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How to get small trees to fall in the direction you want

Started by Joe Hillmann, October 05, 2014, 02:02:54 PM

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Joe Hillmann

I was given a bunch of small pine trees.  They are 6 to 16" in diameter and all about 50 or 60 feet tall.  Normally I cut the notch then make a plunge cut behind the notch, pound in wedges, and last in from the back of the tree to finish the cut.  The problem is on a 6 inch tree there isn't enough room do to that but the tree is still tall enough that I want/need to control how it falls.

beenthere

I sometimes, for a small diam tree like 6" that is leaning back, make the backcut first, then position a wedge before making the notch cut to form controlling hinge wood.
Usually works for me, but need to be careful that the notch cuts don't pinch due to the tightness of the wedge.

Was thinning a lot of 16 yr old spruce that were that size, and most seemed to be leaning the wrong way. Cutting normally and manually pushing the trees against the lean was too much work.  ;)
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

chester_tree _farmah

If u can get a helper a long pic pole works great and is quick.  There are also some tools like the one on this link that u can attempt to lever them over with. I have one but never use it anymore since I got my skidder which has a winch. The cant hook is handy for rolling that small stuff to.

http://www.stihl.com.au/STIHL-Products/Hand-Tools/Forestry-Tools/2978-1665/Felling-Lever.aspx
254xp
C4B Can-Car Tree Farmer
Ford 1720 4wd loader hoe

Holmes

  In my GOL class the instructor did the notch then did the plunge cut behind the hinge at an angle steep enough to not cut thru the back of the tree , then put in the wedge and finished as usual.
Think like a farmer.

mad murdock

Logosol makes a very cool device called a timber winch. Check it out. It can assist to safely direct the fall of a tree.
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

lopet

There is always so many different ways to take a tree down and I normally don't like to get involved. The key is to judge the lean. If it leans the way you want it to go, than you do it the way you always do. On a small diameter tree with a back lean you don't wanna fool around with a winch cable ( unless it absolutely has to go the other way )  and myself I do it the way beenthere said. If you can't drive a wedge deep enough you have to stick on of those tools as mentioned in the back cut with more leverage right after you made the cut. Don't cut any deeper than half way.
Than you make your notch and make sure to leave some hinge wood, put your saw aside and level her over. Pretty simple and in case your hinge breaks and she goes the wrong way, than you have to deal with the situation. ;D
Hope that helps.
Make sure you know how to fall properly when you fall and as to not hurt anyone around you.
Also remember, it's not the fall what hurts, its the sudden stop. !!

Spartan

I push them if they are small enough, just sayin.  Thats a lot of monkeying with wedging a 6" tree.
If you are having to deal with the majority of them doing that, consider replanning your lead

thenorthman

Quote from: Holmes on October 05, 2014, 04:31:56 PM
  In my GOL class the instructor did the notch then did the plunge cut behind the hinge at an angle steep enough to not cut thru the back of the tree , then put in the wedge and finished as usual.

The instructor did this?  And people listen to them...

Sloping back cuts are bad. For any reason.

Anyway quickest thing is to cut the back side first start a wedge and carefully make your notch, remember to aim with the back cut and and leave enough hold wood.

An alternative method would be the tongue and groove, make your cuts as usual then once you've pinched the bar, swapped it out for another...  bore straight through,just above your back cut and out the face (perpindicular to the hold wood) insert wedge into said slot and pound away. Just be careful not to cut to much of the hold wood on either side.

Or you could just lean on the stoopid thing.
well that didn't work

mesquite buckeye

Manage 80 acre tree farm in central Missouri and Mesquite timber and about a gozillion saguaros in Arizona.

lynde37avery

Push em with the skidder after I wedge and half way cut thru them. If no skidder I guess use some kind of a hand winch. To pull em over.
Detroit WHAT?

CCC4

Here's a couple small pine vids...everything from pushing to wedging. Pine pole vid#2 (which will be posted first) has me putting in the wedge before the face cut...it's the last tree to fall in the vid. Pine pole layout vid is just that, laying a strip out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X73xt5e9ODo&list=UU_NjqCPS3PCA_PGz4NCZuLA&index=57

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzjUEiZpdYo&list=UU_NjqCPS3PCA_PGz4NCZuLA&index=58

Puffergas

Quote from: CCC4 on October 05, 2014, 10:57:56 PM
Here's a couple small pine vids...everything from pushing to wedging. Pine pole vid#2 (which will be posted first) has me putting in the wedge before the face cut...it's the last tree to fall in the vid. Pine pole layout vid is just that, laying a strip out.



ccc4, what kind of hat cam are you using? It takes nice videos.

You need more limbs on those there trees....   :)
Jeff
Somewhere 20 miles south of Lake Erie.

GEHL 5624 skid steer, Trojan 114, Timberjack 225D, D&L SB1020 mill, Steiger Bearcat II

longtime lurker

Going with the lean: it's a business as usual kinda thing.
Going against the lean: do the back cut first, start a wedge, then open your face. But be careful - this situation does significantly increase the risk of a barber chair happening.
Unsure / could go any way:(a) open your front, do one side of your back cut, set a wedge in, then do the other side of the back cut.
or (if slightly larger)
(b) open your front with a humbolt notch, drive the bar through from the front at the level of your horizontal cut and out the back of the tree, set wedge in the bore cut, then do a cut from each side slightly above the bore cut height You can also do this with a conventional front but then you need to do your back cuts at a level just below the bore cut. Main thing with this method is to have enough meat either side the bore cut that the tree wont fall before you get around the back of it.
The quickest way to make a million dollars with a sawmill is to start with two million.

teakwood

This is a video from a very good technic with a felling lever. He is a european profesional.
I am sorry but i could not figure it out how to post a link.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1r3qJK4Rrw&list=UUn6HkgDjr5hzEN9iNf2UIrw
National Stihl Timbersports Champion Costa Rica 2018

CCC4

Interesting for sure. I wish I new German or whatever that is...looks like he's gettin a reaming in his comment section...exactly why my comments are turned off in all my vids. ;)

CCC4

Quote from: Puffergas on October 06, 2014, 12:51:54 AM
Quote from: CCC4 on October 05, 2014, 10:57:56 PM
Here's a couple small pine vids...everything from pushing to wedging. Pine pole vid#2 (which will be posted first) has me putting in the wedge before the face cut...it's the last tree to fall in the vid. Pine pole layout vid is just that, laying a strip out.



ccc4, what kind of hat cam are you using? It takes nice videos.

You need more limbs on those there trees....   :)

Contour 1080P  :)

Ianab

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1r3qJK4Rrw

What he does demonstrate is a way to wedge or lever a small tree, by making your backcut on 2 different levels. Cut 2/3 of the back cut, insert a wedge, then go to the other side and complete the cut ~1" below the first (and the wedge). The little bit of vertical grain will just break away as soon as you pound the wedge.  He uses a lever, but a plastic wedge would work too.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Ed_K

 I make my notch then bore into the center of the notch and straight out the back put the wedge in the back and tighten it up. Then below the wedge on each side I cut to my hinge. That way you can keep pounding on the wedge till the tree comes up and over. You only need to undercut a little on each side of your wedge,the fibers will break away.
Ed K

beenthere

But I'd like to see that German video technique on just a small 6" diam tree... That was a lot of cutting in different locations on the tree taking a lot of time for just one tree. I like to do the cutting without moving around the tree. One spot back cut, place wedge, 2 cuts notch, pound wedge.

That pry bar, IMO, doesn't take the place of one handy plastic wedge carried in the pocket.

Don't mean to sound negative on this, but I agree with "thenorthman" on the best method and certainly the quickest. 

And Ed_K suggests a good one (will try that one myself when dropping some more 6" spruce).
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

celliott

Hmm, I like the sound of Ed_K's method. Have to try that sometime!
Of course you must be proficient and comfortable bore cutting...
Chris Elliott

Clark 666C cable skidder
Husqvarna and Jonsered pro saws
265rx clearing saw
Professional maple tubing installer and maple sugaring worker, part time logger

CCC4

One thing that is a benefit to using the back cut and wedge first is you can still set yer tree up with Siswheels, kerf Dutch, over-under and the Hillbilly siswheel.  :)

teakwood

Insted of axe and wedges i just carry the lever around. In the vid you see the big lever (about 50" long) mine is the small (30"). I just logg in my teakplantation, the logs have 6-12" because they are now 10years old, so this lever is just fine to do the job. there is an other handy thing on these levers, they have a hook to roll logs over. Teaktrees have a lot of branches and big leaves (almost like sandpaper textsure) so as we fall beside alot of standing trees they often get hocked in some other trees. so with this hock you can turn te log right or left and almost every time it frees the tree. Maye when i make the final cuts (20 years old trees) then i will us wedges because the trees will have around 18" and they will be very heavy. Sorry for my english.
National Stihl Timbersports Champion Costa Rica 2018

beenthere

QuoteSorry for my english.
Not a thing wrong with your English. ;)

south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

teakwood

National Stihl Timbersports Champion Costa Rica 2018

John Mc

Quote from: Ed_K on October 06, 2014, 04:54:46 PM
I make my notch then bore into the center of the notch and straight out the back put the wedge in the back and tighten it up. Then below the wedge on each side I cut to my hinge. That way you can keep pounding on the wedge till the tree comes up and over. You only need to undercut a little on each side of your wedge,the fibers will break away.

That sounds like what some people call the tongue and groove method (the stump and butt of the tree do look a bit like a tongue and groove joint). That's what I use on small back leaners. As long as there is enough diameter to leave some hinge wood on either side of the bore, it works well. The bore through the center of the hinge gives a place for the wedge to drive in without bottoming out on the hinge.  One thing I do is after boring all the way through, I pull out the saw, offset one saw kerf thickness downward and start boring through again, stopping once I'm just through the thickness of the hinge.  This relieves the hinge a bit, so the wedge isn't lifting on the hinge as it is pounded through.

If I had one of those nifty hat cameras, I'd make a video myself...
If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.   - Abraham Maslow

101mph

Great info here guys.

I'm going to try and remember some of these techniques when I have to drop another smallish diameter tree.

Ianab

It's usually a good idea to practice some of those more fancy techniques on trees that aren't "critical". Spend a few extra seconds and do the bore cuts etc, just so you are confident of getting them right when you do actually need to use them.
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

BargeMonkey

 The pictures you posted would be like paradise for a buncher.  :D 

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