How to maximize figured wood from a log?

[RPowers]

Alright, I've searched the forums and the Google for this, but can't find anything of help. Maybe because it doesn't exist. If you can point me to a thread/site and save time, please do cause I don't want to clog the page...

I am wanting to know if there are methods for determining if a given log will yeild a desireable figure (Curly, Flame, Birdseye, etc) by looking at it, and if so how to position and mill the log to maximize this. Figure usually has to do with grain or ray abnormalities, right? So are there ways to make the most of it, as you can when QSing? Or is finding and getting figured wood something that just happens once in a while and you take what you get? Curious.

RP

[beenthere]

You didn't find it because it, for the most part, can't be done. Some log shapes such as crotch wood, or burl growth, or some unusual bark patterns are possible indicators.
Experience reading these logs may be your best chance of capturing the hidden figure, and then after opening the log some more indicators may pop up that lead you to your sawing decisions.
Knowing your woods will help, as some will yield more, or less, figure than other species.

[hackberry jake]

I know in oak curl is more likley in the first 6' of the tree. Thats all I got. My g-pa has a pecan tree with thousands of woodpecker holes in the bark. Im looking forward to the day that tree dies. I think it may have some nice figure.

[Magicman]

Some figure may be normal according to the species, but many times figure is caused by the tree doing it's normal thing trying to add growth over damaged areas, plus the growth rate of the tree.

I have sawn thousands of SYP trees, but I got into a couple of trees this week that revealed some unusual figure and will make beautiful wall paneling.  Nothing was obvious or different from other Pine logs that I have sawn. but they were knotty.  LINK

[drobertson]

I was thinking on the same order as what beenthere mentioned, in that some wood types will favor more figure than others, such as the maples, walnuts, ect,  I have noticed that as magicman mentioned around crotches and injured areas such as wind blown trees that have straightened back will often produce some unusual figure. It might be a case where If you are looking for only figured wood for a certain project you might need to consider sawing shorter sections of crooked or crotched or even burl sections.     david

[RPowers]

Thanks for the replies. I was expecting as much, but if anyone had particular ideas and experience I wanted to get it into my brain before I start opening logs on a regular basis. I just didn't want to through and through something that I shoulda known better on. Sounds like I get to play as I go and see what opens up.

[Ron Wenrich]

It depends on what sort of figure you're looking for and what you'll be using it for.  I turn pens from time to time, and I can find some really good figure in a very small area in just regular wood.  Sometimes that figure is the difference between heartwood and sapwood, like in cherry or walnut.  Sometime the figure is in a defect like I've found in sycamore.  Sometimes its in spalting.  For pen stock, its pretty easy to find.

But, if you're looking for something to panel your den, then it'll be a lot longer to wait on it.  I've seen some soft maple that I could recognize curl in it while in the log.  Thin barked species seem to be easier to spot curl.  We don't run in to too much hard maple.  We do get quite a bit of curl in black birch.  My experience has been that you might not find it through the entire log. 

If you're looking for the figure in ray fleck that you find in quartersawn sycamore or oak, that's a matter of how you saw it. 

[WDH]

With me, it has been mostly Serendipity. 

[Magicman]

Me too.   ;D

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

With me, it has been mostly Serendipity.

[WDH]

So, you must not have ever heard of the Three Princes of Serendip  ???.

[RPowers]

Yes I think I understand figure such as ray fleck in sycamore and oak, because that is a fairly consistent "normal" wood characteristic that you can specifically saw for, correct? The things I don't understand are the curly, flame-type patterns and birdseye, things like that. I didn't know if those could be seen from the outside of a given log and then sawn for to maximize their presence in the board face.

[giant splinter]

This link may help a little, seems like we just went through a portion of this and I thought it was Ron that led us to the link but I may be wrong.http://gowood.blogspot.com/2013/07/wood-science-101-10-where-does-lumber.html

[Seaman]

RP, most of the logs sawmillers choose to saw would indeed be hard to read for figure, as these fine fellows have already said. However, with us being in the slabbing business, rather than the lumber business, we have a different grading system. The logs we look for are UGLY, forked, lots of big old limbs ( compression wood ), holes from limbs falling off, softball sized knots, little teats that indicate birdseye, and so forth. Figuring out how to cut for max figure is to me a learning process. If you cut a crotch laying down, you get beautiful crotch wood with flame, cut it on its side, one fork in the air, and you usually see a lot more curl.
I tend to compare logs to people, some that are ugly on the outside are beautiful on the inside,
All that being said, often I don't find what I expected once I open one up and study the inside.
Hope this helps.
Frank

[qbilder]

I saw a lot of figured logs. I cut cookies off the end of the log & break them in half. You'll see right away if there's any figure. If it's good then I will take a cookie off the other end & check it. If it's also good then the log is a figured log entirely through. If it's only figured one end then it might be a gamble.

In the woods I search out figured trees (mostly maple) by studying the bark patterns. I won't go into exactly how or what I look for, but it's based on what Magicman mentioned about damage control as the tree grows. Damaged trees will have different bark patterns, especially in the area of the damage. Pay close attention to that, because altered bark patterns also exist in sick, diseased, and/or figured trees. The tricky part, once you figure out what to look for, is determining the cause of the altered bark before you fell the tree. Otherwise you'll be cutting a bunch of junk trees. My advice is to learn your hardwood trees, how long they live, what phases they go through in life. For instance, many hardwood trees have a smooth juvenile bark that later becomes furrowed as the tree matures. At what size range does this typically occur? Should that 12" red oak really have deep, coarse, black bark like that 3' red oak beside it, when all the other 12" red oaks have smooth gray bark? Pay attention to the details. I have gotten pretty darn good at finding figure but sometimes I still get stumped/fooled. I'll cut a tree that i'm certain is curly, only to find that it's no figure at all. Rarely is there a guarantee of figure, but you can get pretty consistent if you learn what to look for. Each species has it's own 'markers', the tell tale signs. Maple is easiest for me, but then again it's what I generally cut so i'm most interested in it.       

The type of figure will also determine the way you saw the lumber. Curly/flame/fiddleback figure generally shows on the edge grain, so quarter saw curly logs to expose the figure across the face of the board. Birdseye is different. They are knots, and like any knot they show best on the face of the grain. Plain saw birdseye logs to expose the eyes on the face of the board. If you quarter saw birdseye, it'll merely take on a look similar to that of curly because you will be seeing the edge of the knots and the distorted grain around them. Same thing with burls. If you wish to expose the swirly eye patterns in burls, plain saw them. Birdseye logs also show a sunburst pattern on the ends of the log, caused by the eyes shooting out from the core & growing as they approach the outer edge. Easy to spot in log form.

That's pretty much my take on it. Others may have different thoughts but this is what works for me. I will upload some pics that might help you see what i'm talking about. I cut a load of curly, birdseye, and burl maple over a 2 month span early this summer, and got a few pics.

   

[qbilder]

 Here's a fiddleback log with heavy figure. Notice it gives no noticeable signs of figure.


 

Here's the cut-off from the end of the log:


 

This log is birdseye, a little more obvious.


 

And here's the end grain showing the sunburst pattern. Sorry my chainsaw cut is rough but you can still see the sunburst rays if you look carefully. 


 

Here's a couple more cut-offs from another tree with a little bit lighter curly figure.


  

And here's a maple burl with the opening cut.


 

Pics aren't great but can give you an idea of what figured logs look like. The first pic of the curly log shows a log that looks like any other old, mature, flaky bark maple, except that this log is only 18"-20". The other trees in it's area that were of similar size, all had smoother bark, except for trees that had been seriously damaged but survived. This tree was straight, clean, defect free, and healthy. The birdseye log was much smaller, only 12"-15" and tapered very fast so it's a short log. It's bark more resembles an old oak, very uncharacteristic of hard maple. Almost every birdseye maple log I have seen also has this odd oak-like bark. I might add that the birdseye tree & the burl tree both came from the same hill knob, and nearly every maple on that knob has some type of defected or odd growth pattern.         

[Seaman]

Great thread!
qbilder, that was great, thanks. Too bad you are too far away to walk my woods with me!

[qbilder]

Thanks. I love figured logs I cut all those maples in S.E. Ohio.

[RPowers]

Thanks qbuilder! Those kinds of details are what I was looking for. Thanks for the pics, and the idea of checking a split cookie to see if there are obvious patterns before milling. I'll have to keep my eye out on our property for trees that seem to not fit the pattern of the others around them. I need to thin an selectively release some of the younger timber trees here, and pulling our something odd here and there might be a way to do that while gaining interesting lumber.

RP

[qbilder]

Glad I could help someone I hope it works out for you. It's not an exact science by any means, just an observation of details.

[Furu]

This link may help a little, seems like we just went through a portion of this and I thought it was Ron that led us to the link but I may be wrong.http://gowood.blogspot.com/2013/07/wood-science-101-10-where-does-lumber.html

My post just evaporated so will try again hopefully it will not double post.

I am new to the figure, curl, birdseye, etc and am trying to learn as much as I can.  This post and the pictures are really helpful.  Is there any place that one can go to find good pictures/examples with descriptions so you can learn what each one is.  Web site or book or whatever.  (Idiots guide to figure)

In the referenced video they have the quarter log longitudinally, end for end, rotated each time then laterally rotated 90 degree before each cut.    It seems to me that that the 90 degree lateral rotation is all that is needed.  Why the longitudinal end for end rotation?

Other than having the blade enter the clean side of the quarter log each time rather than clean side one time, the bark side next time if you do not swap ends;  what am I missing?

[beenthere]

Enter the clean side, likely the main reason. Longer blade life.

[losttheplot]

I got got a hold of some big leaf maple (Acer macrophyllum), The outside looked like it was covered in boils.

There was no sign of abnormality until I pulled some of the bark off.

The last picture is a good example of what Q builder said about quarter sawing.

I will know for next time  :(

I find the forestry forum hard to beat when it comes to finding good information 

[Ron Wenrich]

I believe they call that quilted maple.  I don't think we see that in our eastern maples.

[WDH]

Wow, that is beautiful.