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Bar oil in the cold?

Started by 101mph, January 03, 2015, 03:26:19 PM

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101mph

Hey Guys,

I have a Husqvarna 359 E-Tech (20" bar) and I've been wondering if I should be changing the type of bar oil to use (or possibly adding an additive to the normal bar oil I have been using to thin it out a bit) when it gets below 40 degrees.

The bar oil I've been using is just the regular Echo bar oil that you get at Home Depot.

Since I've been using it in the cold weather recently this oil gets so thick when it comes out it's almost the consistency of natural peanut butter (the kind you have to stir up like Smuckers  ;D). It appears that it's getting through to the bar ok as I have to fill up the oil in the saw pretty regularly (with every tank full of fuel).

So I think everything is working ok (not sure if the saw heats up the oil at all???). I just don't want to ruin the bar if there is something I should be doing that I'm not. I can't imagine what it would be like if it got any colder and tried to use this bar oil.


Stephen1

There is ussually winter and summer bar oil. I sometimes will add kerosene to the summer oil to thin it, saves going to town for more oil.
IDRY Vacum Kiln, LT40HDWide, BMS250 sharpener/setter 742b Bobcat, TCM forklift, Sthil 026,038, 461. 1952 TEA Fergusan Tractor

lledwod

If your saw is running the oil through I wouldn't worry about. I generally don't worry about switching to winter oil until the temperature hits 0 to -10 or so C (32 to 15 F). Although the use the saw sees can affect that. For example I go cut wood with one saw (I was out there today and its -36C) and then buck it at home with another saw. The bucking saw comes out of my warm shop, and is only outside for 10 minutes or so, and yes the muffler and engine will warm up the bar oil (eventually if it is cold out) or keep it warm. If it is REALLY cold out, like below -40, I find my saws won't spin the chain, even with the winter oil, and the winter oil won't pour. In this case I find I have to warm the bar up under the exhaust from the snowmachine ..... trying to warm up the bar and chain enough to spin by revving the engine and heating up the clutch is more likely to just melt your oil pump - don't ask me how I know!

Dave Shepard

If it's still using the oil, then it's probably ok, but I always worry about strain on the oil pump. I've seen the plastic drives stripped out of more than one saw. I'm still using some summer oil, but I try to keep my saw in the heated garage. You know the oil is too stiff if you have to use the scrench to stuff it down into the tank. :D
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

coxy

i found that if you get oil with out the sling additive its not bad at all in the cold

DaleK

It should tell you what it is on the jug, either Winter or Summer, or sometimes Light vs Medium vs Heavy
Hud-Son Oscar 330
Wallenstein FX110
Echo chainsaws and a whole bunch of tractors

bill m

Winter bar oil is mostly for our benefit not the saw, unless your cutting in below 0 degrees F. If your saw is kept in an unheated space it could be tough on the oil pump when you first start it up. The oil pump is driven off of the clutch so if you let it warm up first, at an idle, you should not have any problems.
NH tc55da Metavic 4x4 trailer Stihl and Husky saws

thecfarm

I have a shelf on my OWB. I keep a gallon on it. I only work on my own land,so when it starts to get thick I swap jugs.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Al_Smith

In a pinch you might try automatic transmission fluid,below zero .That or 20-30 WT SAE motor oil .

Any lube is better than no lube when it gets too cold to pump regular bar oil .

101mph

Quote from: bill m on January 03, 2015, 08:24:52 PM
Winter bar oil is mostly for our benefit not the saw, unless your cutting in below 0 degrees F. If your saw is kept in an unheated space it could be tough on the oil pump when you first start it up. The oil pump is driven off of the clutch so if you let it warm up first, at an idle, you should not have any problems.

Thanks for the reply's guys. This is what I've been doing.

The saw (and everything else) is kept in my shed which is un-heated. I start up the saw and let it idle for a few minutes before I use it. I haven't used it much below 32° F yet but I will keep these tips in mind.

I haven't looked at the jug to see if it indicates what type of oil it is but I will.

Mn woodchuck

I use so called summer oil untill it's 20* F then winter grade and I have cut at -40 . Of course you need a longer warm up time when its that cold.
to soon oldt to late schmart!
3 husky 350xps 340xp 362 346. 372xp McCullough 710.and a jonsered 2150 sopped up..
Cat D6 D2

7sleeper

Since the base of bio bar oil is canola oil and canola oil is VERY cheap, that's what I use for diluting. I have also used it alone without any problem at all.

7

Spike60

There's some bad advice here guys. If the OP's bar oil is getting as thick as he says, then it's a good bet that the pump drive gear will get stripped. You should definitely use winter weight oil.

Some disagreement on this topic is due to the fact that not all "regular" bar oil is the same. Some brands aren't all that thick, and you can get away with using them in the winter. Other brands like Husky are very thick and will get like gorilla glue in cold weather. And of course some guys just want to be stubborn and not buy a different oil, particularly as the discount places generally only carry the summer oil.

As far as warming up the saw goes, it would have to sit and idle a good long while to warm up the oil enough to thin it out. Much longer than most guys would want to weight.
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Maine logger88

Used AW 32 hydraulic oil makes decent Winter bar oil I use that quite abit
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

Ed

IME, if the oil tank is below the muffler I don't worry about using winter oil. The saw case will absorb enough heat from the muffler to thin out the oil. On saws that have the exhaust away from the tank, 020 or ms200 Stihls (in my stable) I run winter oil when the temps get below 40.

Ed

cbla

I usually put my saws in the cab of the truck when I hit the job site for a few minutes with the blower on and then again after lunch, seems to keep the saws happy.

HolmenTree

Quote from: cbla on January 06, 2015, 05:51:48 AM
I usually put my saws in the cab of the truck when I hit the job site for a few minutes with the blower on and then again after lunch, seems to keep the saws happy.
cbla,
I see your from the warmer part of Canada in Nova Scotia.  One summer my neighbor's uncle from Nova Scotia came to visit here in Manitoba . When I met him he looked at my truck and asked why I had an electrical cord hanging out of the truck's grille.
I said "because in winter time it gets so cold here the engine oil gets so stiff that the engine won't start, so I have to plug it in so the engine block heater can keep it warm".
He looked at me with a bewildered look....I'm not sure if he believed me.  :D 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Oliver1655

None of the saws I use have the oil reservoir close to the muffler.  When temps start dropping below 40°F I switch to a mix of 3 qts of "regular" bar oil with a qt of ATF mixed in. If the temperature goes higher for a short period I still run the "winter" mix.  This way if the temperature drops again, the saw is ready to go.

This is the system I was taught when I lived in northern Minnesota & have followed it for over 40 years without problems.

NOTE *** I am not a professional & only cut 20 - 30 cords of firewood a year.
John

Stihl S-08s (x2), Stihl S10 (x2), Jonsered CS2139T, Husqvarna 338XPT California, Poulan Microvibe XXV, Poulan WoodShark, Poulan Pro 42cc, McCulloch Mini-Mac 6 (x2), Van Ruder Hydraulic Tractor Chainsaw

Woodcutter_Mo

I use the winter blend when its cold, my husky 455 has a plastic oil pump setup and I don't want to mess it up, I have seen them strip and fail.
-WoodMizer LT25
-592XP full wrap, 372XP, 550XP, 455 Rancher, RedMax GZ3500T
-Fixer-uppers/projects:
024AV, MS260, MS361, MS460, Shindaiwa 488, 394XPG

Hitchcock Woods

I have noticed using a less viscous oil in the winter time runs better in our saws.  Especially in our 346xp. STIHL BioPlus works great!
Chain Saws         Vehicles            LogSplitter
MS 192TC          6100D x2     TimberWolf TW3
MS 391               L2800
MS 441              HPX Gator
346XP           Honda4x4 Rancher
372XP              4x4 Frontier
HT 101 x2
MS 311

cbla

Holmen Tree, that's funny.it defiantly does not get as cold here as it does out your way. I once worked with a guy from Thompson Manitoba and he had a old truck with not a speck of rust on it. One winter here and he was amazed how bad it rusted. He said that the found the damp Nova Scotia winters worst than the extreme dry cold of Manitoba.

HolmenTree

Actually I just moved my family to Thompson, Manitoba last summer.
We're enjoying it here in Thompson, winters are cold but dry, the sun shines brightly most times and not alot of snow.
Lots of Maritimers here in this hard rock nickel mining town.   
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

DonT

I switch when the temps start to get consistently below 0C, There is one problem with canola based oils in the cold,everything smells like fries cooking and I am always hungry.Holman Tree I will give you your due,Manitoba can be cold, real cold.

HolmenTree

Yes Don cold but you can dress for it. :) At one time our vehicles license plates said "Sunny Manitoba" .

Any colder then 25 below canola freezes solid, that's when I revert back to regular winter grade bar oil.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

cbla

one good thing Holmen Tree is your truck won't rust. :laugh:

strongsaw

Quote from: bill m on January 03, 2015, 08:24:52 PM
Winter bar oil is mostly for our benefit not the saw, unless your cutting in below 0 degrees F. If your saw is kept in an unheated space it could be tough on the oil pump when you first start it up. The oil pump is driven off of the clutch so if you let it warm up first, at an idle, you should not have any problems.

strongsaw

A lot of saws don't have clutch driven oil pumps, but are driven off the crankshaft and oil continuously.

smh

Few months ago bought an older Husky outta northern Maine. It had very poor, inconsistent oiling. Discovered the pump gear drive missing the "dogs" (that mesh into the clutch notches).
Over 30 years of cutting n bucking I never before gave a thought to changing oil for low temps. But my sawing is pretty mild compared to real loggers and never far from a warm shed. Then I read this thread. .. and bought some winter blend.
husky 61   -   old school mods
husky 272 -   heavy metal mods
husky 4 parts-uh oh oops
stihl 180c  -   what will it be when it grows up?

bill m

Quote from: strongsaw on January 12, 2015, 06:42:06 PM
A lot of saws don't have clutch driven oil pumps, but are driven off the crankshaft and oil continuously.
So which " A lot of saws " are you talking about because I can't think of any off the top of my head.
NH tc55da Metavic 4x4 trailer Stihl and Husky saws

strongsaw

Echo 370 and 400 are current models that are not clutch driven oilers. I think the current 670 and 8000 also are not clutch driven. Recent models 440, 510, 520, 530 were all crank driven continuous oilers.
I'm sure this doesn't represent "a lot of saws" but I can think of them "off the top of my head" because I own 8 Echo saws. I think Echo didn't have any clutch driven oilers until the last 4 or 5 years and maybe I wrongly assumed there were other companies with the same situation. I have a total of 28 saws, and they include Husqvarna, Stihl, Efco, Echo, Shindiawa, Redmax. All are recent [last 5 years] or current models. I suppose most have clutch driven oilers, but I don't know. I sure don't know about saws made 15-30 years ago that are still in use. I have a Poulan 3400 mid '80s, still runs good, of course doesn't have clutch driven oiler, has a manual oiler.

Spartan

I use the walmart 30 weight year round.  oils fine in sub zero.

Engineer

I used to religiously use Stihl winter weight oil anytime I was cutting at freezing temps or below, and regular weight Stihl oil the rest of the year.  Now I use whatever's on sale for warmer months, but I still use the blue-jug Stihl winter oil.  No sense losing oiler pump parts and etc. over a few bucks worth of oil.

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