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You had to see it to believe it !

Started by scully, February 06, 2014, 07:43:16 PM

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Peter Drouin

Quote from: Dave Shepard on February 07, 2014, 08:36:45 PM
Quote from: Peter Drouin on February 07, 2014, 07:39:04 PM
Or the guy first day at work. Told to get the cat loader and load the truck. The guy jumps in and start it. The boss goes over and tells the new guy to shut it off. The new guy jumps down???. The boss tells him he's fired. He's like what. The Boss tells him he did not check the oil or grease it first. If you're that stupid I don't need you.  :D :D :D :D ;D

That's a setup. I'd have words with the guy and be DanG glad I wasn't working for him any longer. Anybody who would do that isn't somebody you want to work for. If the new guy had been trained to check first and didn't, then he had an argument. How is a new hire expected to know what the boss wants? He was told to get the loader and load the truck, not service the loader. Head games are for losers.




All he had to do Dave is ask [Do you want me to check the oil first] that tells the boss, he thinking  :) the same when a man works for you. If you have to tell him what to do all the time and when he's done, he stops and stands there and waits for you to tell him what to do next I don't need him. But when you have a guy finds things to do after he's done the job you gave him. He's a keeper. I have had 20+ men work for me at a time. Over the years I know who will make you money and who will lose you money  :)
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

NMFP

ST Ranch, I agree with some of what you have said.  The issue that arises is that manufacturers are only required to offer parts for 7 years.  I know first hand how this goes as I deal with it on a daily basis.  Not easy to buy parts for a machine that's 10 years old often times! And because there aren't many machines to begin with, no one offers aftermarket so where do you buy parts?

The company I used to work for leased all of their trucks and a good portion of the equipment and we had ALOT of equity in product, facility and non leased products.  The trucks were leased because they were unlimited mileage, we did not pay out of pocket for repairs, if we needed a major repair, that was covered and they provided a rental truck for us for free.  When you need to run lumber 5-6 days a week up to 400 miles each way, you need reliability.  Also, we did not need to have a mechanic on site for repairs.  As for manufacturing equipment, it was nice to not have moulders with outdated technology as speed and proficiency makes money.

I currently lease 3 pieces of equipment because I only need them for a few years to do certain jobs.  Once the jobs are done, the equipment goes back and I am not stuck with liquidating equipment that may or may not be needed.  There are numerous heavy equipment operations around here selling used equipment and they don't want equipment older than 8 years because of wear and replacement of parts and reliability. 

Currently, where I work, we lease a lot of heavy construction equipment as its less expensive to lease and turn in than to own and repair.  With some of todays technology, you don't want that long term as many times, we have had machines that work great for a few years but you see a lot of problems with them later on as electrical components wear out. 

Leasing isn't for everyone but please don't attack a generation and accuse us of being a throw away society. 

If leasing works for some applications, let it alone and let those that lease keep moving and making money.

GDinMaine

Quote from: reswire on February 07, 2014, 08:45:40 PMMy parents taught me to work, enjoy the opportunity to work, and to be responsible for my actions.  Those values are now looked down upon, and made fun of by the liberal media.  It's all about lawsuits and blaming others for our mistakes.

I'm so glad you let us know who is responsible for the troubles of this country.

Quote from: reswire on February 07, 2014, 08:45:40 PM
Eighty percent of the students were there to learn, but the 20 percent who came to disrupt, ruined the educational opportunities for many.

...and... that 20 percent went on to join the liberal media?
It's the going that counts not the distance!

WM LT-40HD-D42

Magicman

We have not necessarily "upgraded" our moral standards.  We have gradually "learned" to accept and tolerate lower moral standards.  Yes, we have a few that have and uphold high work ethics as well as moral ethics, but I see too many that have very little of either.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

NMFP

Exactly.  I teach in a college where we teach hands on training in forestry.  Its very rewarding to see the students we do have with a good work ethic.  There are some though that do not.  I do not bend to their way and they don't conform to my way but rather, we know what needs to be done and just do it. 

I can say though as a whole, kids today are wired differently than they were years ago.  What they expect now is not what I expected 15 years ago.  This is an example of how our political system operates.  A battle of old and a battle of new, not between parties only but also within the parties.  Some change is good but change just for the sake of change proves nothing.  Also, doing the same thing over and over with the same results that are deficient proves nothing as well.

submarinesailor

Twenty odd years ago I worked for a division within Halliburton that performed Predictive Maintenance for the power and food industry.  So I attended a lot of training seminars and conferences to develop and improve my skills in vibration analysis, infrared thermography and oil analysis.  One of the things that kept coming out was that it was (back then) 326% more expensive to run to failure then to do preventive and predictive maintenance.  This number varied a little between industry, but for the most part it was a good number from M&M Mars to Duke power to dog food companies to small and large steel plants.  I remember the number will because I can't tell you how may times we heard that it was too expensive to do any type of maintenance.  The number of Superintends and General Foreman who believed that maintenance of any type was too expensive was astonishing.  Amtrak was one of the non-believers until I proved to them how valuable an infrared camera could be.  I told them that I could look at the exhaust manifold and tell them which cylinder had a fowled injector by the temperature.  The exhaust from a fowled cylinder runs about 50 degrees hotter and you can pick it up with an infrared camera/senor.  The good news, I was right on.  And they still didn't buy a camera or service from us.

As for beating stuff to death, I have never seen anything like what was done to equipment in some of the steel plants.  Man did they know how to break stuff.  Sometimes on purpose so they could get the day off.

I also remember reading somewhere that the number was close, 323%, for the construction industry.  Build it right or it cost 323% more to go in and fix it right.

Bruce

scully

Wow great response here ! First of I think this is a family owned mill . My personal experiance with WM mills is that given resonable care and matinance they last and cut for ever ! I don't think there is any part of most LT 40's that can't be replaced or repaired . And even in full on resto cases the end result is a mill that cuts like the day it was new ! This mill too can be brought back into original condition at what I am sure will be great expense . But why ? The things I saw on this machine defy explanation ! It is obvious that there is no pride of ownership let alone concern for the quality of product being produced ! Yes the allignment was non-exsistant . I do not understand how someone can make an investment like that and in short order have a machine that is heavily damaged not performing as desighned ,and force it to work anyway. It's like not being able to see the forest because there are to many trees in the way !
I bleed orange  .

backwoods sawyer

"But why?"
There is the question.
Sounds about like the condition my mill was in when i picked it up in PA. had to load it on a trailer to get it back across the country, hitch was mangled no wheels, carriage would not move without tripping over load, cut wires dangling, radiator on the ground crumpled, all guards missing, a dozen welds looked they were done from about three feet away just kind of globed on. Why? He replaced sawmills every few years refused to pay woodmizer prices for parts and just cobbled it together until it would not run any more.
I spent considerable money the first year getting it back to woodmizer specs, and each year since maintenance cost have gone down, and the condition of the mill improved
Keeping a piece of machinery in good working order was ingrained in me years ago, spent a dozen years using and maintaining older military equipment in top condition.

The production mill I worked in was the first fully computerized mill in the world, built in 78, the owner kept a staff of top electrical and mechanical engineers some with prior NASA experience along with a full machine shop to support the barker, block saw, sawmill, kilns, planer and veneer plant operations. The mindset was to develop up grades in house that made fast, accurate, and efficient operations, and maintain what was there in top condition and always develop ways of improving on the operation.

New owner bought the whole operation fired all the engineers and over half the mill wrights along with the "oiler" and out sourced all upgrades to the plant with "Off the shelf" "through away" replacement equipment that gets changed out every few years.

Interesting thing about it was both families had been running big production mills in the county since 1951 (lot of mills in the county got their start between 1950 and 1952) but both took different paths over the years.
Backwoods Custom Milling Inc.
100% portable. . Oregons largest portable sawmill service, serving all of Oregon, from our Backwoods to yours..sawing since 1991

pine

Quote from: Magicman on February 08, 2014, 09:30:29 AM
We have not necessarily "upgraded" our moral standards.  We have gradually "learned" to accept and tolerate lower moral standards.  Yes, we have a few that have and uphold high work ethics as well as moral ethics, but I see too many that have very little of either.

Well said!!!

In addition the disdain that is held by many for those that still have moral standards is significant. 
There is a lack of understanding that if you are going to work for a company, they pay your salary/work hours then you comply with the company rules and regulations.  As long as those rules and regulations do not put you personally at risk or professionally at risk you comply because they pay your paycheck.  Else go find another place to work.

thecfarm

I use to work in a factory. Lots of safety
stuff,OSHA,LOTO,checklists,paperwork. But as I use to tell my fellow workers that complained and did not do it,The company PAYS you to do it.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Ianab

Thing about running equipment "until it die" is that AS it's dying, it's probably not working very well.  For a simple example, if you don't maintain your Chainsaw, it doesn't work very well. It cuts slower, and if you don't keep it in tune, it blows up totally.

Same with a sawmill. You keep it tuned, lubricated and repaired, and it works properly. Neglect it, and it just gets frustrating.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Peter Drouin

Quote from: Ianab on February 08, 2014, 04:51:53 PM
Thing about running equipment "until it die" is that AS it's dying, it's probably not working very well.  For a simple example, if you don't maintain your Chainsaw, it doesn't work very well. It cuts slower, and if you don't keep it in tune, it blows up totally.

Same with a sawmill. You keep it tuned, lubricated and repaired, and it works properly. Neglect it, and it just gets frustrating.

Ian




smiley_thumbsup
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

sawguy21

I love good machinery and hate to see a piece driven into the ground due to neglect and/or abuse. I used to manage a vehicle fleet, I cringed at the way some of these guys treated the trucks. I told them that outside the helicopter your pick up is the most expensive piece of equipment you have to deal with. Look after it and it will serve you faithfully. Some never got it, if it breaks YOU (meaning me) deal with it and get us another one. They seemed to think the bank account was bottomless. Senior management didn't take it seriously either, hiball production was the name of the game. Not surprisingly, the company went under.
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

Verticaltrx

I'm 29yrs old, so I guess I fit in the millennial generation. I have to say for the most part I'm embarrassed to be associated with this group. I just can't believe how little most people care about anything except their smartphones, facebook, and other crap like that. I am a contractor, farmer, and homesteader with my wife. I have a lot of pride of ownership in everything I own because I worked hard to get it (paying cash nonetheless) and know that it won't serve me well if I don't take care of it.

I am looking at expanding my farming operations more and cutting back on the construction side of things because finding good help is nearly impossible. At this point if I want to grow the construction business I need more help. My brother helps me from time to time now, but finding a good full-time employee is something I just don't want to be faced with. I market my construction as being 'premium quality craftsmanship' and there are very few people out there that care enough to do this kind of work.

As to the original topic of this thread, I see things like that all the time, both on the farming and construction side of things. People just don't care about anything anymore, just throw it away and go into debt to get a new one. Some of my equipment may be old, some of it is brand new, but all of it is washed, serviced and repaired with OEM parts on a regular basis. I buy things that suit me well and plan to keep them as long as I can get parts for them.
Wood-Mizer LT15G19

Billbob

Quote from: Magicman on February 08, 2014, 09:30:29 AM
We have not necessarily "upgraded" our moral standards.  We have gradually "learned" to accept and tolerate lower moral standards.

Exactly!  Once we start accepting the lowering of standards it is pretty hard to stop the downhill slide.
Woodland Hm126 sawmill, LS 72hp tractor with FEL, homemade log winch, 8ft pulp trailer, Husqvarna 50, Husqvarna 353, homemade wood splitter, 12ft dump trailer, Polaris Sportsman 500 with ATV dump trailer

Tom King

I'm still using tools I bought in 1973 along with all the others I've bought since then, and been driving the same truck for 13 years.  I think my newest chainsaw was bought in 1999, but it has had a few cylinders and other parts put on since then.  I like to make one payment, and see how long I can get it to last.

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