Back-saving tool for Woodmizer outriggers?

[SawyerBrown]

Well, starting my second thread.  I keep thinking ... if a tree falls in the forest and nobody's there, does it really make a sound?  [If I post and nobody reads it, is it really a post?]

Background ... about a month ago the old back started hurting, pain down the leg, toes numb, wouldn't let up.  Fast forward to MRI results: bulged disc pinching nerve.  Discs, actually, but only one that's contributing to the pain.  Appointment in a couple of weeks to have steroids injected into my spine.  Boy I hope they know what they're doing.

When I told my doctor what my retirement job was (sawmilling), he gave me one of those "you've got to be kidding" looks, then said something to the effect that if I was going to do it, I needed to be smarter about it.  Yeah, my back has been telling me that, Thanks, Doc.

So today I was out doing my maintenance on the mill, and it occurred to me that one of the worst parts of the job for lifting/prying/twisting/pulling/ouch-my-back was setting up/pulling up the outriggers.  So, I started working on a solution, and it's shown below.  I haven't done a "field test" on it yet, but it sure seems to work pretty slick sitting in the shed.

Anybody have a better solution?  I'm certainly open, as well as any other "body-saving" tips.

Just a "fork" cut from an old scrap of hickory -- good strong material:



 

It fits down over the pin, thin enough to go behind the "roll pin"



 

Forks and handle long enough so that enough motion on pin to disengage it.

Then I used another scrap of hickory with a short dowel to make a outrigger-puller-upper:



 

It's small enough to fit down inside the outrigger (with dust cap off) and grab a hole.



 

So the whole process can be done from a standing-up position.  Still some strain on the back but it's not all contorted hanging over the mill.

By the way, I tried using the puller-upper on an lower hole from the outside, and it didn't work so well -- to much side-load I think that kind of cocked it in frame.  May be a better way without removing dust caps.

I'd be interested in any other body-saving gadgets or techniques that others use. 

Thanks, FF!

Pete

[Peter Drouin]

Is  that a new mill?
We all do what we have to do to save our backs.
will the shots bring down the swelling in your back?

[Jim_Rogers]

I like the fork. I have caps over the outriggers or duck tape as the caps were broken so I don't think I could use the lifter.

I have put my jack bar into a hole and then pulled up on the bar to lift once or twice.

Jim Rogers

[Ga Mtn Man]

I'm glad you brought up the WM outrigger subject.  I like your gadgets and they should be helpful in solving two of the many problems with these things.  I'm finding a lot to like about the LT40 but I have set my mill up twice now and I absolutely despise the outriggers.  For example:   I was trying to lower the tongue to get the mill close to level but the weight on the jack prevented me from pulling out the rod!?  I ended up using my truck jack to lower the tongue and then set the front outrigger.  Another problem I had was trying to raise  the rail side middle two outriggers to level the mill side to side.  I heaved on that rod with all my might and could not manage to lift the mill (but I'm pretty sure I managed to wreck my back :-\)  And, yes, the saw head was at the far end of the mill.  I ended up using the truck jack again.

Any advise  from you experienced WM guys on setting up the mill would be much appreciated.  I simply don't have the $ right now to get the FAO's.

[scully]

The 2 inboard legs are the worse ! Granted setup is not fun at times but still one of the most rock solid desighns in the buisness ! I am going to get those crank legs at some point but they are pricey ! For now the floor jack rides along with me often....

[Jim_Rogers]

Well, it's kind of tough to say what's the best way to set up a mill other than try to set it up on level ground. I know some sites don't let you do that.

I don't know if I ever wrote about how I set up my mill. But I think I do it the way I was taught at the dealer when I picked it up nearly 20 years ago.

I have at times tried what they show on the side of the mill when working with unlevel ground. One picture shows the outriggers up on blocks. I tried that once and it didn't work. The mill fell off the blocks. The next picture shows digging out the ground. I have done that for sure. I usually pack a shovel and a rake to go to on site jobs. Magicman shows many times how he has dug out for his outriggers.

I think that after I get the mill off the truck, I then move the saw head to the hitch end and set the two back outriggers. Then I move the saw head to the back of the mill and set the front outriggers. If the mill is un-level from left to right I try and lift the low side. If it's low on the right it doesn't matter too much as the head hangs down on that side and usually the logs won't roll off the table. If the mill leans to the left then this can be a problem as the head can shift that way a bit and it may not cut lumber correctly.

After I have all my outriggers set I then lower my log loader feet and then release the log loader from the turner hook up.

I have seen guys just unhook the log loader without lowering the feet first and drop it. Too much for me to do that. That load loader is heavy and can really hurt you if you dropped it down onto your foot.

All I can say is you need to establish a method that works for you. And be safe out there.

Jim Rogers

PS. I have a floor jack I bring with me as well, and I have used it many times to setup and break down my mill.

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

Good point Jim. It don't take but 1 mishap. 

[SawyerBrown]

Is  that a new mill?
We all do what we have to do to save our backs.
will the shots bring down the swelling in your back?

Peter, yeah, pretty new ... picked it up right at a year ago.  I was actually sawing smaller logs a few years before I bought it, bought a real interesting home-made contraption from an old tinkerer (bandsaw blade ran over two trailer tires, 13-hp Chinese engine, belts-driving-chain and sprocket system) for $50, as Rube Goldberg as it sounds it actually worked fairly well on anything up to maybe 12" (bigger ... not so great) , made some minor improvements and then sold it for over $700 on eBay!   Then a local guy cut some logs I wanted to use in woodworking projects with his LT40 ... and BAM  I was hooked!  Been trying to get my retirement job started ever since.  The paint still looks pretty new.  For the price of that machine, IT goes in the shed and the truck sits outside!

As far as the back ... gosh, I hope so.  It's supposed to shrink the swelling which takes the pressure off the nerve which then relieves some of the pain. 

  I was trying to lower the tongue to get the mill close to level but the weight on the jack prevented me from pulling out the rod!?  I ended up using my truck jack to lower the tongue and then set the front outrigger.  Another problem I had was trying to raise  the rail side middle two outriggers to level the mill side to side.  I heaved on that rod with all my might and could not manage to lift the mill (but I'm pretty sure I managed to wreck my back :-\)  And, yes, the saw head was at the far end of the mill.  I ended up using the truck jack again.

Mt Man, agree with all points.  I've been able to level mine side-to-side, but my LT35 is probably a little lighter than yours.  I have the most luck not trying to take a full stroke on either side outrigger at the same time.  I shim one so I take a half a stroke, and alternate back and forth.  Seems like it shouldn't make much difference, but maybe the machine flexes just a little bit, or it's just not so much movement all at one time.  Then once it's level I shim them the same.

The other thing I can't figure out is why they didn't put holes all the way to the bottom on the front outrigger.  I did a job a few weeks ago where, to level it up, the tongue was almost on the ground, and I had to use the two next-rear riggers to pick it up again.  And, in the shed, I drop the tongue a little bit so the rear end clears a pile of lumber, and same problem.  All the others have them ...

As far as safety is concerned, the other thing I bought right up front was a good pair of steel-toed shoes.  And a first aid kit!   ;D

Have a good evening everyone.

[Magicman]

I was trying to lower the tongue to get the mill close to level but the weight on the jack prevented me from pulling out the rod!? 

If you pinched the rod, then you just have not gotten the sequence down pat yet.  Depending upon whether you are going "up" or "down" determines whether the rod starts in the up or down position.  You will catch on.

I had decided to upgrade to FAO's before I won the first Personal Best Award.  The two inside outriggers were going to be the first to go.

[SawyerBrown]

One more thing just occurred to me, for leveling side-to-side, you'd want the sawhead to be as low as possible.  If you're already on a slope, having it way up in the air is going to put further off the center of gravity and add to the weight you're trying to pick up.  I don't know whether that makes any practical difference, but in theory it should.  Just a thought.

[bedway]

I dont have a woodmizer so i cant relate to those specific issues. I have a home built mill and it has its challenges. This is what i have to deal with, 2 ruptured discs, and 2 bulging discs. The VA has offered surgery for my issues but ive opted for theorpy. Needless to say every move i make is thought out. Those of you with major back issues can relate to this. If i go to the sink and start filling a glass with water my pain increases with every ounce that flows into that glass. Those of you with good backs, be careful.

[thecfarm]

I find out on the last few years when I over stretch or reach,I get a wicked pain in my side. So now I just walk around the log or tractor or whatever it is and I feel alot better. I know with the outriggers no way to walk around and get them from the other side.

[Tom L]

I'm glad you brought up the WM outrigger subject.  I like your gadgets and they should be helpful in solving two of the many problems with these things.  I'm finding a lot to like about the LT40 but I have set my mill up twice now and I absolutely despise the outriggers.  For example:   I was trying to lower the tongue to get the mill close to level but the weight on the jack prevented me from pulling out the rod!?  I ended up using my truck jack to lower the tongue and then set the front outrigger.  Another problem I had was trying to raise  the rail side middle two outriggers to level the mill side to side.  I heaved on that rod with all my might and could not manage to lift the mill (but I'm pretty sure I managed to wreck my back :-\)  And, yes, the saw head was at the far end of the mill.  I ended up using the truck jack again.

Any advise  from you experienced WM guys on setting up the mill would be much appreciated.  I simply don't have the $ right now to get the FAO's.

I can't get my mill to raise with the jacks. always have to back the mill up over boards to level the mill then put the jacks down to support it.
if you ever get a chance to meet marty for woodmizer pa. he sets up a mill about as effortlessly as you can imagine. use the mill as a counterweight to take weight off of jack legs and never has to fuss around too much with the jacks using the jack bar. watching him, the machine almost sets up itself.with very little effort

Pete, very cool tools you made. smart thinking

[nk14zp]

Why not carry a handyman jack to level the mill?

[woodmills1]

always use the lifting rod to lift the weight(up or down) before pulling the pin


and by the way never drive off with lifting rod not in its holder ina hay field
go ahead ask me how I know :D

[barbender]

I find that moving the head back and forth on my LT40 to take the weight off the jacks makes for a fairly effortless set-up. I'll often get the tires right off of the ground using only the head and the outriggers. I have also almost flipped my mill over with my methods, so take it with a grain of salt :D I'm 6'5" and I don't like bending down all the time, especially for the hydraulic controls on my mill, so I set it up high (I put blocks under the tires if they are off the ground). I also keep a high lift jack in the truck. The more times I set the mill up, the less I use the high lift. All that being said, if I had a bad back, I would probably get the FAOs just to save all the bending down.

[r.man]

I have a small travel trailer and it has pinned adjustable posts to level with. These require me to bend down, dig, block etc and then use the tongue jack to actually level. I once met a retired mechanic with a bad back who had the same trailer and he had bolted four scrap car scissor jacks, one on each corner. He ran them up and down with a rechargeable impact gun, no problems. All he had invested in it was a bit of time and a few bolts. I also knew a Clarke sawmill owner who made his own adjustable toe board with a scissors jack. Could be many uses for these otherwise scrap items.

[moosehunter]

I carry a handy man jack. When the mill needs serious leveling/ jacking it works very well. You need to put a block for and aft BOTH tires  :embarassed: or it may go side ways on ya!

[MartyParsons]

[quoteI can't get my mill to raise with the jacks. always have to back the mill up over boards to level the mill then put the jacks down to support it.
if you ever get a chance to meet marty for woodmizer pa. he sets up a mill about as effortlessly as you can imagine. use the mill as a counterweight to take weight off of jack legs and never has to fuss around too much with the jacks using the jack bar. watching him, the machine almost sets up itself.with very little effort][/quote]

Hello,
I should do a video I guess. But here are a few quick tips.

Level the mill from right to left before you unhook from the towing vehicle. Use blocks under the trailer wheels as needed to get it level, not with a level but common sense, Hey look at the water bottle if you are not sure.

Use the weight of the saw head to help you. Please do not even try to lower all the legs before moving the head unless you are on very uneven ground. If you put the front leg and back leg down at the same time you will not be able to adjust the level of the mill.

Lower the front three legs first. Just let them fall to the ground use the jack handle on the front leg and raise until you hear the other two legs click in. raise the front leg one hole and it works best if it is off the ground a little.  The mill must be somewhat level. If you have it too high in the front the saw head will go to the rear of the bed and at least scare you or cause problems. Lower the rear leg if needed. Sometimes I do not unhook the safety chain until I see if the saw head travels once it leaves the rest pin.

If you have a hydraulic mill raise the head to 26" and move the saw head forward all the way to the stop. The rear of the bed will raise and the front three legs will be set and you should not need to do anything to them at this point.

Walk to the rear of the mill drop the two legs behind the last bed rail. You don't need to set them yet. Drop the rear leg and lift the mill with the jack handle, so there is weight on the rear leg and the front leg, you may need to use a small block if you run out of holes. The other rear legs should click in when you raise the rear leg. Have a taper shingle or wedge the legs as needed.

Dave Martin left some camper blocks here. I have been using them when I am not on level ground. I think I saw Magic had some of them in his tool box.

Remember to be safe! Don't hurry and think before you do something to cause a bad day.

Hope this helps!
Marty

[woodmills1]

now that is how to do it :P

[Stephen1]

I was trying to lower the tongue to get the mill close to level but the weight on the jack prevented me from pulling out the rod!? 

If you pinched the rod, then you just have not gotten the sequence down pat yet.  Depending upon whether you are going "up" or "down" determines whether the rod starts in the up or down position.  You will catch on.
my biggest problem is the pinching of the ss bar. When I am taking the mill down after sawing. I now carry a bottle jack to help. I know I am missing something, the light bulb has not flashed yet to tell me... MM
I had decided to upgrade to FAO's before I won the first Personal Best Award.  The two inside outriggers were going to be the first to go.