Myrtle the Turtle is not happy! (Detroit 3-53 skipping)

Dave Shepard · June 03, 2014, 06:58:06 PM

I think the problem is in the valves, at this point. I don't know how else it would be popping through the exhaust. I found a place that has a complete head kit for $265. Valves, seats, guides, retainers, springs and injector tubes. I know guides are easy to change, but what about seats? Do the old seats have to be cut and the new seats fit in, or are the originals removable? Seems like a good way to have a "new" head.

BargeMonkey · June 03, 2014, 07:59:58 PM

Depends what kinda money you wanna throw at it. I dealt with Swentons in Lake George when I did mine, the 2 stroke detroits are a special breed, and different applications took different parts, I learned the hard way. You would be worlds ahead to give them a call if your going to fix this right. I will dig up their number, but im sure others on here have it handy. They did a super job on my 353.

whitepine2 · June 03, 2014, 08:35:57 PM

53's can have cracks between the valves they are noted for this.If you have the head off good idea to have it fluxed,worth the effort ask me how I know.
Did you try changing the injectors with one you know is good how did that work or is it still popping?

treeslayer2003 · June 03, 2014, 11:53:18 PM

Quote from: Dave Shepard on June 03, 2014, 06:58:06 PM
I think the problem is in the valves, at this point. I don't know how else it would be popping through the exhaust. I found a place that has a complete head kit for $265. Valves, seats, guides, retainers, springs and injector tubes. I know guides are easy to change, but what about seats? Do the old seats have to be cut and the new seats fit in, or are the originals removable? Seems like a good way to have a "new" head.

you didn't say it was popping thru exhust before......burnt valve or eroded seat. take the head to a good shop to have the seats ground/repaired and new valves as required. make sure the exhust system don't let rain water in.

Dave Shepard · June 04, 2014, 09:54:11 AM

Quote from: Dave Shepard on May 23, 2014, 08:43:10 PM
Brought the TJ208 home this afternoon. Pulled off the road and started to head cross lots to get back to the farm and it started smoking, unburned fuel, and lost power. At idle, it sounds fine, except for a bit of popping in the exhaust. Talked to a couple of friends that know Detroits, and they are thinking bad injector. Anyone have this happen before?

Mentioned in the first post. I'll pull the head at some point, but I have about 20k feet of white pine in the yard to mill and sticker before it stains. I have a friend that has a machine shop and has worked on Detroits, although he has more time working on 8-268 and 12v278 engine. :D I also have a friend that is helping me on this that was trained on Detroits.

treeslayer2003 · June 04, 2014, 05:10:57 PM

ah, i musta forgot....gettin old lol.
if its burnt good ya get a suckin noise in the exhust note.
we ran a loader for a while with a burnt valve.....it didn't get no better or worse.
if it just a valve and the seats look good, you can put in a new valve.
make sure to adjust to spec.
injector tubes don't give much trouble in a detroit so i wouldn't spend on any kit, just fix whats wrong with it.

Dave Shepard · December 22, 2014, 03:33:30 PM

Myrtle went to the shop today. Should know what's up next week, depending on when they get into it.

jwilly3879 · December 22, 2014, 05:05:40 PM

Please keep us 3-53 users informed.

sandsawmill14 · December 22, 2014, 06:02:38 PM

I had a 6-71 do that one time it was the emergency stop accidently got pulled talk about being laughed by mechanic :-[ but it was an easy fix ;D

tantoy · December 22, 2014, 10:21:51 PM

Quote from: Dave Shepard on December 22, 2014, 03:33:30 PM
Myrtle went to the shop today. Should know what's up next week, depending on when they get into it.

Wow long time you been without myrtle, Yes keep us Detroit fans updated.

Dave Shepard · December 23, 2014, 09:11:13 AM

I only had the skidder for the one job last spring, which I finished. I was actually on the way home from the last part of the job when it started skipping. I don't normally log, but it was the only way I was going to get some good pine. I'll keep this thread updated when I hear more.

longtime lurker · December 23, 2014, 03:45:10 PM

My first thought on reading this was "uh oh, spun the turbo backwards"... during transport its a good idea to stuff a rag down the exhaust as sometimes air pressure down the pipe when you're doing 60mph down the highway will spin the turbo. Bearings are dry because the motor is off so it cooks them. No blower =no scavange cycle = engine runs hot, pops, and unburnt fuel.
Rare but it does happen.

Dave Shepard · December 23, 2014, 04:45:15 PM

Myrtle doesn't have a turbo. I've done the injector test, and it's definitely not firing on No.2. Injector has good spray pattern, and the tip is intact, so it's somewhere from the head down. Hoping it's a valve, as that won't be a bad fix.

bushmechanic · December 23, 2014, 07:52:52 PM

Soooo Dave you didn't swap the injectors like UN hooker said? Or better yet install a good injector and try it? Those are unit injectors and not only do they spray the fuel they meter the amount of fuel for injection. If one is not metering right then that can give you popping in the exhaust. I have seen them go into full fuel and then there is a cloud of white smoke comming out the exhaust. I'm not saying that you don't have a burnt or dropped valve but you should have checked the injector with a good one, may have saved you a large bill.

snowstorm · December 24, 2014, 07:23:41 AM

i had a 671 yrs ago that ran good but just never sounded right. uneven at idle and different than a 671 should sound. what i found was the snap ring that holds the cam follower in had come out. i used a die grinder with a cut wheel the same with as the snap ring and re cut the grove

Puffergas · December 24, 2014, 01:46:38 PM

I should still have my 53 series manual if ya need some info.. :P

I'd hit the easy and simple and replace the injector, common problem.

I have a head off an old gama goat engine.

Marry Christmas,
Jeff from PA

Dave Shepard · December 24, 2014, 02:04:31 PM

Thanks for the offer. I think we are going to try swapping an injector around. There was also talk of taking the engine out and having it gone through. I know it has low compression, as it starts hard in even warmish weather. Not going to do anything until after the holidays.

Dave Shepard · January 10, 2015, 07:56:07 PM

I just got a text message: Broken valve and bent rod. So, that's the answer to the burning question. :D Valve must have been intact enough to hold the spring together, or it would have come apart when I pulled the injector.

treeslayer2003 · January 10, 2015, 11:23:56 PM

Quote from: Dave Shepard on January 10, 2015, 07:56:07 PM
I just got a text message: Broken valve and bent rod. So, that's the answer to the burning question. :D Valve must have been intact enough to hold the spring together, or it would have come apart when I pulled the injector.

bent push rod or bent conecting rod?

Dave Shepard · January 11, 2015, 11:23:30 AM

Con rod, I suspect. I'll know more next week.

treeslayer2003 · January 11, 2015, 11:48:13 AM

if that is the case, go over your exhaust and make sure no rain water can enter. even think about wind blown rain and irrigation.....i seen that ruin one.

Puffergas · January 11, 2015, 01:13:49 PM

I'd lean toward a bent push rod. It would take a lot to bend the con ron. Sometimes when a valve smacks the piston it can crimp the ring slots and pinch the rings. Something to check for.

:new_year:

treeslayer2003 · January 11, 2015, 07:47:51 PM

Quote from: Puffergas on January 11, 2015, 01:13:49 PM
I'd lean toward a bent push rod. It would take a lot to bend the con ron. Sometimes when a valve smacks the piston it can crimp the ring slots and pinch the rings. Something to check for.

:new_year:

a table spoon of water will bend a connecting rod........believe it

Puffergas · January 11, 2015, 08:54:52 PM

Quote from: treeslayer2003 on January 11, 2015, 07:47:51 PM
Quote from: Puffergas on January 11, 2015, 01:13:49 PM

a table spoon of water will bend a connecting rod........believe it

OK, I thought just the valve hit the piston for some reason but what your saying is that water got in and did the original damage.. OK, that would do it big time...

Dave Shepard · January 15, 2015, 02:50:29 PM

Somebody from Swinton's came down and tore the engine apart. #2 con rod was bent. Probably got water in it at some point. The crank, camshaft and all related bearings look good, so they are going to put new liner kits in and do the head. Myrtle will be 100% again in the next day or two.