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Author Topic: 460 rebuild question  (Read 2032 times)

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Offline Woodboogah

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460 rebuild question
« on: April 03, 2014, 05:45:44 pm »
I got rid of my favorite saw (460) because it got rebuilt twice and a third time would have been a new saw.  I bought another one because I missed it.  Well yesterday it crapped out on me and I want to give the rebuild a try myself.  I am looking for any information on to help me along, tricks, do's or dont's.  Also I am looking at the two aftermarket brands from baileys NWP and Meteor.  I was going to get the kit from meteor but would like some suggestions from you guys past experiences.  All info is much appreciated.  Thanks in advance. 
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline JohnG28

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #1 on: April 03, 2014, 09:30:21 pm »
What's wrong with it at this point? Cylinder condition? If cylinder is save able then new piston and rings could make it good to go. But need to find out what cooked it first? And what is it you're doing to kill all these 460s?!?!
Stihl MS361, 460 & 200T, Jonsered 490, Jonsereds 90, Husky 350 & 142, Homelite XL and Super XL

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2014, 06:36:10 am »
My old 460 was just use.  I had it for 8 years and used it everyday.  This one was bought of an old timer that needed money I wanted another 460.  So he got some cash and I got another saw.  I have been using since.  I dont know the back story.  At this point I know the piston is scored I have not checked the cylinder.  I will be tearing into tonight when the rain comes.   
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline JohnG28

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2014, 08:10:52 am »
Before you tear it down later a pressure/vacuum test would be a good idea to check the condition of seals. This is a better idea while it is still completely together. After that then have a look at the cylinder and take it from there.
Stihl MS361, 460 & 200T, Jonsered 490, Jonsereds 90, Husky 350 & 142, Homelite XL and Super XL

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2014, 11:05:48 am »
Will do.  Thank you for the tip!
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline AdkStihl

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2014, 10:06:03 pm »
If youre gonna use an aftermarket top end......Meteor is one of/if not the best.
Meteor is actually an OEM supplier to STIHL for some OPE  ;)
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Offline JohnG28

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2014, 10:41:02 pm »
If youre gonna use an aftermarket top end......Meteor is one of/if not the best.
Meteor is actually an OEM supplier to STIHL for some OPE  ;)

Where ya been? ???
Stihl MS361, 460 & 200T, Jonsered 490, Jonsereds 90, Husky 350 & 142, Homelite XL and Super XL

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2014, 02:25:13 pm »
I thought I would have a chance to start fooling with this and have not yet.  Hopefully this weekend.  Being busy is not bad but I want my 460 back, chopping with 660 is becoming a work out!  If and when I tear this down is there any specific tools to saws that I would need or make life simpler?  I am planning on getting a piston and cylinder if I dont need the cylinder no big deal I am sure one day I will.  seal kits? anything like that I should be replacing while in there? 
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline JohnG28

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2014, 03:44:49 pm »
If its a high hour saw then seals might not be a bad idea. If you find there's an air leak then definitely.  Tools, for Stihl a T27 T handle is a big help. New base gasket while you're doing the new p/c too.
Stihl MS361, 460 & 200T, Jonsered 490, Jonsereds 90, Husky 350 & 142, Homelite XL and Super XL

Offline ohiowoodchuck

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2014, 10:43:47 pm »
I would put new crank seals in. Seals that are a couple years old won't hold up to the vacuum of a new piston/rings. Then it's just a matter of time till they would cause a lean condition. Imo
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Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2014, 08:00:57 am »
Will do.  Thanks for the replies
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline chainsaw samurai

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #11 on: April 14, 2014, 08:50:04 am »
I just did a 460 a cpl months ago My first ! I would get a T-27 6" driver and a N-M torque wrench. If you are a novice saw builder(lol) as I am, this insures it will it will go together in "spec" and you don't have to worry about stripping out the magnesium. I think you will also need a flywheel puller if you are doing the seals. You can use sockets to drive the new seals in, but an actual seal installer can make it a little easier if you are not used to installing seals. A good pump-mity vac 8500 for example is nice  to check vac/pressure and I would re-check after engine is all assembled(easier to fix a problem then). I made a plate for the exhaust and intake(and used long spacers and the carb nuts) and covered them with roofing rubber flashing to block off the ports and pulled/pushed through the impulse tube. a lot cheaper than that Stihl contraption. I also pulled the de-comp valve and plugged the hole since even my new valve was very slightly leaking. A ring compressor and piston block make things easier too. As for the piston pin circlip you are on your own lol, the tool I have is too big for these tiny chainsaw engines, so I just worked it in with a small screwdriver and a lot of patience. I am by no means an expert, these are just some suggestions that I used.

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #12 on: April 14, 2014, 01:12:18 pm »
much appreciated.  I have had no time between finishing up sugaring and starting on a mud lot.  This has sat on the back burner.  As much as I dont want rain thats about the only thing that is going to allow me to get at this saw.  Thanks again!
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2014, 02:16:59 pm »
against better judgment I ordered the NWP piston and cylinder.  I wanted to order the meteor but they were backordered at baileys.  So I went with NWP.  I just want my saw back running.  I have been running my 362 and it just doesnt compare for production.  Helps my tendons in my arm though!  Nice and light
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2014, 08:04:04 pm »
Well I finally got my saw back together.  Runs great!  No more paying someone to rebuild saws for me! 
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline ZeroJunk

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2014, 08:34:52 pm »
Cool. Not much to it is it. I suspect the NWP will work until you are sick of it.

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #16 on: April 25, 2014, 07:49:58 am »
I will put it to work today see what happens. 
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline sharkey

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #17 on: April 27, 2014, 01:25:33 am »
Hi Erik,
Good job on the rebuild.  Do take the time to pressure and vac test the repair.  Mity-vac 8500 is a good tool for this or you can make yourself something.  Crankcase should hold 5-7 psi for a couple of minutes.  If it wont hold, get out the Windex and look for leaks.  Problem areas are where the cylinder bolts to the case, or behind the flywheel and clutch.  Compression release threads may also leak.

Cut a couple strips of rubber from an old inner tube and put a piece between the muffler/cylinder and the carb/cylinder.  Keep the spark plug in tight and the compression release closed.  Pressure test through the impulse hose port.       

I like your Blue Ribbon website!

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #18 on: April 27, 2014, 09:34:20 am »
Sharkey I did not do a pressure test.  I did take the whole saw apart minus cracking the case.  It was filthy from use and figure it was a good time to clean and inspect everything.  I wanted to replace anything that needed replacing.  I have run the saw for two full days without any issues.  I have put about 2 gallons of fuel through it and runs flawlessly.  Next is my 660!!  Thanks for the compliment on my website.  I wish it was worded a little different.  A friend of mine made it for free so the price was right, cant complain to much.  The only thing I would change is some of the terminology. 
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline chainsaw samurai

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #19 on: April 27, 2014, 03:28:27 pm »
Nice- why pay someone to do it when you can do it yourself! Plus taking the time to detail clean it is some thing you don't usually get from a "professional". Did you do the standard(52mm) or the Big bore(54mm) NWP kit ? I was uninformed when I did mine and spent cubic dollars on all Stihl parts. I am curious how these aftermarket kits hold up from a firsthand source like yourself. And your website is way cool!

Offline JohnG28

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #20 on: April 27, 2014, 10:42:28 pm »
Check out some of Spike60 and weimedog's videos on aftermarket p/c kits. They have been testing them on Huskys, but still good reviews from first hand experience.
Stihl MS361, 460 & 200T, Jonsered 490, Jonsereds 90, Husky 350 & 142, Homelite XL and Super XL

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #21 on: April 28, 2014, 11:05:19 am »
I got the big bore kit.   I figured why not?  So far so good.   I punched out the muffler a little bit too.  I will check out those videos.  Thanks!
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #22 on: June 02, 2014, 01:54:20 pm »
Well that didn't last long.  Scored piston yesterday bucking firewood for my cousin.  Always the case doing stuff for  free.  Bit the bullet today and bought a new 461.. So far so good today.  Hope I get a couple years out of it anyways.
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline ZeroJunk

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #23 on: June 02, 2014, 11:28:50 pm »
I would be curious if you do an autopsy whether or not something went wrong with the kit or it leaned out.

Offline Woodboogah

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #24 on: June 03, 2014, 05:53:08 am »
I am going to take it apart and rebuild it again for a back up.  I just cant afford the down time so bought a new saw.  There is a good possibility that it was something I did putting it back together.   I was running 40:1 mix with synthetic oil.  Ran really well then just died the muffler side of the piston is scored.  Previous to that it was the plug side.   
Keenan Logging & Tree Care, LLC

Offline OneWithWood

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #25 on: June 03, 2014, 12:44:07 pm »
Did you do a leak down or vacuum test after installing the big bore kit?  A leaking seal will kill the saw in no time.
I put a big bore kit on my 460 a couple of years ago.  Running strong and dependable.
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Offline ZeroJunk

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Re: 460 rebuild question
« Reply #26 on: June 03, 2014, 01:01:52 pm »
If the saw was tuned properly leaking seal or not it should not score the piston. Now, if it starts leaking or progresses and you don't hear it in time to adjust for it you will have problems. And, if it will no longer return to idle it should jump out at you. I have chased leaking seals by richening the mix until I got time or in the mood to replace them.