

[FarmingSawyer]

Looks like Jeff has already escorted him out the door.

x2

don't think there was any thing nasty in what FS was saying or said   

You got that right....I would have put it in the OP but the thread was closed. I was once asked to speak at a conference. Just before I got up the presenter "reminded' everyone there that we were all experts....... Hmmmm...... I felt like going and sitting in the audience in that case...... No matter how much experience I have I will never consider myself quite an expert at anything. There is always room for improvement, to learn new things, see things from anothers' perspective, always a chance of failure or accident. So...the "e" word always raises my hackles a bit..... but actually I was reminded of the stories of near misses and thought it's always instructional to share and own up to ones own idiocy. Certainly no criticism implied towards the rootin-tootin-sassparilla swilln varmit whose been shootin his mouth off in these here parts. ;D

[pine]

...................................... No matter how much experience I have I will never consider myself quite an expert at anything. There is always room for improvement, to learn new things, see things from anothers' perspective, always a chance of failure or accident.

X2 :)Bravo!!!

While I have no problem with the term expert, I have met many in my life and I might even be one in a couple of areas but I have never met an expert that did not think they could learn something from somebody else's experience.  Even if the someone else had less experience than they did.  Learning never stops until we are dead.  We have never experienced everything no matter how much we have experienced already. There is always something waiting to happen to teach us anew.

[coxy]

I am no expert but my dad always said I was a professional screw up not in those exact words but you get the hint  :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D and I do miss hearing that come out of his mouth 

[Ford_man]

The definition of "Expert"
EX is a has been
SPERT is a drip under pressure
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

[so il logger]

I'm sure no expert i've been known to screw up on a regular basis. I just try to take something from every screw up and apply it to the next one ;D I been around logging all my life and still learn something new on a daily basis. I think if you get to where you think theres nothing else to learn then its time to hang it up. Sorry if i offended anyone in the OP with the inheritor :-[

[Puffergas]

"Looks like Jeff has already escorted him out the door."

Oh, come on guys is this the way to help a young buck ya find in the woods?? Sure he'll snort and fart a bit but that's the nature of the critter.....  ;)

[Gearbox]

Were I worked we would always get the experts to oversee new gear installs . What I learned is you have to charge $100 an hour and be 500 miles from home to be an expert .  Me I know will never be an expert .

[CuddleBugFirewood]

Glad u are ok.  It happens fast as I can recently attest to, even when you think you are doing it all "right".   

I enjoy the collective experience here and learning new things


Coxy, the squirrel comment was funny.  I've had them hit the ground close to mebut never that close.

[jwilly3879]

I never learned anything by doing it right.

[Corley5]

I never learned anything by doing it right.

  8)
I'm not an expert at anything.  I'm pretty good at a handful of things but I don't claim expertize.

[loggah]

I hate Beech trees !!!!!Worst knockout punch i ever got was from a beech springpole that came sideways after i cut it off !! Glad it wasn't any worse for you. Don

[mesquite buckeye]

Glad you are ok. When those things happen you sometimes have no hint and just get whacked. I think the trick is to stay aware at all times and try to see or feel those hints.

I have read that often when accident victims are interviewed they knew they were heading into a dangerous situation and just kept going instead of trying to figure out a safer way.

Isn't that the second molatov thrower in a month? I wonder if people like that would act as rudely if they were talking to the people on this forum as if they were visiting in their home. It is really sad, that with just a small change in attitude we would all benefit.