J5 bomb skidder

[mog5858]

there is a 1963 j5 for sale that right in my back yard and it all way bean on my list of toys to have is a bomb this one is small and come ready to play with a deck and winch. what the good bad and other about thesis things it looks a little ruff like it was just drag out of the bush and put up for sale.  the front drive seal is leaking and i can see that some of the bogey wheel are weathered. what  is a going price for for this kind of machine he asking 7500.00 witch i think is a bit much but i might just be cheap too. the rubber on the track is showing sins of separating but the steel cleats look good. it will not be used for any real work  like i would say in the 50-100 hours a year rage. would this out pull my 201 TJ? how would it compare. i can't get my pic album to work so just click on the link. thanks for all the help martin.

[mog5858]

lest try this again and hope this works. well if you look up my user name on --Photos MUST be in the Forestry Forum gallery!!!!!-- under J5 you will see is as i can figger out this computer to day

[isawlogs]

 Send a message to sprucebunny, she has a few of those and knows all there is to know of them, she can help with any questions you may have.

[beenthere]

mog
To post your pic that you have in your gallery, just go to the post you made and click on the "modify" button. Then you can click below that posting window where it says "Click here to add Photos to post" and you will be directed to your gallery. Click on the menu line at top "My Gallery" and then you just have to click on the photo you want. It will come up in another window. SCROLL down below that pic a ways and you will see the options to add them to your post. A Yes/No question needs to be answered for the final click. Your gallery will stay up in another window.

Look forward to seeing your pic in your post.

[mog5858]

 well 3 time a charm lol. the guy said it running a 300 Chrysler ind but the tag said 251 it's a flat head 6 from what i could tell and was rebuilt.



  

  

 

[North River Energy]

That appears to be a Red Ram, aka 'nodding donkey'.

The basic chassis has it's moments, but overall a simple and durable tool.

Make sure there isn't any water in the differential case, as you don't want to be sourcing a replacement for pitted/damaged gears.

Also try to figure out what kind of oil is in there.  It should be some sort of wet clutch fluid, not 90w or atf.

Are the tyres solid or pneumatic?

Any chunks missing from the drive sprockets?

Are the road wheels all standing inline, or does it appear the walking beam bearings are loose?
(also look for signs of track rub on the tub.)

Will it steer easily in both directions?  If so, do you feel/hear any unnerving sounds from the differential?

Some loose threads on the edges of the track belting is more or less ok, but you don't want any tears or cuts in the main part of the belts.

That particular variant doesn't come along everyday, so if it's what you've always wanted, you had best take it for a thorough test drive and see what you're in for.

Most parts are available, but for 7500 I'd think you shouldn't have to do too much before putting it to work?


I probably missed a few things.  Sprucebunny will likely add a bunch to the list.

[sprucebunny]

Yes, the Red Ram is rare. I think they only made about 400 of them.
Chrysler flathead 251 is the most common. A Ford 300/6 cyl might fit in to replace it.
Pinion gear/ ring gear are often chipped because water gets in the diff and freezes. Drain for diff should be on right hand side under axle but the Ram maybe a little different.

Looks pretty rusty and the sprocket I can see doesn't look very good. Sprocket is about $600. Air tires are about $125 and hard to get on the rims.

Two kinds of tracks are found with these and J5...proper is 16" wide. Other is 14.5" cleats and will work but really belongs on an SW48.

The winch and rear bed are cool... I'd love to have one like that but in that condition I wouldn't give more than $4000-$5000. Fixing stuff can add up fast !!

[mog5858]

thanks so much for all you good info and help. i was thinking it was a little ruff.  the bogies are air filed and one is looks to be flat right now as well and the other side has miss mach sized tires. i wish i had not just bought a D6 as the toy fund it running way low. i think it was less than 24 h after buying the d6 that is show up for sale. what should the wet clutch fluid look like/ smell?  what would a new set of belting cost?

[sprucebunny]

I see one solid rear wheel. Those cost about $400.

Oils I've used smell like normal clean oil. Get creamy when water in them.

I bought belts 6? years ago fron Dion -F4 in Quebec City. Pre-punched, continuous belts;$880 set of 4.

Used to be a Bombardier/Prinoth dealer in Alberta and thier prices weren't all that bad. Parts also available from http://mn-outdoors.com

[North River Energy]

I was going to say about 5k...

I don't recall the Cat to-4 oil having the distinct stink of common hypoid oil.  But then it's been a while since I changed it.  My SW48 came with 80w90, and wouldn't steer for love nor money until it was changed out and run a bit on the to-4

ATF is, well, reddish and thin.

I think a set of steering band frictions was right around 300? but don't recall if that was if I sent mine in for relining, or if I just purchased the linings and rivets and did it myself.

If you have the time and patience, you can drill your own track belting.  There is a nifty hollow drill bit that makes quick work of the holes.  I found a parts rig with good belts, foamed tyres etc., before I got around to making my own.
If I'm not mistaken, many undercarriage parts are shared with the sidewalk plow, and there are a lot of those out there.

[isawlogs]

 crossers and axles are not same on J5 and SW48(side walk plow) but the rest is almost all interchangeable. Some have different trany's but will fit from one to another, Some three speeds some have four speed. Track from a Sw48 will fit the J5 but J5 will not fit the SW48 because of width.

[Big timber little dozer]

do those have clark diff's ?

[North River Energy]

crossers and axles are not same on J5 and SW48

The axles I knew about, but what means 'crossers'?

[sprucebunny]

Crossers means cleats.

They are not a Clark diff.

They are called an M16 or something like that and I don't know the manufacturer but they were used in some tanks. It is a controlled diff..

Red Ram has different length drive axles. One is longer than the other and longer than J5. This because the whole thing is set up a little cock-eyed to get the seat, controls and engine all at the front of the machine.

[thecfarm]

That's an interesting skidder. I see the body tilts. Why is that?

[loggah]

I don't know much about their small skidders,but i worked on a bunch of the Muskeags years ago, same chrysler industrial engines, transmissions,and differential.The muskeags had 2 sets of wheels side by side in their tracks. The differential is Bombardiers own compensating style,similar to the old cletrac tractors the brake slows one side and the other side speeds up. I spent many a night changing out differentials in the old 301 and 302 bombardier skidozers  at the ski area with the guys from timberland machines.In the skidozers the differential turned the opposite direction ,resulting on poor lube between the ring and pinion.The little bombardiers are good in mud,and snow  but they will not pull wood like a skidder,they just dont have the weight.

[coxy]

you guys up there have all the neat stuff I want one now  :D :D :D :D 8)

[sprucebunny]

Ray, the bed tilts for several reasons.
One being that I don't think they have a brake to set when winching and the back of the bed would contact the ground and act as dead man.

Another is so bigger logs might be skidded. The bed would be a butt plate.

And if you load pulp/shortwood on the bed, you can dump it.

They made a similar set up on Muskegs which is a good bit larger and probably would work better if a person could stand the 7 foot width vs the 5' wide Red Ram/J5.

[mog5858]

great info guy and gals now you have made up my mind i should have it but now i got to find some money lol. thanks for the info

[Chelsea Tree]

Just wondering if the l'il unit was sold?

[mog5858]

well guys just pic up the J5 ram skidder a year later.  i think it mostly needs some TLC. but i need info on how to give her some TLC as this is my first snow cat. there seams to be little info on the made only from 62-65 is what i got. the wired thing is the number bage is not beans stamped. guy i got it from said on of the first 7 never had numbers? in a hurry to get home and the owner forgot to tell me what the shift pattern is. can any one help what are the leaver / nobs for i feel like a nob for asking. how do my drive sprockets look? well hear to a good winter project thanks for all the help i going to need it. hope it turns out as well as my 201 TJ

  

  

  

 
https://youtu.be/JNkzWrStxpE

[Shotgun]

The Forestry Forum has it's own Bombardier expert.  That would be @sprucebunny , and she's likely to be willing to entertain your questions.  Hope she shows up soon.  Good luck.


Norm

[sprucebunny]

Nice find ! There were only about four hundred made.
The lever you have arrows to sure looks like an emergency brake. It would be a driveline brake, maybe a disc mounted on the driveshaft ??? That kind of brake would be a good addition and may have been an option.

You will want to take the engine cover off and just follow cables and lines as there are lots of possibilities both original and added on over time.

My J5s have no numbers either. I think they were just printed on with ink rather than stamped like later ones.

Your sprocket looks almost new but old age as well as sunlight can affect the rubber.

Does it have a 3 or four speed shift ? What engine does it have ? A flathead ?
My J5 has a 4 speed with 2 levers. It also has a PTO which powers my winch.

But your engine is offset ? And don't you have a V-drive 'cause the engine's in the front ?
More pictures, please  ;D

[mog5858]

 the PO called me and said he found a photo copy of part of a manual. it's not complete but dose have some good info. it's a 3 speed and running a rebuilt 251 Chrysler 6 Flathead.  sale brochure said it weight is only 5050 lb with a max speed of 16 mph.  but what i find odd is it's saying that the winch in only a 10,000 lb it looks bigger than that. i guess they did not wont to pull it apart. what kind of fluid should i be using for the diff/ steering clutches. so of the controls are a little customized and i would not say in a good way. i think i going to take the 4" riser out of the back of the bed cus right now it will not touch the ground. and then get to setting the arch right. what should i run you PSI in the tires. will get some pic of her when she comes apart. two videos one of a test drive and other controls.
https://youtu.be/W0OW4UB3hY0
https://youtu.be/4xcVLCm6RkA

[sprucebunny]

The tires are supposed to have 100 pounds in them.

Any good quality tractor/hydraulic wet clutch type oil. The differential has a brakeband around drums on each side.

Yes, it looks like your steering levers could use some adjustment. There are nuts on top of the differential housing that you might be able to take a little slack out of but I have no idea how the levers are connected to them or if there might be lots of slack/play in the connection system itsself.