Newbie logging question.

[Whopper Stopper]

Hello! I work in The Twin Cities as an arborist for a small private tree company. I have never done any logging however I am contemplating on expanding on an idea and am looking for some opinions from the forum pros.

I own a small parcel of land in WI. (80 acres). I have a variety of timber however seem to have more than my share of poplars. My idea is to clear my land of the trees, haul to a landing, cut to length and try to sell the wood to a pulp cutter. Most of the trees are in the 10"-25" category.

I work full time so this will be a slow process, which I am fine with. Neighbors have had  parcels logged off and frankly a tornado would do a nicer job. Just curious if you think my idea has any merit and definitely look forward to any input or opinions.

This is the first place I have shared my thoughts with so I am not even sure of the going price in my area for pulp, let alone demand. Thanks again for any replies!

            WS

[chevytaHOE5674]

Couple of things, have a market for the wood and a plan before you ever cut a tree don't just start cutting trees because they are big or because you think they are valuable. Have a management plan written for the stand and use it as your marking guide. Also in the warm months logs tend to mold and stain when sitting around so generally both sawmills and pulp mills want the wood fresh, this means you have to cut, skid, buck, and truck a load of logs in a relatively short amount of time.

[thecfarm]

Whopper Stopper,welcome to the forum. I would like to get you here and Maine and I would change your view of a tornado logger. ;D  Yes there are a few bad ones,but there are good ones too. One of my hobbies are walking through logging sites. Here in Maine pulp does not pay much,logs,is much more money.

[thenorthman]

There are good loggers ok loggers and bad loggers and foul lagers...

Your best bet is to hire a forester (gasp I said it really me...) they will give you a direction to manage it better, hire a better logger, and know where the markets are.

But if you do plan on cutting it all yourself, HAVE A BUYER FIRST... and line up a truck probably a self loader. and make sure you get a decent idea as to species, lengths, diameters, and grade the mill will buy, and what they are buying it for. 

One of my first loads of logs as a gypo went to a place that sells to metric markets, I assumed that everyone took multiples of 8-10'... lost about a third or more to the scale house on that one...

[ahlkey]

If you are cutting Aspen pulp you will typically do a clear-cut and while that doesn't look too good initially to the uninformed it the best way to go if you want to regenerate an Aspen stand.  If you are only cutting for pulp do not expect much return on your efforts as pulp prices are very low in northern Wisconsin.   I agree making sure you have your buyer all set before you cut is improtant but cutting in the winter does give you more time.  If you do have a decent amount of large Sawlogs that would help.   Best of luck to you and welcome to the forum.   

[Whopper Stopper]

Thanks very much for the warm Welcomes and the replies. I can tell I will have some research to do before I ever get to the cutting stage.

I contacted a Forester who works in my area. This is what he told me..........

The wood you have sounds pretty nice.  One of the obstacles that you may have is finding a logger who is willing to pick up your wood at your property and deliver it to a mill because the mills require so much certified wood.  If you cut it I am not sure that it can be counted as certified wood, it will depend on the individual market.  I have worked with many people who have the same plans as you do and eventually they contact a logger and have the work done.

He also offered to walk my woods with me so I may take him up on it and listen to his ideas.

The easiest way to lose your hind end is to get involved with something you know nothing about. "Grandpa Whopper Stopper".

Anyway thanks again for the replies and comments. All were much appreciated.

            WS

[clww]

Welcome to the Forestry Forum.

[thecfarm]

certified wood. Tell me what this means in your area?

[ancjr]

certified wood. Tell me what this means in your area?

A logging site near here has signs all along the road that state "CERTIFIED FOREST" yet there are no details of any certifying entity.   ???

[colincb183]

In Wisconsin wood is considered certified if it is harvested by a logger with SFI certifications or if the wood is cut from certified managed forest.  Its just to ensure the wood is harvested sustainably so they can put the SFI and FSC stickers on paper products and lumber

[NWP]

Certified=more $$$ for someone. Probably only the certifying person/agency.

[celliott]

Certified=more $$$ for someone. Probably only the certifying person/agency.

Not necessarily. I believe either International paper at Fort Ticonderoga or Finch Pruyn was giving $2-$3 per ton premium for loggers who were certified and harvesting certified wood. Also a premium per MBF, not sure how much. This is something I was told by one of my forestry professors.

[240b]

There was an exception in the sfi "rules" for landowners selling wood off there own land up to so many cords per year and for land clearing contractors, in the paper work I recieved years ago.. I remember getting a few extra bucks from rutland plywood years ago.  Never came close to covering the cost for all those classes.  They can just put the wood in someone elses name. Thats what happened to me, the trucker was using my sfi number to sell other peoples pulp.  If the mills hungry enough they will buy from who ever.

[Ron Scott]

Seek out the advice and services of a professional forester which you are now doing. There has also been much discussion in a number of previous threads on Forest Certification. Here is one:

https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,44747.msg643924.html#msg643924

[dGarnier]

I am in somewhat the same boat right now - I have a parcel up in northern WI there is a 4 acre section of popple that is set for a clear-cut of anything over 4"dbh.  I asked her for some advice and got a lot of good ideas.  The 2 parts I ran into problems with was getting a buyer lined up not too many wanted to hear that I was hand cutting.  So after quite a few calls I figured my best bet is to just get the wood out along the road stack and sorted as best I can.  This way they have something to look at and give offers on. I have 2 logging companies that will come and look at that wood when I am done.  The second problem is getting the wood out, I just have an old ford 650 without a loader and no 4x4 so it's a slow go getting the logs out.  I tried to pull the logs out tree length but that just was not going to happen so I cut them down to 104" and then try and pull 2 or 3 at a time.

Seems pulp wood is pretty low end and most places don't want to deal with anything small scale

[beenthere]

dG
Suggestion would be to put a carry-all on the Ford 650 to cross load the 104" wood, or buck them to 208" if dragging out end-wise.

Other possibility is to get an arch, like the Logrite arch, and pull out a bundle of 104". The arch will keep the wood cleaner than dragging one end.

Won't be fast, and will be hard work. But certainly possible.

[Corley5]

Do you ask about 104" wood?  That's long for pulp.  The throat on LP's mill in Newberry is 104".  Wood over 102" can get hung up and that shuts the whole process down.  My 100" hardwood pulp market has to be 100".  It goes on rail cars stacked end to end.  If it's much over a 100" it hangs over the ends of the car.  They'd rather have 98 or 99" wood.  They get really uptight if they get long wood.  You sure don't want to go back through your whole pile and cut 4" off every stick  ;)

[dGarnier]

the reason for 104 was the pulp mill will take tree lengh if I get it too them, and if I get some logs out of it the log mills want then at 104"

[Woodsavage]

Be aware that most Wisconsin mills buy by weight. If you leave your wood sit in a pile roadside you'll be losing weight and therefore money every day.