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Hand cutting with forwarder how many of you do it?

Started by logman81, January 27, 2014, 03:57:59 PM

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logman81

How many of you hand cut using a forwarder? How does it compare to cable skidder. What type of wood do you cut? Hard wood, soft wood , firewood. What are the advantages and disadvantages?
Precision Firewood & Logging

brendonv

We have a tree farmer c5f forwarder and a jd grapple skidder.  I always run the skidder instead, much faster for us.  The forwarder you can only cut to a certain length to not tip off the back of the bunks.  Skidder i can pull 4-8 full length trees.  We are cutting and skidding hardwood firewood, no sawlogs at all.  Forwarder is nice in the end, to pick up all the tiny stuff, but really not worth it for us.  I brought it to the new landing today, its been sitting since last year, though we do only cut in the winter. 
"Trees live a secret life only revealed to those that climb them"

www.VorioTree.com

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Vorio-Tree-Experts-LLC/598083593556636

thecfarm

I see you are looking for a forwarder. This is from the guy that logs for me. He had a forwarder,4 cyl,worked ok on kinda level ground,not enough power to load it full on hills. He sold it and brought a 6 cyl. I had some pine here and he had to use a skidder to get them to level ground. Someone on here can start quoting hp better than I can. This is what he told me and I heard it more than once from him.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

danabg

If your doing a lot of sorting a porter is much easier,you can separate the wood while you cut it then pick it up.If you have muddy conditions and have to buck wood at a landing after you have skidded it out its a real pain,much easier to do it in the woods and haul it out with the porter.If you can sell wood longlength a skidder would be better,but can't sell it that way around here anymore it's mostly cut to length.I've used both but If Ihad to choose I'd definitely go with a forwarder.

logman81

Thanks guys seems their is mixed opinions . I do know of one guy around here that uses a iron mule and hand cuts. I've seen a few of his jobs and they come out very good. I like how the wood can be kept clean and sorted out nice. Also have the benefit of loading truck and trailers. I think less of a landing is needed with the and no skid trails.
Precision Firewood & Logging

brendonv

Ya the forwarder we have is gutless.  4cyl cummins.  Hills are a drag, not enough gooooo
"Trees live a secret life only revealed to those that climb them"

www.VorioTree.com

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Vorio-Tree-Experts-LLC/598083593556636

thecfarm

I forgot to say too,on one job they could not load the forwarder full,they had to take ½-¾ loads. That is time and time is money. A forwarder does have it good points. I was quite impressed by the trails. You can have a smaller landing, can sort easier.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

logman81

Precision Firewood & Logging

thecfarm

And another idea. They cut one of my pines on a side hill. I saw where the tree was fell,but no forwarder trail beside it.They kept the forwarder in the trail,grabbed on to the tree and brought it out to the trailer and kept bucking the tree into logs. Probably slow,but that was the only one they did it too.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

BargeMonkey

 I have an older 230 4 wheeler long bunk, its handy sometimes and sometimes you just cant get it in places. If you can get decent enough roads and can bunch to the forwarder its a nicer way to go. You will put less wood out with a forwarder, but it cuts a few more machines out of the equation. If your going to buy one, get a 6-8 wheeler. The small 4 wheel machines are ok but tend to be very tippy. Personally I think a forwarder does a nicer job than a skidder but its all job dependent. I get about 4 cord / 2200 feet depending on species and size, to give you an idea, and with a serco 4000 loader she will pick anything I want within reason.

craigc

I run a 6 wheel Rottne SMV with a Hultdins grapple saw.  We cut hardwoods.  I would not trade it for any skidder.  When I come out of the woods in 2 trips I have over a semi load.  I think it does a much better job than skidding plus you don't need much of a landing.  The combination of the forwarder and grapple saw combo makes for a versatile machine.
Rottne SMV, Timbco with Logmax 9000, JD 540B Grapple.

logman81

Hey guys lots of good info! The one I'm thinking about is a four wheel long bunk with a barko 40 loader.
Precision Firewood & Logging

thecfarm

Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

keen

I have a cable skidder and a forwarder. If I am producing mill bought timber I am usually required to tree length the trees and mark them out on the landing and then buck them. On my own jobs I like running forwarder. For me I think a guy can get better production. We mainly cut hard wood that averages 250 bf+ of logs and cut the tops for firewood or pulp. It sure is nice bucking the logs where the tree sits instead of dragging it through the dirt then trying to buck it. A guy can go out and get the trees down and bucked for the day and relax a bit while running forwarder. With a cable skidder you don't ever get much of a break. If you have fairly flat ground I think a forwarder is the way to go. If your going to do much pulp you will want to go with a bypass bucket eventually. That's going to be my next purchase.

logman81

Thanks keen. So if you had a choice of a forwarder or cable skidder what would you all chose? My jobs are all my own, very from type of wood. Most are timber stand improvements by selective cutting. I cut both saw logs and firewood and I hand cut it.
Precision Firewood & Logging

beenthere

For what you are doing, I'd think going with the rig member Bill_M has would be about as good and trouble free as you can get for your money.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

logman81

No I'd rather have a true forwarder plus those combos are big bucks. The forwarder I'm talking about is less then half the cost. I like the timberjack but I'm tire of fighting with chokers and constantly sharpening chains.
Precision Firewood & Logging

mad murdock

we cut and bunched for our forwarder for years, then bought a JD450C outfitted with a Morbark shear, and upped production considerably.  Since you got the Jack, I would cinsider keeping it, if it were me, and adding a forwarder.  working with just a forwarder will limit the jobs you can effectively do, IMO.  You are doing firewood from what I recall LM81, a bucket saw might work well for chunking firewood into a truck for deliveries.  FWIW.
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

logman81

I'm still battling issues with the TJ still, mostly the engine still smoking, I've worked it as I was told to and the problem hasn't gone away. I cut both firewood and high grade saw logs both hard and soft.
Precision Firewood & Logging

JakeG

Which engine, what color smoke and when does it smoke?
$5.00 fine for whinin'

logman81

 353 DT bluish gray smoke does it all the time.
Precision Firewood & Logging

logman81

Precision Firewood & Logging

mad murdock

An older (4 wheel) forwarder is ok for short wood, pulp, bolts and veneer, but not so good with random length saw logs, bunk not long enough, plus it is easy to overload the axle over the bunk when moving random lenght logs, so if not approached within the confinces of the machines capacity, you will be replacing rear planetaries, axles, sun gears, and rear end parts.  We learned the hard way on that, even with a larger machine, (Franklin 132 Pack-a-back), which was a 3 cord machine, you can still overdo it easy hauling longer logs.  If you are after increasing production, a newer forwarder (6-8 wheels), or a grapple skidder are what you will want to look at, IMO.  Problem with a newer multi-axles forwarder is $$$ to get into one, a grapple skidder will be less money, and if you need a loader to sort, you could look at a loader trailer, or something along those lines.
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

JakeG

Quote from: logman81 on January 28, 2014, 02:33:18 PM
353 DT bluish gray smoke does it all the time.

You said you've done some work to it, what all has been done? I don't have experience with the 353 but several members here do!
$5.00 fine for whinin'

beenthere

Quote from: logman81 on January 28, 2014, 02:39:04 PM
Tried to up load vid but wouldn't let me.

Did you upload the video onto YouTube first?

Then just copy the url of the link to it on YouTube into your post.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

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