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Chain saw purchase question

Started by MRowsh, June 03, 2014, 11:51:02 AM

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MRowsh

Hello,
I have two Husqvarna chainsaws models 371 and 365. I dropped couple of big pines over last weekend (one of them over 76 years old) the saw was not capable of what I wanted. And yes I had cleaned the air filter!

Anyway, wife is going to buy me a good one for fathers day. I have selected the Stihl model 461 with 25 inches of bar.  I never owned one of them, I need to know for that price ($1099.95 for 25 inch bar) is there anything better for my money?

Appreciate the good recommendations ahead of time.
LogMaster LM2 with Kubota V1305 Diesel conversion.
There is a price for everything in life!!!  No free lunches!
Retired US Army.

JohnG28

That's a pretty nice saw from what I have heard. I haven't run one by my 460 is a great saw with lots of power.
Stihl MS361, 460 & 200T, Jonsered 490, Jonsereds 90, Husky 350 & 142, Homelite XL and Super XL

beenthere

QuoteI dropped couple of big pines over last weekend

What is a "big" pine? (age doesn't mean anything to describe "big" ;)  )

And "not capable" of what you wanted, isn't very descriptive but may be important to what someone would recommend.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

celliott

Well I've never ran a Stihl 461. I have run a husky 372xp (same power as a 371) The stats sheet suggests the two are pretty close. Both 70cc class saws, the 461 probably has a a bit more grunt at 76cc's. I'm just wondering, if the 371 wasn't capable of what you wanted, if the 461 is a big enough step up in power. Might want to step up to a Stihl 660 or a husky 390xp? Next step up.

I know my 372xp is always capable of whatever I want it to do. But that's subjective to the user, I'd say.
Chris Elliott

Clark 666C cable skidder
Husqvarna and Jonsered pro saws
265rx clearing saw
Professional maple tubing installer and maple sugaring worker, part time logger

7sleeper

Is your 365 a 365XP? If yes I would think about sending it to one of the better known saw modders and get a tune up. That would be way more economical with some improvement in performance that might be enough for what you are looking for.

But if you want a saw upgrade I would definately not exclude the Dolmar 7900/7910! That would be an interesting saw for me!

Why not the 461? Because it doesn't have M Tronic! For me that is a deal breaker in that price range.

7

clww

I run a 460 or a 461 six days a week. No noticeable difference between the two cutting trees. Occasionally I run a 25" bar, but normally a 20" with 3/8" skip-tooth chains. The new saws are expensive which is why I keep an eye on the local CL. I got my used (one tree cut) 460 for $500.
Many Stihl Saws-16"-60"
"Go Ask The Other Master Chief"
18-Wheeler Driver

HolmenTree

Quote from: MRowsh on June 03, 2014, 11:51:02 AM
Hello,
I have two Husqvarna chainsaws models 371 and 365. I dropped couple of big pines over last weekend (one of them over 76 years old) the saw was not capable of what I wanted. And yes I had cleaned the air filter!
Appreciate the good recommendations ahead of time.
MRowsh. this is so funny , please excuse my brashness. But you have to realize you have 2 perfectly good get r' done saw powerheads........but you have to realize the best accessory for a sharp sawchain is a good reliable high power to weight ratio powerhead :D :)
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

shiggins

Wow. Beast saw!  Amazing price difference. Here is Australia it costs 1900. And that's with the 20" bar. Bloody 5!@#%^&*

mad murdock

For sure, if you have 2 371's why not drop a little coin into some performance mods by a known good performance shop?  As has been stated, you will save a lot of $$. At least that is what I would do.
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

Ianab

I'm also in the "so what's wrong with the saws you have?" camp.

Like if "do what you want" is cut properly, cos they are old and just plain worn out, Then buying a nice shiny new MS461 makes sense, it's a perfectly good saw.

But if the old saw just wont cut right because the bar is worn or something else minor like that, then fix what's wrong. The MS461 isn't going to be magically better. It's only 5 cc more, which is really not a huge difference. Like your skill at sharpening will make more difference to the actual performance.

Also, technique. I have no issues taking down 36" dia trees with a 60cc / 20" farm grade Stihl. I got a bigger (79cc) Dolmar to handle the big stuff  ;)

Ian

Edit: Of course if you just WANT a new saw, then who are we to argue  ;) :D
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

beenthere

QuoteOf course if you just WANT a new saw, then who are we to argue

+1
smiley_thumbsup
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

celliott

Quote from: beenthere on June 04, 2014, 09:20:44 AM
QuoteOf course if you just WANT a new saw, then who are we to argue

+1
smiley_thumbsup

I think that's probably the case  ;D

AND if that is the case, I would still recommend the OP step up to a bigger class saw to make sure it's capable of what he wants  :) Get a husky 390xp  ;)
Chris Elliott

Clark 666C cable skidder
Husqvarna and Jonsered pro saws
265rx clearing saw
Professional maple tubing installer and maple sugaring worker, part time logger

Oliver1655

If you want to use a 25" bar, Great, get one for the 371. 

I have a Stihl 08s, stock, 56cc, I run a 25" bar with .404 / 63 gauge semi-chisel & square cut chain for falling / bucking large trunks & while it is a little slower, 7,000 rpm in the cut, I have no problems with dropping 48-50" trees.   

As others have stated, a sharp chain, let it feed it's way in, & you should have no problems.

If you really feel you need to step up, go with a 395 or equivalent.  Make the step worth the effort.
John

Stihl S-08s (x2), Stihl S10 (x2), Jonsered CS2139T, Husqvarna 338XPT California, Poulan Microvibe XXV, Poulan WoodShark, Poulan Pro 42cc, McCulloch Mini-Mac 6 (x2), Van Ruder Hydraulic Tractor Chainsaw

MRowsh

Outstanding responses. I am glad I made some one laugh.

I have this chain sharpner:
http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-chain-saw-sharpener-68221-8346.html

Is it normal for a chain to looses it's sharpness after dropping 4 trees?  3 oak, and one big pine. The pine is over 2 feet wide cut.

1.  Of course lack of experience can have a lot to do with my thoughts!! 

2.  Also I just wanted a German made saw. 

And now;  I got one. Without using it yet,  I believe it is much better saw than those I have, of course this is just my opinion without any testing and evaluation. Just the way it is together to include the owner's manual!! I also got 3 bars (2 25 inch and one 20 inch) and 8 chains ( 6 25 inch and 2 20 inch) . Hope these last for the next 5 years.

With respect to rebuilding the old ones for more power; please provide information to who is the one.  Or, for some one who is mechanically inclined ; what parts and where I should order them from?

Again, thanks for all interesting responses.  God bless you all.
LogMaster LM2 with Kubota V1305 Diesel conversion.
There is a price for everything in life!!!  No free lunches!
Retired US Army.

beenthere

QuoteIs it normal for a chain to looses it's sharpness after dropping 4 trees?  3 oak, and one big pine. The pine is over 2 feet wide cut.

Not normal for a chain to become dull after 4 trees.. but it will become less sharp. Diameter does not have much to do with it. I touch up the chain with a file after each fill of fuel and oil.

If the chain even touches dirt, it will lose sharpness rapidly and to the point it needs to be sharpened if you want good cutting.

No one laughing at you. ;)
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Ianab

The new Stihl will be a fine saw, no worries there. Have fun using it  :)

But as for the chain getting dull? In clean wood you would expect it to last longer than that. But if you touch the dirt, or there is dirt or grit in the bark of the trees, then you can dull it in seconds. And the same will happen to the new saw. OK some chains are grinding patterns do stay sharp a bit longer because of harder steel and a different cutter shape, but what I'm saying is the make and model of powerhead wont really affect things.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

7sleeper

Quote from: MRowsh on June 05, 2014, 02:56:28 PM
Outstanding responses. I am glad I made some one laugh.

I have this chain sharpner:
http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-chain-saw-sharpener-68221-8346.html

Is it normal for a chain to looses it's sharpness after dropping 4 trees?  3 oak, and one big pine. The pine is over 2 feet wide cut.

1.  Of course lack of experience can have a lot to do with my thoughts!! 

2.  Also I just wanted a German made saw. 

And now;  I got one. Without using it yet,  I believe it is much better saw than those I have, of course this is just my opinion without any testing and evaluation. Just the way it is together to include the owner's manual!! I also got 3 bars (2 25 inch and one 20 inch) and 8 chains ( 6 25 inch and 2 20 inch) . Hope these last for the next 5 years.

With respect to rebuilding the old ones for more power; please provide information to who is the one.  Or, for some one who is mechanically inclined ; what parts and where I should order them from?

Again, thanks for all interesting responses.  God bless you all.
@MRowsh,

There are quite a few well known out there. Names would be Dozerdan, blsnelling, Mastermind, tlandrum, etc. You might not find them all here but there are also other forums where you can find them.

And you might see some threads by them where you can make up your own mind about their work.

And I have a similar grinder and am also happy with the results. Not perfect but completely usable.

7

JohnG28

Yeah, if the wood pulled sand or dirt into the bark you can dull the chain just felling a few trees.  Touch up the cutters with a file quick like every so often will help. Let's get some video of that nice new saw cutting!  8)
Stihl MS361, 460 & 200T, Jonsered 490, Jonsereds 90, Husky 350 & 142, Homelite XL and Super XL

HolmenTree

Pine which likes to grow on sandy rocky soil tends to have dirt grit in it's bark near ground level.
Spruce and balsam fir are usually always have clean bark with the fact they grow mostly in mossy terrain.

Cutting clean timber like spruce can actually hone a sharp chain sharper with a polished gullet and cutting edge.
I've seen that after steady cutting in a 8 hour day logging spruce.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

MRowsh

Yes, I checked, the is sand imbeded into the barks where I have placed the cut. I cut very close to ground. I am trying to get as much wood as I can! And there is a price to pay.

I was not healthy enough to use the chain saw today, but I sharpened up the other two saws, and cleaned up the air filters.  Here is a picture of them.



 
LogMaster LM2 with Kubota V1305 Diesel conversion.
There is a price for everything in life!!!  No free lunches!
Retired US Army.

beenthere

Looks like you keep them cleaned up good and they look in great shape.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

John R

Quote from: MRowsh on June 03, 2014, 11:51:02 AM
Hello,
I have two Husqvarna chainsaws models 371 and 365. I dropped couple of big pines over last weekend (one of them over 76 years old) the saw was not capable of what I wanted. And yes I had cleaned the air filter!

Anyway, wife is going to buy me a good one for fathers day. I have selected the Stihl model 461 with 25 inches of bar.  I never owned one of them, I need to know for that price ($1099.95 for 25 inch bar) is there anything better for my money?

Appreciate the good recommendations ahead of time.


That's a good price, you will really like that saw.
John


Sthil MS 361 20" Bar
Sthil MS 260 PRO 16" Bar
Oregon 511 AX Chain Grinder

Andyshine77

Keep in mind, the chain on the saw often matters more than the saw itself. You can have all the power in the world, but it doesn't matter squat if the chains not properly sharpened. There is no set time how long a chain should stay sharp, when it's dull and not self feeding through the cut, the chain needs work.
Andre.

Ianab

Quote from: Andyshine77 on June 08, 2014, 12:30:53 AM
Keep in mind, the chain on the saw often matters more than the saw itself. You can have all the power in the world, but it doesn't matter squat, if the chains not properly sharpened.

Very true, and if your are sawing dirty wood, and the chain stops cutting after 4 trees, you should be sharpening it after 3. Then it only needs a couple of strokes with a file on each cutter. Do that in the field with a file and guide. Only takes a few minutes, and as you are only taking a tiny amount off with the file, your chain will last much longer. If you use the dull chain until it practically wont cut, the edge will be badly rounded over, and you will need to grind away a lot more metal to get a good edge back.

Keep the grinder to occasionally true up the chain angles in case your filing isn't 100%, or you actually do hit a rock and the chain needs some serious work.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Andyshine77

Quote from: Ianab on June 08, 2014, 12:41:05 AM
Quote from: Andyshine77 on June 08, 2014, 12:30:53 AM
Keep in mind, the chain on the saw often matters more than the saw itself. You can have all the power in the world, but it doesn't matter squat, if the chains not properly sharpened.

Very true, and if your are sawing dirty wood, and the chain stops cutting after 4 trees, you should be sharpening it after 3. Then it only needs a couple of strokes with a file on each cutter. Do that in the field with a file and guide. Only takes a few minutes, and as you are only taking a tiny amount off with the file, your chain will last much longer. If you use the dull chain until it practically wont cut, the edge will be badly rounded over, and you will need to grind away a lot more metal to get a good edge back.

Keep the grinder to occasionally true up the chain angles in case your filing isn't 100%, or you actually do hit a rock and the chain needs some serious work.

Ian

Good post. However we need to stop with all the 1 tree 3 trees stuff. Sharpen the chain when you see the working corner reflect light and obviously if the chain doesn't self feed and pull nice big chips.

MRowsh, do you know about setting the depth gauges? If not you're chain will never cut, even if the tooth itself is perfectly sharp. The two Husky saws you have should pull a 25" bar and chain well in any type of wood. If not something is up with the saws, the chains on the saws, or the operator.     
Andre.

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