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Best Oil

Started by woodchipper95, January 09, 2014, 10:13:09 AM

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mmartone

I have been using this Lucas semi synth oil, seems clean, little to no smoke, nothing broke yet.

https://www.lucasoil.com/products/display_products.sd?iid=290&catid=17&loc=show
Remember, I only know what you guys teach me. Lt40 Manual 22hp KAwaSaki, Husky3120 60", 56" Panther CSM, 372xp, 345xp, Stihl 041, 031, blue homelite, poulans, 340

martyinmi

Quote from: woodchipper95 on January 09, 2014, 03:58:41 PM
Thanks guys I will use Stihl HP Ultra, I have some from when I bought my weed-eater (free oil).  I really do not know why people feel the need to put others down on these sites... Wait let me guess you came out the womb running saws smiley, sorry guys I am only 18 and do not know everything about saws.

I like to learn and know what's best.  :P
Many apologies young lad! And welcome to the Forestry Forum!
I should have looked at your post count and profile before I said anything.
Folks on this site do an awful lot of good natured "picking" back and forth once they get to know one-another.

A lot of the guys who frequent this site have forgotten much more than two of me will ever know pertaining to saws, oils, gas, octanes, ethanol, methanol, porting, polishing, muffler modding, chain sharpening, chain selection, bar composites, chainsaw competitions,maintenance, etc.

And.....just so you know, McCulloch and Homelite are the two best saws ever built. :)

Pull up a chair and read and contribute when you can. 8)

No God, No Peace
Know God, Know Peace!

martyinmi

Quote from: WmFritz on January 09, 2014, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: martyinmi on January 09, 2014, 04:45:01 PM


Where's good 'ol unkie Al? wheeliechair


Marty, you are relentless.  smiley_devilish
Isn't it biblical to "do unto as you'd be done to"? ;D :D
No God, No Peace
Know God, Know Peace!

ahlkey

I converted  three years ago to nothing but synthetic oil.  My newer saws actually says synthetic oil is required!  Appears to have some advantages in cold weather starting, smokeless, etc...  I use Saber Professional by Amsoil and mix it at 80:1

WmFritz

Quote from: martyinmi on January 09, 2014, 09:17:30 PM
Isn't it biblical to "do unto as you'd be done to"? ;D :D

:D :D :D
   Yea... and He who pokes at the Sleeping Bear with his long stick,
better be wearing his track shoes!  ( an old saying)
~Bill

2012 Homebuilt Bandmill
1959 Detroit built Ferguson TO35

sawguy21

Quote from: ahlkey on January 09, 2014, 09:31:18 PM
I converted  three years ago to nothing but synthetic oil.  My newer saws actually says synthetic oil is required!  Appears to have some advantages in cold weather starting, smokeless, etc...  I use Saber Professional by Amsoil and mix it at 80:1
80:1 ??? You trying to get Al and a few others going? :D
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

mad murdock

Woodchipper you done good, and welcome to the Forestry Forum. I posted the popcorn smileys, because I was looking forward to settling in and watching the fray. You asked an honest question, and you looked up a good thread on here and formulated an edumicated answer to your question. I personally have been running powersaws, logging equipment and other heavy equipment, along with being a seasoned mechanic of sorts, do not subscribe to this brand over that type of argument. I look for quality and value. There are a lot of good oils out there, you do get what you pay for to some extent, I don't buy the bargain basement priced cheap stuff, but whatever 2 stroke oil I run, I mix 32:1 and have never had an issue over literally thousands of hours of operation with many saws giving literally years of service and I still have a healthy stable of older saws( well no 2 man bone shakers, or anything like that), mostly 10 series macs(my favs).  Good luck and keep reading. You will get a lot of good info from guys on here.
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

Andyshine77

Quote from: sawguy21 on January 09, 2014, 11:10:47 PM
Quote from: ahlkey on January 09, 2014, 09:31:18 PM
I converted  three years ago to nothing but synthetic oil.  My newer saws actually says synthetic oil is required!  Appears to have some advantages in cold weather starting, smokeless, etc...  I use Saber Professional by Amsoil and mix it at 80:1
80:1 ??? You trying to get Al and a few others going? :D

Others like who? ;D :D

I keep telling myself to stop posting in oil threads, but I simply can't resist. 8)

If I had the bank, I'd love to do an end all 2T oil comparison/test. I've thought about it long and hard, the logistics involved are a nightmare. From setting up a test cell, to simply the time involved. They're a few who have done some testing, but it was limited, and definitely not even close to being scientific IMHO.

OEM oils are fine and will cause no harm to any engine when used properly. HP Ultra is the best OEM oil out there, however ester based MX oils are available, and often at a lower cost than OEM oils. You can buy a 1/2 gallon of Maxima k2 for $35.00 and a gallon of Motul 800 for $64. I think a gallon of Ultra is right at $100

:new_year:     
Andre.

bandmiller2

I'am old and struggle to keep up with this world and its many changes. Almost any 2cyc. oil will give good service if mixed proper. But we have available synthetics that are an improvement and the prudent wood slasher should take advantage of them for the little extra cost. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

bandmiller2

Marty,I think we snuck daylight past the rooster, probably Al is out moving snow. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

7sleeper

@woodchipper95

I believe that we have to clarify myths and try to be more objective by adding neutral testing criteria to this debate! I am going to quote myself from another thread simply because I don't like rewriting everything.

"As I've said here to many times I don't care what name is one the bottle as long as it is

1. fullsynthetic for air cooled engines
2. fullfills the folowing norms API TC, JASO FC/FD, ISO L-EGD


Then it's ok for me. The above norms dictate

Specification by ISO-L-Norm = GLOBAL Norm(European norm)
Class => engine Performance
ISO-L-EGB (Global GB) => middle(= JASO FB)
ISO-L-EGC (Global GC) => middle and smokeless (= JASO FC)
ISO-L-EGD (Global GD) => high performance and smokeless (> JASO FD)

Specification by API-Norm (US norm)
Class => engine Performance
API-TA (TSC-1) => Mopeds
API-TB (TSC-2) => Motorscooters and Motorcycles
API-TC (TSC-3) => high performance engines
API-TD (TSC-4) => Outboardengines equivalent to NMMA TC-WII

Specification by JASO-Norm (Japanese norm)
Class => engine Performance
JASO (M345) FA => low
JASO (M345) FB => middle
JASO (M345) FC => middle and smokeless
JASO (M345) FD => high performance and smokeless

Translated by me from the german wikipedia page. http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schmieröl

Stihl HP Ultra does NOT fullfill the top norms!

7 "


So going by these industry independent norms

Stihl HP Ultra fullfills only JASO-FB, ISO-L-EGB
http://www.stihl.de/STIHL-Produkte/Zubeh%C3%B6r-und-Betriebsstoffe/Kraft-und-Schmierstoffe/Kraftstoffe-Motoren%C3%B6le-und-Kettenhaft%C3%B6le/21356-1740/Zweitaktmotoren%C3%B6l-HP-Ultra.aspx

Stihl HP Super fullfills JASO-FD, ISO-L-EGD
http://www.stihl.de/STIHL-Produkte/Zubeh%C3%B6r-und-Betriebsstoffe/Kraft-und-Schmierstoffe/Kraftstoffe-Motoren%C3%B6le-und-Kettenhaft%C3%B6le/21142-1740/Zweitaktmotoren%C3%B6l-HP-Super.aspx

So personaly I wouldn't buy HP Ultra, because it simply isn't on top!

No doubt it surely is a good oil, but it surely is not and never will be the one and only marketing and so many believers here on this site and others try to tell you!

So if you go shopping for oil just look on the back of the bottle and there should stand

1. fullsynthetic for air cooled engines
2. the folowing norms API TC, JASO FC/FD, ISO L-EGD


then you are buying a top of the line 2 stroke oil of neutral testing conditions!!!

There are many generic brands out there that fullfill the above and cost much less than the hype stuff!

Good luck!

7

thecfarm

In all seriousness I was concerned about Al. He has not responded to this post. But he was on this morning.  ;D That makes me feel better.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

JohnG28

Quote from: thecfarm on January 10, 2014, 09:00:05 AM
In all seriousness I was concerned about Al. He has not responded to this post. But he was on this morning.  ;D That makes me feel better.

It takes restraint to stay away! :D I won't contribute to the battle though... :-X
Stihl MS361, 460 & 200T, Jonsered 490, Jonsereds 90, Husky 350 & 142, Homelite XL and Super XL

Kevin W

I agree with "7sleeper", The specifications on the bottle are what really count. I work in a chainsaw shop and we have definitely seen engine failures when using cheap hardware store oil! The old slower running saws can take cheap oil ok, but the newer high revving saws are a lot more picky about what oil you can use. What we usually tell people is to use a major equipment manufactures oil such as Husqvarna, Stihl, Jonsered Echo ect. They are standing behind their equipment so you can count on it that they aren't selling junk oil. Have any of you used Echo or Shindiwa's Red Armor oil?

k9klf

I'm glad so many points of view are available for engine oils. I will certainly be buying better oil for all of my husqvarnas. As for the 97, or sometimes called "recreational" gasoline, we learned it is the only option for small engines because all lower octane gasolines contain ethanol. Ethanol gums up carbs and fosters corrosion in metal tanks eventually plugging up filters or ports. My saws ran just fine on ethanol gas, but the problems arose when saws sat for a week or more with that fuel in the tanks. They did not want to start and ran rough for much longer than with the 97. I took that a step further and switched to 97 in my cars and even with the higher per gallon cost, get better milage  results with 97 than any of the blended fuels. Anyone else try this in their cars?
I'm a second-hand vegetarianism;  critters eat vegetables, I eat critters.

AdkStihl

Above all standards  ;)



 
J.Miller Photography

beenthere

Quote. Anyone else try this in their cars?

I run it in the car all the time (as well as the other gas users).
As you say, get 10% better fuel mileage and the additional cost per gallon over the 10% ethanol mix is only 6%. 
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

7sleeper

Quote from: AdkStihl on January 10, 2014, 11:17:49 AM
Above all standards  ;)



 
Motul 800 is only a API TC fullsynthetic oil, so it fits into my description and seems to be ok. ;)

7

martyinmi

Quote from: JohnG28 on January 10, 2014, 10:11:34 AM
Quote from: thecfarm on January 10, 2014, 09:00:05 AM
In all seriousness I was concerned about Al. He has not responded to this post. But he was on this morning.  ;D That makes me feel better.

It takes restraint to stay away! :D I won't contribute to the battle though... :-X
I'll stay out of the battle too, but I'm just wondering:

"Oh where, Oh where has my uncle Al gone, Oh where, Oh where can he be"?  :D :D :D
No God, No Peace
Know God, Know Peace!

woodchipper95

Quote from: 7sleeper on January 10, 2014, 08:23:22 AM
@woodchipper95

I believe that we have to clarify myths and try to be more objective by adding neutral testing criteria to this debate! I am going to quote myself from another thread simply because I don't like rewriting everything.

"As I've said here to many times I don't care what name is one the bottle as long as it is

1. fullsynthetic for air cooled engines
2. fullfills the folowing norms API TC, JASO FC/FD, ISO L-EGD


Then it's ok for me. The above norms dictate

Specification by ISO-L-Norm = GLOBAL Norm(European norm)
Class => engine Performance
ISO-L-EGB (Global GB) => middle(= JASO FB)
ISO-L-EGC (Global GC) => middle and smokeless (= JASO FC)
ISO-L-EGD (Global GD) => high performance and smokeless (> JASO FD)

Specification by API-Norm (US norm)
Class => engine Performance
API-TA (TSC-1) => Mopeds
API-TB (TSC-2) => Motorscooters and Motorcycles
API-TC (TSC-3) => high performance engines
API-TD (TSC-4) => Outboardengines equivalent to NMMA TC-WII

Specification by JASO-Norm (Japanese norm)
Class => engine Performance
JASO (M345) FA => low
JASO (M345) FB => middle
JASO (M345) FC => middle and smokeless
JASO (M345) FD => high performance and smokeless

Translated by me from the german wikipedia page. http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schmieröl

Stihl HP Ultra does NOT fullfill the top norms!

7 "


So going by these industry independent norms

Stihl HP Ultra fullfills only JASO-FB, ISO-L-EGB
http://www.stihl.de/STIHL-Produkte/Zubeh%C3%B6r-und-Betriebsstoffe/Kraft-und-Schmierstoffe/Kraftstoffe-Motoren%C3%B6le-und-Kettenhaft%C3%B6le/21356-1740/Zweitaktmotoren%C3%B6l-HP-Ultra.aspx

Stihl HP Super fullfills JASO-FD, ISO-L-EGD
http://www.stihl.de/STIHL-Produkte/Zubeh%C3%B6r-und-Betriebsstoffe/Kraft-und-Schmierstoffe/Kraftstoffe-Motoren%C3%B6le-und-Kettenhaft%C3%B6le/21142-1740/Zweitaktmotoren%C3%B6l-HP-Super.aspx

So personaly I wouldn't buy HP Ultra, because it simply isn't on top!

No doubt it surely is a good oil, but it surely is not and never will be the one and only marketing and so many believers here on this site and others try to tell you!

So if you go shopping for oil just look on the back of the bottle and there should stand

1. fullsynthetic for air cooled engines
2. the folowing norms API TC, JASO FC/FD, ISO L-EGD


then you are buying a top of the line 2 stroke oil of neutral testing conditions!!!

There are many generic brands out there that fullfill the above and cost much less than the hype stuff!

Good luck!

7

So which oil has all these?

7sleeper

Exactly that is the right attitude. The name for me is unimportant. Since I donot live in your area I cannot recomend what to buy. I get a generic brand from a motorcycle accessory chain that fullfills my criteria and costs less than half of Stihl oil. I saw that "Castrol 12899 Power RS TTS 2-Stroke Motor Oil" fullfills all norms. Might want to look for that or something similar.
As I said before you will just have to check what is written on the bottle.

7

Andyshine77

Keep in mind the standards have limited criteria, UP ultra burns much cleaner than HP super, however do to it's higher flash point is produces a little more smoke. Ester oils with high flash points normally do. HP super burns dirty compared to more modern formulas, this is fact, not just an opinion. In fact Stihl had really bad carbon issues in their 4-mix engines with HP Super. Many of the best racing oil don't even have any certification, do to the high price of the testing. I've been in many high hour engines and older oils like HP super lubricate just fine, but run dirty in the long run, in 4-mix engines it became an issue much faster.
Andre.

John R

Quote from: Furu on January 09, 2014, 12:00:14 PM
IMO:
the use of Stihl HP Ultra can not be beat by any product and is worth the very slightly higher price that is paid for it. It comes in white or silver containers.  They changed colors  a couple of years back. 

I will not even put the other two lower grades: Stihl High performance -orange container, and Stihl HP Super - Black container, in my equipment as they are not as good.  Do not get me started on the so called cheap stuff. 
If you are going to purchase good quality equipment treat it well and it will last a long time.  Do not put junk in it.


+1


Didn't know Stihl made an oil in a black bottle.
John


Sthil MS 361 20" Bar
Sthil MS 260 PRO 16" Bar
Oregon 511 AX Chain Grinder

Andyshine77

BTW Castrol TTS is the oil HP Ultra is based on if anyone was wondering.
Andre.

shelbycharger400

Adkstihl,  this stuff is     meets ISo edg and Jaso fc,   low ash 2 cycle lube,   it's by master pro

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