Portable garage, or small pole barn style building? It's Gramps Birthday.

[Piston]

I am going to throw my comment in. Gramps is 95, I would think one of these would out last him.

You'd be surprised.   ;D  I don't see the portable garage outlasting him.  He still mows his 1.5 acres of lawn, shovels his walk way, climbs ladders to shovel the snow off his roof, and is planning on scraping and painting his entire house in the spring.  Although he works slow, he hasn't slowed down.   :D

I should mention something, my grandfather isn't really 95.  He's actually 65.  When he reached his 80th birthday, he decided that instead of getting a year older every year, he is going to go the other way, and get a year younger  ;D  So ever since he turned 80, we've been counting backwards.  In fact, now that I think about it, I believe it's time for him to come out of retirement and get back to work.   :D  He says once he turns 100, he'll be able to get his face printed on a Smuckers jar  ;D  Apparently they do that.   

Really though, the main reason I'm hesitant to go with the portable garage, is because one bad storm will take it down.  He's gone through 2 of them in the last 5 years or so, the last one only lasted 2 winters, and really not even that long, since it collapsed during the second winter. 

What is your snow load up there?  I wouldn't be surprised if it's less than we have down here. 

Even if the shelter would outlast him, it doesn't mean I only want it to last that long.  I am hoping that his house and land stay in the family for my grandkids to enjoy, and I can only dream of being the "mountain man" as he is referred to, and sitting there on the porch drinking a warm glass of scotch while my grandson builds me a dang car port.   :D :D

[sap retreiver]

I'll agree with watching my grandsons do some building! On the topic of post in the ground, I say no concrete, even as a cap. Thats the first place it'll rot. The newer pt will take it pretty good but if your gonna waste time you mine as well waste it the right way.The oak will last 20 maybe 30 if treated right, pt longer. Not a fan of straight stone either some good crushed gravel that drains would be ideal (just remember it needs to drain out of the hole you dug also), it would also be good for your base for the driveway then you could leave it as is or put stone over it to look pretty and get thrown on the lawn with the snow. The fabric or plastic just stops weeds for the first couple years. Once you have a roof over it and pitch it no more puddles and gramp is happy happy happy!
oh ya, my vote is for the American made pole barn. Good luck!

[thecfarm]

I would use the ground fabric. It's not really used to keep the weeds down. The real reason is to keep it from mixing and sinking into what is already there. Than you have mud again.My Father and me did the woods road with gravel.We did not know about that stuff. The gravel is just about gone into the ground.My 500 foot driveway was done with ground fabric. It's still there,even after 2 times of logging trucks.The woods road,not so good.

[Stephen1]

Well if he is only 65  8) then by all means build the  good shelter.

[beenthere]

Piston
Took a pic of the laminated post cut-offs that I used (concrete pad at the bottom of the hole and tamped gravel around the posts). Also a pic of the top of the posts showing the two 2x10 rims bolted onto the posts (outside lams cut off for a step rest easily done after the posts were set and could get the height of the rims). The tops of these lam posts are not glued so easily sawn and prepped).

The lam cutoff




And the rim connection with trusses on them
(boxed in so birds couldn't nest on the rims)

[rmack]

as far as the posts go, I saw a new product in home depot last week, it's an epoxy polymer foam that is supposed to be able to take the place of concrete. you mix it and pour it in a sono tube around/under the post like you would concrete. it does dry very hard.

it was very pricey but I believe it claims to get around the moisture issues related to concrete.

[beenthere]

But it seems it wouldn't get around the negative trapping of moisture around the post, which is the biggest problem with encasing them in concrete.. as I've grown to understand.

[Piston]

I received 2 quotes for the materials needed to build the carport, with premade trusses to make it easier/quicker to build.  I was on the fence with the cost of materials but figured it would be better to bite the bullet and build the real deal rather than a fabric garage.  I verified with the tax assessor that his taxes wouldn't go up very much (less than $40 per year worst case) and made the final call to my grandfather to let him know when I'd be coming.  Up to that point, he had no idea I had been planning this (in fact, he still doesn't know), well I told him I wanted to buy him a portable garage for his birthday, and was just about to explain my 'change of plans' to a more permanent structure, when he interrupted me and told me he "beat me to it".   ??? ??? 
I was unaware that earlier this spring, he found a sale on Shelterlogic portable garages and purchased a 12'X20' model for the winter time.  He said he was going to ask me to put it up when I came up.   :

Well, there that plan went  :D  No real carport this year!  Oh well, it made it easier for me and he seemed to be real happy about the 'deal' he got on it, win win I suppose. 

I told him that instead of just throwing this one up and placing it on the lawn like the last ones (that didn't last) we were going to make a proper base/foundation for it.  Also, he had a drainage issue where he would get standing water as the snow melted, then it would freeze solid when it cooled off, so I told him we'd take care of that as well.

He got his first "garage" back in 2008.  He wanted to put it in a spot that was right under a large pine tree that my father planted when he was a little boy.  He wanted that tree taken down and put the tent garage there.  No problem grandpa...

(Fall of '08)


  

 

He actually wanted the portable garage right where the tree was, but since I didn't have my handy dandy stumpgrinder (or tractor) at the time, we worked around it.  (I'm going to refer to the portable garage as "garage" from now on, despite the fact that I hate calling these things garages and have an awkwardly strong "aversion" to these fabric "garages")
Since then, he's gone through 2 of these garages, and we'll see how long this one lasts.  This WILL be the last one.   ;D


Here is my little update on how it went: 
First thing I had to do, was finally take care of that (now 5 year old) stump.  It wasn't so much that the stump was the problem, but the large shallow roots spread out quite a ways from the stump, so I had to "chase" them to get rid of it all.... a lot of re positioning chasing roots 



  

  

  

   

  

 

Sometimes, I get take a little bit too big of a bite... It's surprising how "solid" the stump can be once you get a few inches below ground, into the "heart" of the stump.  I always thought Pine rotted quickly.  ???
 

 



Because of the drainage issue, I was going to add quite a bit of crushed stone, enough to bring the base up about 10" or so.  My grandfather also suggested we put some drainage pipe in, the only problem was I'd have to remove part of the 5' retaining wall on the other side to get the pitch correct on the pipe.  So that is what we (I) did. 
 

  

 


Next step was to measure and mark the hole locations for the Sonotubes.  Rather than measuring them out, I thought it would be more "idiot proof" to set up the frame (since I had to do that anyways) and square if off in place, then just mark the 4 corners, move the frame out of the way, and drill all the holes with the post hole digger.
 

  

 


Time to drill some holes  ;D....
 

 
 

    




Then I had a truckload of stone delivered.  I thought I'd only need about 8 yards but since the truck was going to cost me the same for delivery whether it was an 8 yard load, or a full 12 yard load, I figured I'd spend a few extra dollars on stone and get the 12 yards.  I thought I would have plenty left over to use in other areas, but it turned out to be the perfect amount, and I wouldn't have wanted any less.
 

 

Then put the bucket on the tractor to spread the stone.  It worked okay, but I kept wishing I had my 8' rear blade to level the stone.  It was a bit of a pain leveling the stone from left to right.  The right side was a bit lower than the left, so I had to scoop a bit of stone from the left, dump it on the right, then backblade it a bit to level, and keep doing that.  I even had to get off the tractor and actually use physical labor a couple times     You know, like with a real shovel  ;D 
You'll see something that you'll rarely EVER see in my pictures, in some of the next ones.  Notice that instead of the grapple on the front end loader, there is a bucket.  That is a very rare thing for me to have on my tractor  ;D
 

 


Then I attached the pressure treated sill over the concrete piers, using anchor bolts that I set when I poured the concrete.
 

 

All the hard work was done at that point, then it was just a matter of screwing the garage frame down to the sill with lag screws, and fitting the canvas over it. 
 

  

 

I put his Explorer in the new garage.  He was very happy about how it turned out.  It was good timing as well, the next morning he woke up to snow on the ground, even though it was just a dusting he was happy to have his car nice and clean. 

And that's that, one more project out of the way...we'll see what he has for me next time I go up there  :D

[thecfarm]

A nice story and nice job.That will make Gramps happy. It's nice you have all that stuff to play with.  ;D   He won't be in the mud and water this spring. I don't like them "garages" either. But saying that I have seen some that last for years, and some not much more than 2.
I do alot of clearing behind the house. I want to get it back again as a field,like it was when I was growing up. Those white pine stumps will stay there for years. And be nice and solid inside. Almost look like I just cut it. I dig them out with the tractor after 5-6-7 years. I have a few that I can try this summer to get out. Most times they come out all in one piece too. A white maple, if I keep the suckers off it,is just about gone in the same time frame. The stump is all rotten.

[Stephen1]

Grandpa is Happy, and when that shelter dies you have a base for a real structure.

[Hilltop366]

What is this shovel thing you speak of?

Well done!

[Thehardway]

Hope you don't mind me hijacking the post since your project is kinda done.  I have been toying with the same general idea, only in my case it will be a tractor/ machine shed instead of a carport.

Lately they have been doing a lot of utility work around here and replacing all the power poles.  Many of the rural landowners keep the poles for fenceposts etc. but in the more dense neighborhoods they have no use for them and end up back at the power company.  I have lined up several for my project.  I can cut them or use them whole.

So my big question is this, if time is of the essence, would it not be easier to lay down two long poles or timbers as sill plates and build up from them rather than burying multiple poles?  If you bevel the ends of the sill plates to form skids, and brace it well, the whole structure can be relocated using a tractor or 4WD truck to drag it.  Since I am always changing my mind about where to put stuff, this seems a desireable thing.  No holes to dig, no concrete to pour.  2- 30' sills made from a treated power pole and each put on a shallow gravel trench each side of the building about 16-20' apart, some home milled EWP or SWP posts to support the lightweight trusses or rafter and tie system.  Some 1/2" rebar driven through the poles into the ground could be used to hold it in place if you were concerned about wind or uplift.   I think this could be done in 2 days time with a helper.

Only downside I see to this is that side entry is obstructed by the sills.

Any opinions?

[Rockn H]

Hardway, something you may want to check on to help make up your mind is taxes.  Here, as soon as you put a hole in the ground for footings or to anchor your "portable" carport it goes on your property taxes.  Anything on blocks or skids does not go on your taxes. ;)

[Piston]

Hardway,
I would think something like that would work.  It sounds like you basically want to build a more traditional style foundation with full length sills?  It would obviously need very sturdy bracing and you'd need to make sure your cross sills were at least a bit higher than the long sills (so when you "tow" it around it doesn't dig in).  I'm not sure how easy or effective it would be to tow it, but theres only one way to find out  ;D

Essentially, if I had put beefier sills in place of the 2x6's that I used, say 6x8s or bigger, I could tow it around just fine.  Are you planning on using a portable garage like I did, or building a real structure? 

[Holmes]

Nicely done Piston. 

[Thehardway]

I would plan on building a "real" structure.  It would basically be about 4 or 5 bents morticed or bolted into an uninterrupted sill with braced girts and top plate supporting some lightweight trusses and a tin roof.  No holes or permanent foundation to maintain the "portable" status and keep it off the tax records.  Just some gravel or rubble to give the sills drainage.  Hopefully I'll get to it this spring.  Picked up 30- 15' poles yesterday plus some stubs I can use as fenceposts.  I'll post a sketch when I get a few extra minutes