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Board Feet Tally

Started by chickenchaser, October 05, 2013, 10:39:13 PM

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chickenchaser

I haven't given this any thought until today:

    When sawing a customer's logs - do you keep a running tally as it comes off the mill or figure it in the stack?

With my limited experience, I have been tallying the stack...checking and re-checking. The job I am finishing up has very random lengths and multiple thicknesses in each stack. Learning experience.  ;D

I see where a running tally would have been more precise...

CC
WoodMizer LT35HD

JD 3720 w/loader. 1983 Chevrolet C30 dump. 1973 Ford F600 w/stickloader. 35,000 chickens.

Magicman

I tally at the end of the sawing day, but sometimes with various lengths, widths, & thicknesses, hourly rate works best.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

sawmillhand

I have a tally sheet i use and put little dots on it and tally it all up at the end of the day. Ill try and scan it so you can see it.
1990 woodmizer LT40 Hyd  2004 Ford F350 Flatbed. Plenty of tractors.

YellowHammer

I do a running tally because I always want to know my yield from the log as I'm sawing it, especially if its a high grade and I've had to pay for it.  To make it easy and quick, I have marked my bed rail with a big ruler so I can easily see the width of any board or cant as I'm sawing it.  With Accuset, most times I know the width exactly, anyway.  As the first board comes back on the the board return, I measure its length,and write it at the top of the column on the notepad and then add the width of every subsequent board under it as they come by me.  It only takes a few seconds to do the addition and notation while sawing the next board so I'm not loosing any time.
When done, I give the tally sheet to the customer along with the bill ;D
YH
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

beenthere

YH
You must have length on that sheet as well, or are your logs all the same length?
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

bandmiller2

I find running tallies just slow me down. I stack 4' wide its easy at the end of the day to figure BF, legnth times width times the tiers. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Peter Drouin

I do it at the end of the job. Unless the guy wants to move the wood. Then I tell him to have it all gone by the time I get back the next day. I keep all the sizes together


 
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

Chuck White

I stack each size board in a separate pile.

That is 1x6x8 in a pile 1x6x10 in a separate pile, etc.

Then at the end of the day, I count the boards in each of the piles and document each on my tally sheet!

I tried keeping a tally as they came off the mill and it was a lost cause, because after a while I was thinking to myself...... Did I count that or not?
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

red oaks lumber

if the job is saw and go i blockscale at the end. if we are drying and machining it i'll tally the job at the very end.
the experts think i do things wrong
over 18 million b.f. processed and 7341 happy customers i disagree

woodmills1

I keep a running tally on 90% of my jobs, with others like one or two types of boards, or to a cut list I will tally different
James Mills,Lovely wife,collect old tools,vacuuming fool,36 bdft/hr,oak paper cutter,ebonic yooper rapper nauga seller, Blue Ox? its not fast, 2 cat family, LT70,edger, 375 bd ft/hr, we like Bob,free heat,no oil 12 years,big splitter, baked stuffed lobster, still cuttin the logs dere IAM

customsawyer

I tally the packs of lumber.
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

Nomad

     I prefer to tally the packs of lumber.  But I have to admit on a couple of Joe Homeowner jobs that ended up like Chinese fire drills, I had to make my best estimate.  I've promised myself to never let that happen again!
Buying a hammer doesn't make you a carpenter
WoodMizer LT50HDD51-WR
Lucas DSM23-19

Bigbo1234

I just did a job today and it was all smaller logs, 14" max by 10'. The owner wanted all 5/4x whatever I could get. I got mostly 8" and some 10's and 6's. I kept a notepad on my command post and tallied up each log. If it was a 10' log I wrote 10'x whatever width I got and how many boards from that log, then on to the next line for the next log. I worked we'll. I cut 1085 bd ft of red pine flooring, counting the 5/4 as 1" and didn't count any side lumber as he was takin it and ripping stickers on his tablesaw as I dropped them. I cut 23 logs. Prolly could have yielded more but I'm still learning.
Bowen

YellowHammer

Quote from: beenthere on October 06, 2013, 12:31:02 AM
YH
You must have length on that sheet as well, or are your logs all the same length?

That's correct, I get lots of odd length logs and take that into account, but I don't usually measure the length of the log, just the first board as it comes off and assume all the boards off that log are the same length if its a decently trimmed log.  I've probably made this more confusing than it is, so let me give an example.  This technique easy and and fast and can be done in your head if sawing to standard widths and even numbers.

The first clean, edged board come back past on the dragback and gets measured for length and width either by the Accuset or bed rail or tape measure.  The length is written at the top of a column on my notepad. 
After that all boards from that particular log just get noted for width and summed in a running total on the pad or my head until I'm done with the entire log including edgings. Only then is the final sum of all the widths multiplied by the log length at the end to get surface measure or again by thickness if different that 1 inch to get bdft.
The reason this technique is fast, easy and can be done in my head is that it doesn't matter how many boards come off the mill per log, the only thing I have to remember is the running total board width for that log.

So for example if the log was 8 feet long and it only gave up a few boards the tally sheet column for this log would look like this:

8 (first board length or log in feet)
--
10 (first board width in inches)
20 (The 2nd 10 inch wide board added to the width of 1st 10 inch wide board)
28 (The 3rd board was 8 inches wide added to running total)
36 (The 4rth board was 8 inches wide and added to running total)
40 (The 5th and last board was 4 inches wide and added to running total which now equal 40 inches total width
____
26.7 bdft

(While the next log is being loaded I multiply the total width x log length x thickness/12   or 40x8x1/12=26.7 bdft
If everything is coming off 1 inch thick, just multiply the total width x log length /12 which only takes a few seconds. 40x8/12=26.7

The next log gets loaded and I start a new column and do it again.
Nice thing about this is that when I'm done sawing, I'm done calculating too and can head to the house ;D
If I'm sawing for a customer, they get the tally sheet.
If I'm sawing for myself, I just compare this  yield to the scaled number marked on the end of the log.

YH


YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

red oaks lumber

the experts think i do things wrong
over 18 million b.f. processed and 7341 happy customers i disagree

PC-Urban-Sawyer

Quote from: Bigbo1234 on October 06, 2013, 09:19:49 PM
... I cut 1085 bd ft of red pine flooring, counting the 5/4 as 1" ...

Bowen,

You cheated yourself out of 25% of your fee if you were charging by the BF. Softwood grading associations and general custom are that 1" and thinner is charged as 1" X width X length and that anything over 1" thick is charged as actual thickness X width X length

Herb

Tom the Sawyer

Most of my clients are woodworkers and have never had a log milled before.  They usually want a variety of thicknesses and log lengths are inconsistent.  Many times the logs are cut and then they think about getting them milled.  They also may try to balance the load in their pickup or trailer so figuring board footage after we were done was very inefficient for me.

I now keep a tally sheet on a clipboard.  I track a lot of information like overrun, blade life, etc. and the sheet helps greatly with that.  When I put a log on the mill I measure the small end diameter, length and my opening face height.  I enter the log #, diameter, length and start time on the sheet.  I have a small tally counter mounted next to my up/down button and once I start making boards I tap the tally counter at the end of each board, before I raise the blade up.  I have a ruler on the first bunk under the cant so I can read the width.  When I change widths I enter the tally counter number on the sheet, zero the counter and keep on milling.

I figure up board footage during a break (to give them an idea if they are curious or milling to a budget) and finalize at the end of the day.  I enter the info from the sheet into a program on my Android phone and it figures the board footage and the milling fee for each entry.  It may take me an additional 15 minutes at the end of a long day but it eliminates math errors and gives me the detailed information I use to make long term business decisions.

07 TK B-20, Custom log arch, 20' trailer w/log loading arch, F350 flatbed dually dump.  Piggy-back forklift.  LS tractor w/FEL, Bobcat S250 w/grapple, Stihl 025C 16", Husky 372XP 24/30" bars, Grizzly 20" planer, Nyle L200M DH kiln.
If you call and my wife says, "He's sawin logs", I ain't snoring.

Peter Drouin

Quote from: Tom the Sawyer on October 07, 2013, 10:21:51 AM
Most of my clients are woodworkers and have never had a log milled before.  They usually want a variety of thicknesses and log lengths are inconsistent.  Many times the logs are cut and then they think about getting them milled.  They also may try to balance the load in their pickup or trailer so figuring board footage after we were done was very inefficient for me.

I now keep a tally sheet on a clipboard.  I track a lot of information like overrun, blade life, etc. and the sheet helps greatly with that.  When I put a log on the mill I measure the small end diameter, length and my opening face height.  I enter the log #, diameter, length and start time on the sheet.  I have a small tally counter mounted next to my up/down button and once I start making boards I tap the tally counter at the end of each board, before I raise the blade up.  I have a ruler on the first bunk under the cant so I can read the width.  When I change widths I enter the tally counter number on the sheet, zero the counter and keep on milling.

I figure up board footage during a break (to give them an idea if they are curious or milling to a budget) and finalize at the end of the day.  I enter the info from the sheet into a program on my Android phone and it figures the board footage and the milling fee for each entry.  It may take me an additional 15 minutes at the end of a long day but it eliminates math errors and gives me the detailed information I use to make long term business decisions.




You sure do think a lot Tom. no way I could use a pencil
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

drobertson

Lots of great ideas and practices shown here,  whether it is a by the stack technique or individual tally both work fine, I like to keep track for custom orders as I go, just cause I'm lazy, and I really don't enjoy counting them over and over, and most have appreciated having a list of what they have, I suppose it aids when planning and building, for this reason I use this technique if you will, it is similar to the dot method allot of mills use,  I just threw this together,  sorry for the sloppy illustration,    david

 
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

red oaks lumber

if you guys are sawing to full capacity how do you have time to grab a pencil let alone write with it? i know i can't, i dont even have time to drink anything.
the experts think i do things wrong
over 18 million b.f. processed and 7341 happy customers i disagree

Dave Shepard

When I'm sawing for other people, it is by the hour, so my interest in the volume sawn is to get an idea of the cost per foot, so that I feel that my hourly rate is justifiable. So far, the customer is making out much better than if I charged by the foot.

One tool that I really like whenever I'm tallying is one of those little clicker counters from Bailey's. I hold the clicker in one hand and one of those big chisel bit permanent markers in the other and put a dot on the end of every board. It's also really handy when counting tomato stakes 500 at a time.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

woodmills1

using my 70 with accuset on regular jobs all flitches go to the edger
so I end up with a cant that I already know the lenth and width of because I trimmed the log and sawed the cant


I keep a regular sheet of paper folded into eights in my back pocket, the one with out the crayon.  example the cant cuts 6 1x8x10, so i write 6 1x8x10 on the paper while the saw is moving forward.  I start the head, take off my gloves and remove the paper.  saw is out of log, so lift return hit down and forward, run speed down and up the write numbers.  saw is out of log, so repeat and put paper back in pocket and gloves back on


no saw time lost


on the edger I tally all boards of the same length as a width in inches in my head and will end up with like 56 inches of 8 foot one by, etc and that is what I write on my sheet

If you have ever run a woodmizer edger by yourself you will know why I welcome the chance to stop and write some numbers



all of the math is done later in the house and all of my customers get a copy of the exact lumber cut

NH requires me to provide a yearly tally for my mill permit
James Mills,Lovely wife,collect old tools,vacuuming fool,36 bdft/hr,oak paper cutter,ebonic yooper rapper nauga seller, Blue Ox? its not fast, 2 cat family, LT70,edger, 375 bd ft/hr, we like Bob,free heat,no oil 12 years,big splitter, baked stuffed lobster, still cuttin the logs dere IAM

YellowHammer

Quote from: red oaks lumber on October 07, 2013, 06:33:54 PM
if you guys are sawing to full capacity how do you have time to grab a pencil let alone write with it? i know i can't, i dont even have time to drink anything.

That's certainly something my off-bearers sometimes complain about. They
tell me to put the pencil down and grab the log hook :D   For some reason, writing down the numbers seems to always take just about the exact amount of time it takes for them to get a fresh log on the loader arms.  Amazing coincidence  :D

Actually, when I'm sawing alone, the reason I try to do as much in my head and minimal writing is to keep me from burning time
YH
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

terrifictimbersllc

Tailgate of my truck is my office, right behind me with my drink.  Sizes like  1x4, 5, 6, 7, 10, 12 and 2x4, 6, 8 go across the top of a fresh paper on my clipboard with a lumber pencil, and lengths 8, 9, 10, 11, 13 whatever down the left side, make a grid with the pencil, and spit out the count  in your head in appropriate box once or several times per log onto this paper as the boards leave the mill. Take a drink at the same time. Turn around and hope the next log is on the mill arms.   Put count in excel spreadsheet later to get the bf and email to customer or if I have time figure it in the cab and print it out along with the invoice.   That's how I do it.  My wife does crossword puzzles I figure this is just as good mental exercise for me.
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

Dewey

I don't know how to copy scan ect ... But my tally system was in Julys issue of Sawmill Woodlot it works great for me...

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