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Milling 36"+ logs on an LT40HD mobile site

Started by giant splinter, October 16, 2014, 02:10:12 PM

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giant splinter

After a wind storm uprooted and broke off many trees in the surrounding area I started getting an increase in inquiries regarding  portable sawing of fallen trees, many of these projects are for home owners that have never used the services or a mobile sawyer. In some cases they have a project in mind for the lumber and may even have a cutting list, many of these logs are 3' plus in diameter and often are not in a position to get close enough to get them on the mill. The most recent job included a 36+" Ponderosa pine that the top section broken off and was being cut up into firewood sized rounds and stacked out of the way for splitting, the lower section still standing was 42" DBH and 40' tall, it was fell in the driveway (dirt) and sized up for milling @ 18'6". After winching one end out of the way I was able to get the mill next to the log and once it was on the log loader I discovered that I was going to need a little more help getting it up to the bunks and into position, luckily enough the off bearers where able to work together with the log loader and we got it up on the deck. the customer asked if we could start in a specific spot so we began whittling where he requested we start. His plan led us into a few problems as far as mill capability and clearances are concerned, I explained how it would be best to tackle this monster and he (partially agreed) the rest of the day was more of an education on how not to interfere with what works and listen to the sawyer about how he would recommend getting to all of the lumber list without getting hung up in the cut or have to wedge up a slab so you can back out of a logjam. Nice enough guy and he and his crew where not afraid of hard work, we made it through the next few hours and got the first log done. His help both had to get going so we set it up to return on the 27th to finish his project. < Im guessing this story sounds familiar to a few of you > ;D.

Here is where I could use some advice:
Has anyone here figured out a really good policy for getting the owners and helpers in this kind of situation to rely on the sawyer to guide them through the process with the least amount of difficulty. These guys knew how to work and had simply never done this kind of thing before and I admit that I do NOT know everything and could stand to look into some better policy on how to communicate with people I don't know in an effort to get the project at hand finished.

36"+ logs that are green and heavy are enough are a challenge on their own, so I am seeking some advice from the pro-sawyers here on how you handle a situation like this as well as how you go about getting a huge log down to a manageable sized cant and then begin working through a cutting list to the completion of his project.

Thanks for the help .... I know I'm not the only one who has been in this situation and all of your ideas will be carefully applied.
roll with it

Magicman

I always saw irregular and "too big" stuff "hourly rate".  That way you do not loose when being "helped" by the customer.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

barbender

Quote from: Magicman on October 16, 2014, 02:18:21 PM
I always saw irregular and "too big" stuff "hourly rate".  That way you do not loose when being "helped" by the customer.
I would go with Magic's  advice. Then if they get in the way it costs them money, not you. Not to mention wrestling the big 'uns  just kills production anyways.
Too many irons in the fire

uler3161

Quote from: giant splinter on October 16, 2014, 02:10:12 PM
36"+ logs that are green and heavy are enough are a challenge on their own, so I am seeking some advice from the pro-sawyers here on how you handle a situation like this as well as how you go about getting a huge log down to a manageable sized cant and then begin working through a cutting list to the completion of his project.

Support equipment for getting it on the mill and possibly turning the log if it's that big.

As for cutting it, Creative chainsaw work if it's that big of a log. You can rip a small notch the length of the log to get your guide wheel through it. Other option is to cut notches around your side supports and let the log lean over more towards the operator side of the mill, but not too far since you need clearance on that side too. There are also the little metal nubs that keep that act as side supports when your side supports are all the way down. Those were also causing me problems on one wide cant. I lifted the cant and put stickers on top of the bed rails. Then I could slide the cant over a bit towards the operator side.

I had one job that was like yours and I was cutting beams. Some of them 6x24, but most around 6x18. Ranging from 16 feet up to 20 feet as I recall. LOTS of time spent fiddling with things, but actually was my highest production day at a little over 3k bdft. Did have an 18k lb excavator there to help. Kind of funny to see the operator pick up one of the logs and just about put that machine on it's nose.
1989 LT40HD, WoodMaster 718

Dan

Magicman

Yes, and that "creative chainsaw work" also creates additional lost time.  Hourly rate.   :)
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

backwoods sawyer

Over 36" I charge hourly for chainsaw work+bft

Some customers will do the chainsaw work if you put that to them keeping everyone buisy saving them money and you time.

I don't hesitate to split in half and get to milling rather then fidling with over sized logs on the mill. Takes about 30 min to split and it can take that long if you get hung up just once.


Backwoods Custom Milling Inc.
100% portable. . Oregons largest portable sawmill service, serving all of Oregon, from our Backwoods to yours..sawing since 1991

YellowHammer

Dealing with a nice, well meaning but advice driven customer can make things uneasy, but usually, if they are really interested in getting the best cuts and yield, they will soon fall in line once they see you know what you are doing.  Sometimes it's as easy as saying something like "well, we could do it your way, but since it's going to waste a lot of my time and your wood I'll have to charge by the hour" or I've even had to politely ask "The man who's never sawn a log is is telling the man who owns a sawmill how to saw?", or I'll listen to what they say once, draw out their cut pattern with a crayon on the end of the log and explain to them how they are ignoring grain, stress, and the best ways to cut a log.  Remember that you are the professional, they are a well meaning customer, and once a customer sees how it's supposed to be done, they have the "oh, I get it moment" and respect you and your skill. Sounds like that's what happened in the end to you, they figured you knew what you were doing, you were patient and polite, and things worked out well.  Seems you did it right.

Oh yeah, one of my favorite ways, and always gets a laugh and lightens the mood is I point to my "Woodmizer Pro Sawyer" hat and say "See this hat, you don't think they give it to just anyone, do you?" :D
YH

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

customsawyer

I would ask the customer for a cut list, than ask them to step back and watch.
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

Magicman

I like your style Jake.  I would love to be there watching too.   ;D
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

customsawyer

You will have to bring your own chair or gloves. Well I might get you some gloves. :D
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

Nomad

Quote from: customsawyer on October 16, 2014, 08:35:39 PM
You will have to bring your own chair or gloves. Well I might get you some gloves. :D

     No he wouldn't.  Make you bring your own. ;D ;D
Buying a hammer doesn't make you a carpenter
WoodMizer LT50HDD51-WR
Lucas DSM23-19

Peter Drouin

Quote from: customsawyer on October 16, 2014, 08:24:32 PM
I would ask the customer for a cut list, than ask them to step back and watch.



And if that did not work, they would have to find another mill to cut their logs.
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

Magicman

QuoteYou will have to bring your own chair or gloves.
I'll just bring gloves. 


 
This guy says that he is Chair man of the board, and he is an ornery old goat.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

POSTON WIDEHEAD

My cup is empty.....will you get me some more Purple drink?  :D
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Larry

I can easily handle those big logs without breaking a sweat or even getting out of my chair...I tell em to call one of the pros on the FF. ;D

I have been trapped a couple of time when somebody shows up with a big log out in the driveway.  I unload it and tell them to come back in a week for the lumber.  That way there is no rush and no pressure to getrdone.  I learned a long time ago if something isn't going right, its better to take a break and think about it for a while...some breaks can be longer than others. ;D ;D
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

POSTON WIDEHEAD

The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Magicman

Yeppers for sure.  I started my current break Tuesday when I finished sawing that Red Oak.  It will end Monday morning when I start my next job.  I thought that I deserved a break few day's off.   ;D
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Quote from: Magicman on October 16, 2014, 10:02:15 PM
  I thought that I deserved a break few day's off.   ;D

Go get your hair fixed and your hoofs nails done.  ;D
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Magicman

 

 
I was looking for a friend girl for you.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Thats the pic I keep on my night stand.  :D :D :D
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

giant splinter

You guys are the best, Its always good to throw a post out into the mix and see what comes up. One thing you can count on in here is someone will shed some light on the subject that really helps.
I try not to get involved with mobile sawing to a large extent, I find it is just easier and more productive to do the milling here in the yard with all the support equipment handy and not having to deal with foul weather and other setbacks.

David, what purple drink ? I'll bet it ain't grape juice or maybe it is ;D materhead

Thanks for the fresh ideas and help gentlemen this group is awesome.
roll with it

Magicman

Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

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