Blade advice for big pine logs

[barbender]

I'm sawing some large (24"+) red pine logs that are giving me a little trouble in the wide cuts. I'm using WM 7° 1 1/4" blades that I've sharpened once, basically I can cut 1 log before I need to change it out. What set up do you fellas use in the big pine? BTW, I rechecked my drive belt tension, it's in spec, the belt is new. I could almost swear I hear a bit of belt noise in the really wide cuts. I don't want to over tension and take out the crank on my engine, my mill calls for 1/2" of deflection at 18 lbs.

[Bandmill Bandit]

I am mostly cutting white pine and lodge pole pine in those sizes.

I am using the. 045 x 1.5" , 10 degree stelite blades sharpened on the CBN grinder and set to 30 to 32 thou.  I get 3000 + bf per sharpening.

I use 5 gal water and 6 (correction form 10oz. I thought the measure cup I used was a 5oz tide detergent cup but it is 3oz)  of organic solvent solution mix to keep the blade clean. Been working well for me so far.

[barbender]

I suspect the reason the 7° are working better than my 10° is that they have more set. I only have a sharpener right now, so obviously I'm losing set every time I sharpen.

[GDinMaine]

I find it interesting.  Just a month or so ago I cut 7 or 8 white pine logs all in the 24-30" range using 1 1/4"  7degree .55" woodmizer blades.  I don't know the amount of set - may be I should.  To my greatest surprise they worked very well.  I'm quite sure I cut most of them with one blade. 

What exactly is the problem you are experiencing?

[barbender]

Diving and rising in the cut. I think my blades have about .022 set, these are .045 blades. I ordered blades that should be here tomorrow, I had WM put me together a variety box ;D 1 1/4"x.055, 1 1/2"x.055, 1 1/2x.045, and a 1 1/2x.050, all 10°, 2 of each. Hopefully the 1 1/2" run ok on my standard guides. BTW, the stuff that gives me trouble is a bit nasty, with some 3" knots in it. Wide cuts, big knots is asking a lot out of a blade to cut perfect, but a few of.these were so bad I won't be able to charge for them >:(

[barbender]

 

[barbender]

I've cut 16-18" pine with good success with the WM 7° blades, I just hadn't got into any bigger ones. These are not new blades, any problem I'm having is likely my fault ;) I guess I'm looking for particulars from guys that cut big pine a lot- what blades, do you put extra set on them, any other tips for cutting big stuff.

[mesquite buckeye]

The bigger the log, the less forgiving. Tension, blade angle, sharpness, cutting speed, gunk, machine settings. All need to be good with the bigger logs or there will be problems.

[JustinW_NZ]

Sounds like a set type issue.

If u arnt 100% sure of the set your asking for trouble out of that stuff.
Is it more diving in cuts?
And are the bands losing tension?

Cheers
Justin

[Peter Drouin]

I your 1# pic you should turn the log before you cut all the way down. by not cutting off the 4# face and if theres sand it will dull the blade, the debarker will not reach the log to cleen it,
I use 1 1/4 55 7s but use a 30 set WM makes them with a 25 set

[bandmiller2]

Bender,did you try slowing the feed.?? I routinely cut up to 30" on my homebuilt and find the width of the cut not a problem if the set and sharpness are there.First cuts on a knotty log can be problematic seems to help if you slow the feed especially around big knots. Frank C.

[terrifictimbersllc]

There may be other answers for the difficult situations, but a practical one is using a new or newly sharpened blade to make the very wide cuts in breaking down a log. Then set it aside and put another back on for the narrower cuts.  I use 045 7 degree in pine or 045 4 degree in harder woods as my last resort for these wide cuts and the 7 degree as the best general all around blade including for knotty pine.  I have some blades set as high as 35 (usually by mishap with my setter) and these work good in pine.   I have concluded that for me,  skinny blades (repeately resharpened  so widths are down less than 0.94 inches or so, back to gullet), can't give wide flat cuts in any knotty wood. 

[drobertson]

Might consider a lil tweaking of the drive belt, it could be a boarder line situation on the belt tension.

[Magicman]

Another thing that I have not seen mentioned is that with larger logs with big knots, entering the log from the small end help to minimize knot wave. 

Blade guide alignment and drive belt tension are absolutes.

[barbender]

Thanks for the replies. Obviously, I am learning my way around these hogs- as Peter pointed out, I should have taken my #4 face off first. Three times I lost the top cant when turning, I can't remember any other mishaps, but I do remember thinking a few times "I hope no one is watching" :D The bands aren't losing tension, blade guides are recently aligned. On the belt tension, I don't want to overdo it, I've read horror stories of busted cranks from excessive tension. Maybe a few more pounds wouldn't hurt, it's set to WM spec right now. One thing I've noticed with the 7° more.than other blades is I get a pronounced washboard effect if I feed too slow. I'd rather have washboard than waves though. Hopefully my new blades get here early enough to try them on this stuff.

[Bandmill Bandit]

I will add that I went from consistent wavy lumber to only getting a wave or a dive when it is time for a new blade, by going up to 30-32 set. I did also install a new belt about a month ago and getting the belt tennsion right was a bit of a pain. But it running real good now. I set my new blades right out of the box before they even see the mill.

[OlJarhead]

I mill pine (Ponderosa) with my little LT10 with 10degree blades.  Biggest pine I've milled is 24"+ at the big end (had to slab it off a bit) and down to about 16" at the small end, 16 feet long.

Only time I had a blade dive (wavy cut) was when the blade was a bit dull AND the tension was off (loose) -- it would dive EVERY knot.

[Chuck White]

I use Wood-Mizer Double-Hard .045x1¼" 10°, and I'll routinely saw logs (mostly pine or hemlock) larger than 24 inches.

I set my blades at .025+/- .001!

I will slow down just a little when approaching a large knot, by just holding back on the control box.

[coastlogger]

IMO youre dead without a setter.I have a pretty deadly set checker setup using my now redundant single tooth setter as a "set check device". A WM 10* 042 band after a round of cutting has around 21* of set,maybe less if you run it a long time.After sharpening it will be even less which is hopeless IMO.You need to set to  25 or 30 thou then sharpen.

[terrifictimbersllc]

If you haven't, check the tension on your power feed belt, if it is slipping then feed rate could be changing during cut.

[barbender]

If you haven't, check the tension on your power feed belt, if it is slipping then feed rate could be changing during cut.

I will check that. I have a strong suspicion this is a set issue. I've ground my blades very lightly, and the 2 I checked were still showing. 025 of set. I'm thinking a setter is in order so I can push them out to .030 at least. The other suspicion is my drive belt, I may have to go beyond spec a bit, maybe 20 or 22 lbs. I might have to call WM and see what insight they have on belt tension on the mighty Lombardini.

[drobertson]

I will respond with one more comment, I (always) saw small on the entry,  just grew tired of the battle. Too many logs cut too close to length for risking the wave.  Big knots will bite, I don't care what saw one has. Speeds and Feeds, course this means feeds with a band mill.  david

[Peter Drouin]

I will respond with one more comment, I (always) saw small on the entry,  just grew tired of the battle. Too many logs cut too close to length for risking the wave.  Big knots will bite, I don't care what saw one has. Speeds and Feeds, course this means feeds with a band mill.  david

How long have you been sawing ?

[YellowHammer]

with larger logs with big knots, entering the log from the small end help to minimize knot wave

That is a great tip, and one I will start using.  :P
YH

[barbender]

with larger logs with big knots, entering the log from the small end help to minimize knot wave

That is a great tip, and one I will start using.  :P
YH

I try to always saw from the small end, but the dummy that put this pile up with a forwarder has them going both ways (me  :) I got my WM 10° 1 1/2 .045 blades this afternoon, I only got to saw one log but I was liking it. I could increase my feed speed quite a bit. I'll try again tomorrow.