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A little off?

Started by brendonv, September 03, 2014, 10:01:16 PM

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brendonv

So my brother found a guy selling 10 cord loads for $160 per cord.

First thing i thought was what kind of truck is hauling ten cordS?  Sounded fishy to me. Guy came today and he sent him home with his load. This dude thought this was 10 cord. From my math and past sales of firewood I've sold. I use 190 cu ft for loose thrown and log length and it always comes out perfect for my customers.

We figured this crook had about five cord on there. Its sad that some people probably fall for it. He claims he has 900 cord at his yard. Hahahhaha

"Trees live a secret life only revealed to those that climb them"

www.VorioTree.com

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Vorio-Tree-Experts-LLC/598083593556636

beenthere

It would be around 2 ton per cord, so he is thinking he has 20 ton on that truck. ??
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

brendonv

Ya imagine that. Dude tells my bro to do the math. No math tells us thats ten cord. I wish i was there.
"Trees live a secret life only revealed to those that climb them"

www.VorioTree.com

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Vorio-Tree-Experts-LLC/598083593556636

thecfarm

He needs to be reported!!!
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

JJ

I buy a lot of processed firewood, and a truck that size would max at 3 cord (filled and mounded).
Here is picture of 3 cord truck (stuck on my lawn):

        JJ



 

beenthere

Being stuck on a customers lawn has to be a real downside to delivering firewood.

So the previous "truck" brendonv mentioned may have been closer to 10 face cord, than 10 full cord. No surprise that the rulemakers  invoke the consumer protection commerce laws about what a cord of wood must be when sold.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

doctorb

I once had a great firewood guy.   Very sorry he retired.

I used to purchase 5 cord loads that were delivered by a truck about that size.  The difference?  He had some pre-fab palettes with sidewalls that were 3' X 4' X 5.5' that bolted side by side into his flat bed.  He could put two side by side across and 5 of these pairings front to back.  The 18" wood was stacked into each palette, so the volume of wood was confirmed and visible.  My biggest regret was that all that stacked wood would get dumped by my barn and have to be restacked (by me).  He did mention that he stayed off the main roads as his truck was overweight with a full 5 cord load.
My father once said, "This is my son who wanted to grow up and become a doctor.  So far, he's only become a doctor."

leonz

Quote from: brendonv on September 03, 2014, 10:01:16 PM
So my brother found a guy selling 10 cord loads for $160 per cord.

First thing i thought was what kind of truck is hauling ten cordS?  Sounded fishy to me. Guy came today and he sent him home with his load. This dude thought this was 10 cord. From my math and past sales of firewood I've sold. I use 190 cu ft for loose thrown and log length and it always comes out perfect for my customers.

We figured this crook had about five cord on there. Its sad that some people probably fall for it. He claims he has 900 cord at his yard. Hahahhaha





He might have 5 cords on there if it was cut to 12 inch lengths.


A local sells 2.5 and 5 thrown cord loads off a processor using a
10 wheeler with a soft coal truck dump body. That was definetely
NOT ten full cords of wood.

I suppose the guy only wanted cash too??

This is the major reason why I have always been in favor of selling
wood by weight only which is legal.

I am not trying to start an argument.   

Dave Shepard

I don't think that first truck could get five cord on there if you stacked it tight. ::) I'd make a call to weights and measures. Too many people are going to get ripped off, and for most, money is pretty tight for heating expenses already. It takes a big load to get ten cord on a tri-axle log truck, just for comparison, and it doesn't loose 60% of it's volume in processing.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

terry f

   I've seen confusion on here with cord and face cord. I think Beenthere is right, if a face cord is about 1\3 cord, that looks about right.

Dave Shepard

Face cord isn't used in my area, I don't know about near Brendon. If he wanted $160 cord, then he was probably talking about full cords. If he wanted $160 a face, then he is an even bigger crook.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

brendonv

Ya he was thinking full cords. Never heard face cord around here.

"Trees live a secret life only revealed to those that climb them"

www.VorioTree.com

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Vorio-Tree-Experts-LLC/598083593556636

terry f

   This is the only place I've heard of face cord, but it seems popular on here. If I used the term face cord to anyone I talk to in person, they would have no clue what I was talking about.

thecfarm

Same here, terry. I never heard of it before.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Al_Smith

A face cord is basically 1/3 of a cord.

My bud the tree trimmer has an old Chevy grain truck with a 12 foot bed .Stacked level it will haul around 3 full cord .

By comparrison a standard full sized pick up truck with an 8 foot bed is good for about 1/2 cord and a Ranger size about 1/3 of a cord--face cord .

Ten cords however would be between 36,000 and 40,000 pounds way over loading a single axle truck.

NWP

Quote from: leonz on September 04, 2014, 10:09:57 AM


This is the major reason why I have always been in favor of selling
wood by weight only which is legal.

I am not trying to start an argument.   

I'm not arguing, but how do you account for different species and moisture content?  I wasn't aware of it being legal to sell by weight. Where are you located?
1999 Blockbuster 2222, 1997 Duratech HD10, 2021 Kubota SVL97-2, 2011 Case SV250, 2000 Case 1845C, 2004 Case 621D, John Deere 540A, 2011 Freightliner with Prentice 120C, 2012 Chevrolet, 1997 GMC bucket truck, several trailers, and Stihl saws.

LittleJohn

10 cords, is about equal to a fully loaded semi (more or less) ...so that little truck shown in the first picture is not 10 cords.

Thank god I only buy in log lengths, from a logger I know (did daycare for his kids when they were younger)

leonz

Why would you have to account for different
specie and weight if you know its hardwood and
prove it to the consumer and have scale tickets
for tare and gross weight of the vehicle in question?

The issue is more whether the wood is green
or seasoned for some length of time.

The greener the more weight of course but as
long as you can sell by the ton with scales tickets
there is no question or dishonesty.

The local fellow buys cull logs for $33 per ton and
has a certified scale.

There is nothing to say a portable scale cannot be used
as long as its certified and inspected.     

beenthere

QuoteA face cord is basically 1/3 of a cord.

Only if the wood in the "face" cord is "basically" 16"  ;)
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Dave Shepard

I always liked the idea of selling firewood by weight. As long as it was seasoned, you would have a good idea of the btu's you were getting that way. I think the only way you can sell in MA is by the cord, or portion thereof.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

red oaks lumber

sadly most people buying firewood cut/split/delivered are getting the short end of stick(no pun intended) :) around here alot of the confusion comes from full cord or face cord. buyer beware
the experts think i do things wrong
over 18 million b.f. processed and 7341 happy customers i disagree

beenthere

QuoteI always liked the idea of selling firewood by weight. As long as it was seasoned, you would have a good idea of the btu's you were getting that way.

And if it wasn't seasoned, you'd get a great price for water. ;)
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

brendonv

Anyone know who i would contact to report thus guy?  The more i think about it the more it bothers me.
"Trees live a secret life only revealed to those that climb them"

www.VorioTree.com

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Vorio-Tree-Experts-LLC/598083593556636

NWP

Should be able to contact your state dept of weights and measures.
1999 Blockbuster 2222, 1997 Duratech HD10, 2021 Kubota SVL97-2, 2011 Case SV250, 2000 Case 1845C, 2004 Case 621D, John Deere 540A, 2011 Freightliner with Prentice 120C, 2012 Chevrolet, 1997 GMC bucket truck, several trailers, and Stihl saws.

NWP

Quote from: leonz on September 05, 2014, 09:14:26 AM
Why would you have to account for different
specie and weight if you know its hardwood and
prove it to the consumer and have scale tickets
for tare and gross weight of the vehicle in question?

The issue is more whether the wood is green
or seasoned for some length of time.

The greener the more weight of course but as
long as you can sell by the ton with scales tickets
there is no question or dishonesty.



http://forestry.usu.edu/htm/forest-products/wood-heating

As the chart shows, there are large differences in weights of some species. If I sell by the cord, whether I cut ash or white oak it takes the same amount of logs to make that cord. If I sold by weight, I would have to process more volume of ash than white oak to make a ton of processed wood.

There is no perfect system. People will always cheat customers on firewood. Would there be a sliding price scale based upon moisture content?  Someone also could weigh their loaded weight with concrete blocks in the truck then toss them out prior to delivery thereby increasing the "firewood" weight.
1999 Blockbuster 2222, 1997 Duratech HD10, 2021 Kubota SVL97-2, 2011 Case SV250, 2000 Case 1845C, 2004 Case 621D, John Deere 540A, 2011 Freightliner with Prentice 120C, 2012 Chevrolet, 1997 GMC bucket truck, several trailers, and Stihl saws.

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