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best guess on how long to cut material list

Started by dablack, September 16, 2013, 09:05:15 AM

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dablack

Ok guys.  I have build things with store bought wood in the past but this time I think I would like to cut my own lumber.  I'm thinking a small manual mill to keep cost down.  Like an LT10 or something similar.   This is for a 1350 sqft house.  There is more to the material list but these three things make up the bulk of the house. 

1000   1x6x8'
200     2x6x8'
80       2x10x16'

The 1x6s will be used where OSB and plywood are usually used (roof deck, subfloor, sheathing).  All my lumber is pine and about 24" in diameter.  I have no idea if it would be more effecient use of wood to make 1x6, 3/4x8, or what?  I don't know. 

Let me know what you think.  All the logs are on site and straight.  If the logs were cut to length, stacked and ready to go, how long would it take to cut the above three things?  I have a little B2620 Kubota to help. 

thanks
Austin
Building my own house in East TX

WH_Conley

On the 1 x 6 you will find that you will be leaving a lot of wood on the edging's. I would go random width, keep it on even numbers, 6,8,10 inches wide. That way you can match the boards together without loosing nearly as much.

As for time, I can't tell you. That would have a lot to do with experience and helpers with a manual mill.
Bill

Magicman

I would figure a week with my sawmill, but it has hydraulics.  Will an LT10 saw 16'?

Just a reminder about using rough sawn/ungraded framing lumber.  Building permits, loans, insurance, and the builder.  Make sure that everyone is on the same page before any big plans are made.  Some places it matters and some it does not.  Your Architectural drawings need to specify #2 and/or rough sawn.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

dablack

WH, Yes, great idea.  Of course I should do that!

MM,  So you are saying 40 hours with a hydraulic rig?    Also, I'm the builder, banker and architect!  HA!  Really though, no codes out here but I do keep up with what is code and always exceed it.  I have four kids so what daddy builds is STOUT!  If 24"OC is code, I usually go 16" OC or go up a size on the wood.  I want the buildings I build to be around for my great grandkids. 

thanks
Austin
Building my own house in East TX

thecfarm

I take it you never sawed before? Ever been around a mill before? I suppose you have a 40 hour week job and family? Will you be cutting the trees down too? Better tell the wife and kids you won't be seeing them for a while.  :D  Probably the way I cut from stump to lumber,would take me 2 months. I don't know. Life gets in the way and slows me down. But if I needed a house to be up and going before snow gets here in my area I would have to do it. You will have a BIG slab pile too. I built a 12X24 building and I had a slab pile 4 feet high by 20 feet long. My mill is on a slight hill so I put down a few thick slabs and made a bridge and walked on the pile to pile the slabs.Your tractor,how many HP is that? Will that be used to get the logs out?
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Magicman

Austin, your building codes and other info are the same as most of my area.  Saw it and build it.   ;D

Yes I could easily saw that in a week, but not with a manual sawmill.  LINK
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Jim_Rogers

When a customer hands me a list like that, I would start with the 2x10x16 and try and cut those first. If the log or lumber won't make them then I go to the second priority item on the list.
On the way to making 2x10's I'd make boards or the 2x6's.
As mentioned consider making wider widths and using them as well.

Jim Rogers
Whatever you do, have fun doing it!
Woodmizer 1994 LT30HDG24 with 6' Bed Extension

dablack

Jim,  Sounds like a plan.  I was thinking that way as well.  Try to make 2x10s and if not, then go on down the list. 

MM,  I am very familiar with your addition.  I don't remember if I posted in the thread or not but really liked all the cedar. 

cfarm,  Nope, never been around a mill.  Never even cut down a large tree.  I built a 26x52 1.5 story house and learned that the lumber only makes up about 20% of a house build.  My problem right now is that money is tight and a sawmill might be the only way to make it work.  The trees are well spaced and can be felled and dragged to the mill without too much trouble.  My mill would be on a hill as well.  I'm planning on using the uphill side to help load the mill.  The tractor is a little 26HP unit.  I don't think I would try to really lift much with it.  More likely use it to pull and drag.  I used it to pull a 30' 1.5' diameter sweat gum the other day and it did just fine.  With that said, the sweatgum had been on the ground for a while and was pretty dry. 

The other part of the equation is that I would like to build other things later.  A mill would be handy to get that done on the cheap. 

thanks
Austin
Building my own house in East TX

thecfarm

Nothing a matter with a 26hp tractor. We all have to use what we have. You will be REAL busy for a while. Read up on sticking-piling your lumber. May want to use some of the big logs for the 8 footers and then the smaller stuff for the boards. Which would make more sense anyways. More knots in the upper part of the tree.Use those with the knots for roofers and sideboards. I have a manual mill and they are very,very,very slow alone and alot of work and I mean ALOT of work alone. I have no idea if the wife or kids could help some,a friend? I have a friend that helps me. What a difference it makes.And he's never been around a mill,but mine.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

WH_Conley

When loading from the uphill side be careful the log does not get too momentum and turn the mill over when it hits.
Bill

dablack

I'm just wanting the loading area to be even with the deck of the sawmill so I won't have to go uphill with them.  Maybe a very slight downhill slope.  Anymore than that would be a little risky. 

thanks
Building my own house in East TX

drobertson

Not sure on the exact size of your house, but just some rough figuring I did, I would add to your 1x6 figure, there will be soffits to figure, and some miscellaneous trimming.  In addition you will end up needing some 1x4's as well. I'm kinda thinking you will end up in the 10,000 bd/ft range of sawn lumber when all said and done,  there will be waste to consider as well, plus you will need to sticker stack for sure, this kind of project will require some 4x4's too.  Sounds like fun to me, just lots of planning, hope it all goes well for you, perfect time of the year to take on this kind of Job.    david   And I forgot to answer the main question, at close to 8000 bd/ft  hydraulic mill with helpers, and a good set up for stacking, 5 days, manual mill, I have no idea,
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

dablack

David,

So you are saying 40 hours with a hydraulic mill? Oh boy.   That means at LEAST 80 hours with a manual mill.  I'm guessing.  I can get maybe 5 hours a day on the weekends.  That means two months of weekends.  UGGG! 

Anybody else with an estimate on hours?

thanks
Austin
Building my own house in East TX

thecfarm

Cutting the trees and limbing them out will take some time too.  ;D Also have a plan on stacking your lumber too. All that lumber is going to take some room. And the more you cut the father away the piles will be too.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

drobertson

No doubt this is a project, one that needs some good figuring, if minimal money is to be spent.  I would love to be part of it, not really an option but saying this for the sake of a very doable chore, just one that needs logistics, in the full sense of the word.  Good figures are critical for about any endeavor, as well as working out the details as far as moving away slabs and waste, there will no doubt be some room required for the lumber stock.  As I said a very doable task, just one that will need some planning.     david
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

MSSawmill

Just to throw in my 2 cents...
We had a fully manual LT25, a guy who makes his loving as a sawyer, my 60 year old dad, and myself, and we could cut about 1000 FBM in a 10 hour day. That's with 2 55+HP tractors to do the dragging, lifting, cross-hauling, pile moving, etc.
With just dad and I, cut that number in half...

What you're wanting to do is a noble endeavor, and it isn't insurmountable, but o hope you've got some friends, and I hope that none of you are afraid of work! :)

Btw, he didn't do much work with the LT25. He has 2 LT40s. The little one was local, though, and the others were over in Louisiana.
Home-built bandsaw mill
2004 Kubota M110 with LA1301 loader

customsawyer

What you are thinking is do able but here is another thought. Why don't you just hire a good sawyer so you can concentrate on the other things. They would also be able to coach you some on the stacking. ;)
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Quote from: customsawyer on September 16, 2013, 07:39:22 PM
Why don't you just hire a good sawyer so you can concentrate on the other things. They would also be able to coach you some on the stacking. ;)

Jake, are you fishing for a Texas trip? fishin-smiley
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

customsawyer

Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

Magicman

Aw shucks guys.  330 miles and I could be there in about 7 hours or so.   :)
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

drobertson

MM, I was thinking you were back logged through the fall with work?   I reckon you see some easy peasy pickens?   If the logs are decked, with hands ready to move the lumber! ;D  It will be a pile, for his house, and should be of house building quality, not far fetched, just a task at hand,   david
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

wetdog

I'm in the middle of a project very similer to yours so I can relate. I cut my framing lumber for a 1500sq foot(heated and cooled space) home. I had never used a mill before and a friend let me use his LT28. It was manual except for power feed. I have a 50hp tractor with loader. It took me about 6 months to cut the lumber. I'll admit I'm slow. I was teaching myself. Most of my time was spent cutting and dragging logs, sweeping sawdust from boards, spraying solubor on my boards and stacking them in the barn to dry. I didn't cut my roofing boards, I'll be using plywood for that. My time could have been cut in half if only I would have had one good helper with me. Its very hard work by yourself, but I know the end result will be very rewarding.

WDH

You are looking at a minimum of 80 hours with a LT10.  Plus, you have to have a lot of room to stack it and keep it dry.  Cut the biggest logs first, and as you square the cant for the 2x10's, you take off 1x material and the 2x6's.  When you get a wide enough face for the 2x10's, then you square up and saw them.  Be sure to center the pith in the 2x10 cant.  2x10x16's are a real load and bad on the body  :).  I agree with Jake.  You might think about hiring it done unless time is not an issue. 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Magicman

Quote from: drobertson on September 16, 2013, 08:28:01 PM
MM, I was thinking you were back logged through the fall with work? 
I told two customers today "the first part of November".

My "this week's job" had to postpone because of lack of help.  I could have started it Thursday, but I'll be back at the Cabin readying for the Chickin Crispin and I plan to spend all of next week there.

After that, I will be seriously getting ready for our Elk trip to Colorado.  Two weeks there and wham-o, it is November.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

drobertson

Ten four Lynn,  I was just giving you a lil friendly gig, I know better than to question your reputation,  this is a good job, for whoever gets it, cutting for a house is a project, lots of planning, unless there is room to spare for extra lumber,  nothing I have seen is so cut and dry as single cut order,  there is always plenty of waste,   david , and I should say, We would love to make the Chicken Crispen, just won't happen this year,    david
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

dablack

I really appreciate everyone's help.  To give a little background, I built a 26x52 1.5 story that burned down right before we moved in.  I didn't have the electrical done so the house wasn't grounded yet and then lightning hit.  It burned to the slab.  That first house I built completely by myself except for pouring the slab.  The first floor was all 2x6 and the second floor was attic trusses giving me a 19' wide room upstairs.  It was a 12:12 pitch roof (NEVER AGAIN).  My new plan is another 1.5 story but with balloon framing to give a little 2' pony wall upstairs and then a 8:12 pitch roof.  Lots of good space.  Anyway, there was no insurance on the first house so we are pretty poor right now.  I'm just trying to figure out options to dig us out of this fat hole.  The whole point of building my own house was to be financially free.  Now we are deeper than we have ever been. 

80 hours sounds pretty good.  Even if that is plus or minus 20%.  I can see it taking 10 to 12 weekends.  I'm looking at all options right now.  I'm not afraid of work at all (especially while it is cool outside....HA!), but my other problem is that I have 30 acres but no covered area to stack the lumber coming off the mill.  After I clear away the burned house, I will have a slab to stack the lumber on but it won't be covered.  I'm not sure what I'm going to do right now. 

thanks
Austin
Building my own house in East TX

WH_Conley

Try to find some tin, if the thieves will leave it alone, and just build some portable roofs that you can place on top of the stack.
Bill

WH_Conley

Ouch. That hurts. I just looked on the maps. Looks like you are about 950 miles from me. That pretty well rules out a road trip. If closer I could see where a mini FF get together could possibly happen. Just want to let you know you have our moral support if nothing else.
Bill

PC-Urban-Sawyer

+1 on the portable roofs for drying stacks.

Good luck and BE CAREFUL!

Herb

Magicman

Are your trees/logs on the ground?

Do you have a cut list?

What is your time frame for building?
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

pineywoods

+1 on the portable roofs. I use them on all my lumber stacks. Made out of junk 6X6 and roofing tin scrounged from unused chicken house. The 6X6 provide needed weight. Pics in my gallery.
When trying to get a handle on the time needed for your project, don't overlook the time required for material handling. When you finish the project, I'll bet you will find that actual sawing is less than half the time spent. Moving logs, dealing with slabs and edgings, stackin lumber etc eats up lots of time.
Just keep on keepin on, don't get discouraged. ;)
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

Magicman

Austin,  Is the house that burned the one pictured in this thread?  LINK
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

dablack

Yes, thats the place.  I made a quick cut list but a detailed one is just a couple of hours away.  I'm using engineered I joist for the 26' span so the rest is all 2x6s, 2x4s, 1x for sheathing, subfloor, decking and trim, and 2x10s for the rafters.  That is about it. 

No the trees aren't on the ground but they are out in the open and easy to fell.  I do have a couple down from where I cleared them for the house site. 

I had a mobile home moved onto the property so we could live there.  We couldn't afford the rent where we were staying anymore.  The little note on the trailer is way less than rent.  Plus the kids love being on the property.  So do the wife and I.  It is will also be much easier to rebuild while living there.  For the first house I was driving 45 minutes each way to work on it.  We got a ford RV to park next to the house so I would have some AC and somewhere to get cleaned up before coming home.  The kids liked "camping" there on the weekends too.  It was a total loss as well.  You can also see we lost most of the trees within 40 ft of the house. 





We WILL rebuild.  Luckily, my folks are saying they would like to buy the mobile home from us and live on the property with us once we rebuild.  That will be a good thing.  I won't have to worry about selling the mobile home and I will be able to keep a good eye on them and lend a hand when they need it. 

As for a time frame, I just need to clear the slab of debris and then I can start.  I'm hoping to get it in the dry by tax return if I can get the money together to do that.  Then the tax return will get me going on finishing it out. 

thanks
Austin
Building my own house in East TX

thecfarm

Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Magicman

Austin,  If we can work out a suitable time/schedule, I will come and saw your logs for you.  I am quite sure that we can get enough donations to cover my sawing/travel expenses.  No profit, no pay, just expenses.  My Son Marty would come with me and bring the camper, so we would have our own lodging arrangements.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

thecfarm

Magicman and family helping out,priceless.  ;D
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

dablack

WOW!  MM that would be a true blessing.  I'm sure we can figure something out.  Let me get the cut list together and then you can tell me how many trees I'm going to need.  All my trees are about the same age so I will go get some measurements to send to you along with the material list.  I just checked the map and you are "only" 350 miles from me.  We have power (30 amp RV plug and 15amp outdoor plug), water, and septic up at the top of the hill where the house was so you should be in pretty good shape up there.  Plus my wife makes some DanG good grits....

Let me get some info together and get back to you. 

many thanks
Austin
Building my own house in East TX

Brucer

It's been a slow year and money is tight, but  my business will be able to kick in something to offset MM's expenses.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

orion388

Quote from: Magicman on September 17, 2013, 08:33:44 PM
Austin,  If we can work out a suitable time/schedule, I will come and saw your logs for you.  I am quite sure that we can get enough donations to cover my sawing/travel expenses.  No profit, no pay, just expenses.  My Son Marty would come with me and bring the camper, so we would have our own lodging arrangements.

WOW... I'm moved! MM if this happens, I'm not rich but I would be love to send you a small donation to help on expenses. PM me when this happens and I will gladly cut you a check.

John
LT35HD, Kubota L4330, Stihl 361, 026, Massey Fersuson 55, Ventrac, Grasshopper, Small dumptruck and a huge yearning for knowledge from this forum.

wwsjr

Lynn,
Sounds like a plan. Watching for further development.

Retired US Army, Full Time Sawyer since 2001. 2013 LT40HD Super with 25HP 3 Phase, Command Control with Accuset2. ED26 WM Edger, Ford 3930 w/FEL, Prentice Log Loader. Stihl 311, 170 & Logrite Canthooks. WM Million BF Club Member.

pineywoods

I'm watching this thread with great interest. Have some ideas we can discuss while grilling chickin...
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

thecfarm

I can donate some green backs,I'm not a rich man,but can help out a little.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

WH_Conley

Last time I counted a bunch of little's made a lot.
Bill

thecfarm

pineywoods,AKA,Gumpy Old Men,would be a great help to ya Magicman. We should help him out too.   ;D  Nails,roofing is not cheap.

Gumpy Old Men thread,
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,43806.0.html
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Magicman

The new "Goodwill Roadtrip/Sawing" thread LINK will detail our efforts to assist our Forestry Forum member "dablack".   :)
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Chuck White

You're a good man Lynn!

A very generous offer to help!

I'm sure I can help you a little!

God bless you!
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

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