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I am confused here and really could use some help.

Started by Southside, September 11, 2014, 06:41:36 PM

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Southside

When does timber become lumber?  Guess I was spending too much time in the sun today when this all came to mind, so bear with me.

If I am standing in the woods, wearing a helmet, chaps and running a saw, the wood fiber that is in front of me and covered with bark is called timber.  If I am standing in a big box store, wearing the same helmet, chaps and running the same saw, (presuming security is not detaining me) the same wood fiber, without the bark, that is laying in a rack in front of me is called lumber.
 
In the middle is the mill, the log goes onto the log deck, not the timber deck, so what happened to the timber?  It became a log when I cut it shorter, OK - I get that. 

Now the log enters a de-barker and comes out as a naked log - does that have a specific name too? Why do we not call that lumber?

Eventually what was previously called timber, then called a log, but really can't be called that any more makes it way to the saw. 

At what point after the saw starts into the log does it all change?  I ask because the first couple of cuts produce slabs and result in a cant, not a timber, not a beam, nor a post, but a cant.  This is where the confusion really starts as from my own explanation the log without the bark can't be called a log any more, so is it a can't before it gets to the saw head?

I know a few folks who "timber frame" and some who "stick frame", I also know a lot more who "can't frame", but those guys don't advertise their work much, at least they don't truthfully advertise it appears, although driving around one can often see the results of those who "can't frame", especially after a long, snowy winter, so clearly they stay busy, must be some sort of grant that pays those guys is all I can figure.

This leads me to ask how do the "timber framers" know they are using genuine timbers and not cants?  How do you tell the difference?  Are you ever concerned about cheap Chinese timber knock offs that are really cants? 

Now I am off topic here, so back to the mill, looking at the cant.  Another cut off the cant produces what?  Two cant's?  A cant and a board?  But now the rules of math apply, if in fact it is two cants remember when you multiply two negatives you end up with a positive, so does one cut make three cants?  Otherwise they would be cans, and square ones at that, perhaps that is where Spam comes from??? How on earth can anybody be board trying to figure this out?   

A flour mill produces flour, a steel mill produces steel, so a lumber mill must produce lumber.  But those obvious rules don't always apply.  Orange juice is made from squished oranges, peanut butter is made from ground up peanuts, baby oil is made from --- wait, wait – that is just wrong, have to get back on track here.

So when can't you call a cant a cant and call it lumber instead?  Are there hard and fast rules?  If you start with an 8" timber, cut the slabs off, do you have a 6" cant or a post?  How do I tell if I am looking at a 10" beam or a cant? 
At any rate I still am not clear on when timber becomes lumber, guess I will stay on the log side of the equation for a while.

Any assistance is greatly appreciated.   
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Andrew Lawrence

Lawrence Lot Clearing Logging                            To God be the glory

Stephen1

Wow you really are confused, and now so am I.
I thought I was making sawdust!
IDRY Vacum Kiln, LT40HDWide, BMS250 sharpener/setter 742b Bobcat, TCM forklift, Sthil 026,038, 461. 1952 TEA Fergusan Tractor

Ga Mtn Man

That is hilarious! :D :D :D

You are not alone in your confusion and consternation.

And don't even get me started on why you use a cant hook on a log but almost never on a cant.  I guess I shoulda just bought a peavey and avoided the whole question altogether. :-\
"If the women don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy." - Red Green


2012 LT40HDG29 with "Superized" hydraulics,  2 LogRite cant hooks, home-built log arch.

coxy

how do you guys think of this stuff   :)  now all I see is a naked log standing on a timber frame    well ill stop here  :D :D :D

Dave Shepard

To me, timber is the standing tree. Once felled, it is a log until it has been slabbed on at least one side, then it is a cant. A cant is a cant until it becomes boards, unless it becomes a timber.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

Buddyw

Anybody ever tell ya, that ya just got too much time on ya hands. ;D

Grizzly

I want to know what you're using in the drip system or in your mug. Sure is providing entertainment out at the mill!!   :D :D
2011 - Logmaster LM-2 / Chinese wheel loader
Jonsered saws - 2149 - 111S - 90?
2000 Miners 3-31 Board Edger

Shotgun

Check under "Extras" near the top of every page and look for Forestry Forum Dictionary.  It may help you, and perhaps it could result in getting more definitions in the FF dictionary.

Norm
Joined The Forestry Forum 5 days before 9/11.

Southside

Quote from: Stephen1 on September 11, 2014, 07:11:43 PM
I thought I was making sawdust!

Stephen, is it really "sawdust" or timber dust?  Do you have a smaller saw at the end of each day??

And don't even get me started on why you use a cant hook on a log but almost never on a cant.

GA Mtn Man, selling a guy a "cant hook" makes almost as much sense as when GM tried to sell the "Nova" to Spanish speaking countries.

Once felled, it is a log until it has been slabbed on at least one side, then it is a cant.

Dave - does that mean log homes that are flat on two sides fall into the "cant frame" style of building?

I want to know what you're using in the drip system or in your mug.

Grizzly - lots of two cycle and diesel exhaust...





Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Hilltop366

Did this come to you shortly after you fuelled up your saw? ;D

Oh ya, you forgot plank, at what thickness does a board become a plank?


Magicman

QuoteGuess I was spending too much time in the sun today when this all came to mind, so bear with me.
You can borrow my umbrella which will help with one of your problems, but you will have to find your own solution to nekkid logs.  :D
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

WmFritz

~Bill

2012 Homebuilt Bandmill
1959 Detroit built Ferguson TO35

ladnerlogging

Quote from: Southside logger on September 11, 2014, 08:56:15 PM
Quote from: Stephen1 on September 11, 2014, 07:11:43 PM
I thought I was making sawdust!

Stephen, is it really "sawdust" or timber dust?  Do you have a smaller saw at the end of each day??


I say cantdust, but really I just don't want to.

Peter Drouin

A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

timberlinetree

That's what working in the woods does to you, your mind starts to wonder.makes you start thinking. Driving tractors does that to. :D
I've met Vets who have lived but still lost their lives... Thank a Vet

Family man and loving it :)

goose63

I would like to know what you guys been drinking and where do I get some?
goose
if you find your self in a deep hole stop digging
saw logs all day what do you get lots of lumber and a day older
thank you to all the vets

Texas Ranger

I don't think any of us are authorized to prescribe medication. 8)
The Ranger, home of Texas Forestry

LeeB

Drinking? I think the found some wacky tobacky growing out in the woods.  :D
'98 LT40HDD/Lombardini, Case 580L, Cat D4C, JD 3032 tractor, JD 5410 tractor, Husky 346, 372 and 562XP's. Stihl MS180 and MS361, 1998 and 2006 3/4 Ton 5.9 Cummins 4x4's, 1989 Dodge D100 w/ 318, and a 1966 Chevy C60 w/ dump bed.

CJennings

If a cant can't become boards, can I use a cant hook on it while making a can't frame house on a canted foundation?

beenthere

south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

POSTON WIDEHEAD

The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Jim_Rogers

Whatever you do, have fun doing it!
Woodmizer 1994 LT30HDG24 with 6' Bed Extension

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