iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

Tough Pine

Started by Gipper, July 23, 2004, 10:18:22 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Gipper

A friend called me tonight to ask about some lumber and also said he had three logs he would like me saw, but they were the real hard pine.  Supposedly they are real weather resistant, rot resistant and tougher than nails to saw.  He could not remember the name of them, or what the person that gave them to him told him they were.  Until the last couple of years, I had not sawed a great deal of pine, but approximately 40,000 bd. ft. since then.  It was mostly white pine and loblolly, and a little black pine and cedar.  None of it was very tough to saw, except an occasional wave around the knots.

I've searched my brain, which didn't take long,  :D , and looked through my bookmarked sites on the web, but I can't fine a pine that would seem to be that hard to saw.  I've been sawing a lot of white oak lately and I can't imagine any pine being that hard.  I live in the Appalachian Mtns., which supposedly has about seventeen different species of pine, but I just haven's run into any that difficult to saw!  Any of you more experienced pine sawyers have any idea what it could be?

Gipper

Cedar Eater

I wouldn't call myself a pine sawyer, but I wonder if your friend really knows his evergreens. For some people all evergreens are either pines or Christmas Trees and all cones are pine cones. If it isn't really pine, it could be American Larch (Tamarack). It's the hardest evergreen that I've cut with a chainsaw and it's highly rot resistant. If the sap smells kinda like orange peel, that's what you got.
Cedar Eater

Cedar Eater

I forgot to mention that Tamarack isn't really an evergreen. It sheds its needles in the fall. It is shaped like an evergreen though and is often confused for dead in the winter.
Cedar Eater

Ianab

Could be it's not actually a Pine, just called that locally?
Harold's 'Australian Pine' springs to mind, at least in the tough to cut area.

ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Lenny_M

  My wife found a pine log that was really hard to saw last week. A real show-stoper when she hot the armor-peircing bullet and nails :o :o
  The owner said, Thats the pine from behind the barn. and that looks like it came from my 30-06. ::)
  The bill said $40 for 2 damaged blades ;D

Ianab

Yup...
I guess the nail was to hold up the target??
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Fla._Deadheader

  In Arkansas, I ran across "Bull" Pine a few times. It would pinch the saw or twist a little and lay over on the saw.   You could have "Heart" Pine. It is longleaf and has a hard heart. You might be getting mis-information. A Southern Yellow, especially Heart Pine, will have LOTS of Pitch that will stick to the blade and you get great "ski-slope" boards, nice and wavy. That could be the "hard-to-saw" you are hearing, not necessarily a hard wood ???

  We just finished cutting Live Oak. Other than the Australian Pine, an Oak also, I doubt if you will find anything harder.  Keep the blades very sharp and use lots of lube. WATCH for a light colored line of build-up that forms on the blade right behind the teeth. That will make the blade dive. It builds up on the bottom of the blade also. I scrape it off while running the blade with lube, at an idle, by standing behind the adjustable guide, and use the corner of a putty knife to scrape the crud. BE CAREFUL and keep the blade sharp.  ;) ;)
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Tracy

Boy that Live oak is fun ain't?. A fellow dropped off 2-20 footers here and wanted so many 2x12x20' so I cut the largest one up after some work with the 5' Alaskan set up and got all that he needed. When he came to pick up the wood he didn't want the other one back so now I get to find something to do with it, I only have a few more laying around to join it. Wish more trailer owner would see that its far cheaper to use in the long run than just anything they can find cheap.

Say Fla._Deadheader that river pine can be pretty hard stuff if you ask me.

Fla._Deadheader

  Hi Tracy. River Pine is more sticky than hard, down here. It IS hard, though.

  Our buyer wants 2 X 12's, but, my partner says "tough cheese". Let them send someone to help load the trailer.

  The buyer "mentioned" the other day, that he went out to help the yard men stack and sticker the Live Oak. He grabbed the first 2 X 8 and stood up. The board stayed on the pile.  :D :D :D :D  He told the yard guy to "break the board loose", it's stuck to the others.  After 3 boards, he thought he heard the phone ringing. ::) ;D ;D ;D :D :D :D

  Have you tried calling around to equipment contractors to sell the Live Oak ???  You would think that once the word was out, they would pester you to death wanting this stuff. Might be the weight factor ??? :D :D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Gipper

Thanks for the response guys.  The still haven't brought them so I haven't seen them to see if I might know what they are.  He came got his other lumber, but still could not remember what the other fellow called them.  I mentioned Larch, but he said that didn't sound like the name the guy used.

Cedar Eater, I think you are certainly correct in that most people, especially here, call anything that is green all year pine.  Other than the approx. 40,000 bd. ft. or so I sawed on another location, I just haven't had much to do with pine.  There's not but about two dozen "pine" trees on the entire 150 acres I live on.

Ianab, I'm not sure what the "Australian Pine" is, but if its like the Oak we have it couldn't be much harder than the white oak.  Hickory is about the only thing we have that I have found harder to saw.  Fla_Deadheader, I think you are right in that the "hard to saw" reference may be due to the high amount of pitch.  Thanks for the info!

Gary_C

Here in MN when people call with some Pine to saw, it is usually Spruce instead of Pine. Spruce can be the toughest thing to saw because of the hard and soft spots around the knots and it's tendency to warp and twist right off the saw. The only blade I have found to cut it straight is the .055 thick and lots of tension.
Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.

Ianab

Hi Gipper

'Australian Pine' is the American name for various Casuarina species. In Australia and NZ they are called She-Oak... dont ask me why.. cos it doesn't look anything like an Oak ???
It's a hardwood and an evergreen, and the leaves look more like pine needles, hence American name I guess.
I haven't cut any myself yet but apparantly it's pretty tough stuff.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Tom

Ian, if you have access to some, your should try your hand.  It would make a really pretty floor if a fellow could break it apart in managable pieces. :)

Ianab

Yup Tom
I've seen pictures of furniture made out of it, very pretty and sort of a honeycomb pattern to the grain. It's is grown locally as shelterbelts and I'm on the lookout for a few good logs.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Fla._Deadheader

  Got a local guy that just got a Lucas. He sawed all the dried up stuff we were supposed to cut. I imagine it will cut OK with a Swinger. We were gonna build one, if Y'all remember that far back.
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Gipper

Update on the tough pine.  The guy brought it today, and the name he gave me was Hemlock.  I have never sawn any hemlock, other than to resaw some timbers for a couple of guys - extra 6 x 10's left over from building a cabin.  They had no bark on them and did not saw very tough at all.  These have bark and being fresh cut, will have all the sap that goes with it.  Will bark and sap make it the "tough" pine they were referring to?

It does look like hemlock, but as I said, have never sawn any that has bark on it.  Due to a back log of custom sawing and orders to fill, it will be a couple of weeks or more before I get the saw in the wood.  Will update then as to how tough is actually is. :D

iain

ian  
 the stringers on our bed are she oak cept here its called lace wood and commands a good price

Ed_K

 I saw a lot of eastern hemlock, not much of a problem, the knots are hard tho. I saw them from the tip end.
Ed K

isawlogs

I saw quite a bit of it , it is rot resiistentit is hard and it has a tendency to have shacke in it , you shoudn't have a probleme sawing it ,
A man does not always grow wise as he grows old , but he always grows old as he grows wise .

   Marcel

Cedar Eater

QuoteIt does look like hemlock, but as I said, have never sawn any that has bark on it.  Due to a back log of custom sawing and orders to fill, it will be a couple of weeks or more before I get the saw in the wood.  Will update then as to how tough is actually is. :D

Hemlock makes more sense than Tamarack for your location. I've heard it's just a little harder than balsam fir which is pretty soft.
Cedar Eater

redpowerd

not sure how they used to do it, but hemlock bark used to be peeled/pryed off and used to make tannin. the hemlock logs ive sawn, the bark pretty much falls right off of it if left out in the weather for a short time. i have to get all the bark of some logs before sawing so it dosent come off in mid cut and go into the guides.
NO FARMERS -- NO FOOD
northern adirondak yankee farmer

Thank You Sponsors!