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Semi automatic circle mill

Started by StoddardLumber, October 22, 2013, 08:42:47 PM

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StoddardLumber

Hi I have a semi automatic circular sawmill the all steel carriage is a set beam style with 3 dogs the top and bottom dogs are air powered with a hyd taper that extends or retracts the entire dog.

The carriage has a hyd receader that disengages the lane style ratchet and allowes both advancing and recreeding of the carriage

The dogs are set up so that all 3 bottom dogs and be lifted if the dogs are in the open position to act as a kicker.

Has anyone ever had any experience with a semi automatic circle mill? I will get some photos tommarow I am looking to try. And identify the maker of the dogs

My dad built the carriage back in the early 80's. At that time I think chase machine works was still in buisness and that he built it to there specs. Not sure if they are early chase automatic dogs or not. Does anyone have any photos of any chase automatic sawmills?



bandmiller2

SL sorry I don't have a definite answer to your question,I have a Chase carriage but its from back in the 40's.I'am quite sure they got into some automotion before they quit building.One of the brothers stayed in Orange and sold industrial supplies in the old building.Bruce Dexter moved to Lyndonville VT. and was a sawsmith for years and is now retired.Hopefully someone here knows more than I.You sound like your local.?? Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

StoddardLumber

Here are some photos of the carriage and dogs







StoddardLumber


bandmiller2

SL, it looks like your dad probably made them himself, probably modeled after some he'd seen. Are you having a problem with them.?? They look robust and easy to repair if need be. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

StoddardLumber

I know he did not build them he got them as a set from somewhere I was only 4 or 5 at the time I remember him building t.he carriage and putting the dogs on.

Does anyone have contact info for Bruce dexter? His old sawmill and tool number is disconnected.


bandmiller2

Chris Duval bought sawmill tool and service co from Bruce.He's in western Ma. just west of northhampton @ 1-413-268-6515 you could try him. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Ron Wenrich

Why do you need hydraulic and air?  Seems to me that if you put hydraulic cylinders on where the air cylinders are, you would be able to get rid of the air system completely.  Then. you could convert you setworks over to automatic, and the entire mill is automatic. 

My idea of semi-auto mills is that the setworks are still manual while the dogs are either air or hydraulic.  Most times they were air and I saw a few on Frick mills back in the '70s.

What is it that you're trying to do? 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

StoddardLumber

I am trying to identify the maker go the dogs my goal is to search for a 4th dog the dogs work great but I would like the extra on on the tail for long stuff.

I believe the reason for the mix of air and hyd on these dogs is for speeding in clamping and control in the tapers. All the fully hydro dogs I have seen are slow to clamp and unclamp and all the air tapers I have seen are either in or out not much control with the air dogs and hyd tapers it seamless to be the best of both worlds for my setup.

My goal is to eventually put automatic set works on it not sure what I will go with or how the system will measure ( tempo static rod, shaft encoder, ect...)  before I get to that point I will need to upgrade my glover friction feed to something more robust and I should probably be on the look out for a 125 hp electric to replace my current 75 hp unit

Ron Wenrich

I've run both hydraulic and air.  I much prefer the hydraulic.  The dogs may seem slower, but it doesn't really have an affect on the performance or production.  I hate air tapers.  I can get more pressure with the hydraulic dogs, which means it won't kick out from the dogs while sawing or trying to turn the log.

Friction feed can be done away with if you go over to a hydraulic motor for your feed.  I had one put on a handmill, so you should be able to do that fairly easily.  To get a really hot hydraulic feed, you need to go with something like a Berry feed or a bigger hydraulic motor.  We were running a 75 hp motor just on our hydraulics and pumping 125 gpm on 2 pumps, which is probably overkill for your operation.  A lot depends on your production needs. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

roberto23

I like your way of sharing information on this topic. i was looking for the information on same topic.

StoddardLumber

My log deck between the debarker and the carriage will hold around 1000 feet of logs if I can saw 3000 to 4000 a day I am happy. I am just a 1 man show.

My plan is as each piece wears out I try and upgrade it

bandmiller2

SL who hammers your saws, do you have someone local.?? Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

StoddardLumber

I wish they were local

I have had Chris Johnstone from Plymouth NH hammer 1 board saw. He did it right after I switched from my diesel power unit to the electric motor and gen set. At that time I was running the arbor at 800 -820 rpm I thought it was to fast and he did too tried his best to hammer the saw for it but it would not stand up in the cut. So I swapped pulleys and got the speed of the arbor at 670 (much more realistic) I put on an older saw and a new set of teeth and have gotten by foe about 3000 feet. I am going to bring my saws to minors saw shop in VT. I talked with Ed the owner and he seamed super knowlagable. The only problem is that he is 3 hours away 1 way.

Do you have any local saw smiths? Where are you located? I know CRD metal works is hammering them in mass they took over for Bruce Dexter.


bandmiller2

Bruce hammered two saws for me before he retired haven't needed it since, which is why I asked you. Theirs not a smith around every bend in the road now, and shipping is a hassle. Bruce told me he could teach me in a couple of weeks, and then it would just be practice but I wouldn't do enough saws to get good at it and I'am too old for a lot of new tricks. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Ron Wenrich

We had a member take a course in saw hammering.  https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,23546.0.html

I went to those links and 2 of those schools apparently are either closed or don't keep up their websites.  The only one left is Casey Creamer up at Seneca Saw.  He says he'll teach you, if you want to learn.  It could be a nice sideline.  Most of the guys are rolling their saws on a stretch roller which pretty well eliminates hammering.  Problem saws would need more attention.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

bandmiller2

A little story, I used to have contacts in Simonds  Fitchburg ma. In their corperate wisdom they let the two old hammer smiths retire without training replacements. Panic insued they talked them into coming back half days if they sent the co. van to pick them up each day. Probibly today they use computerized stretch rolls to tension new saws. I had a big old horizontal milling machine and thought about converting it to a stretch roller but then again I would not do enough to warrant it. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

StoddardLumber

When I was just a little kid my dad would take the saws to Greenville NH to a man named Emile Derossias ( I am sure I butchered the spelling ) he use to hammer saws at Simonides and did it on the side when he retired. He was in his late 60's when I was 4 or 5 years old. And he passed 20 years ago. 

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