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Sawing Walnut Crotches

Started by T Welsh, May 04, 2013, 04:19:41 PM

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T Welsh

I started sawing the crotches from the logs that I sold to my Walnut buyer today! We talked it over before sawing and decided to cut them into 1/4" slices and keep them in consecutive sequence. We decided to do this because of three factors,thinner slices will tend to check and crack while in the kiln and two with the newer technology of surface sanders it is possible to take these slices down to veneer thickness and three he has a buyer willing to pay for the experiment ;D

  This is how I started

  After trimming and sawing a flat level surface even with the crotch and getting it clamped

  I was able to actually start to saw,I had to wear my glasses to see the measurements and keep the tolerances dead on!

  

  Coming into the figure

  Start of heavy figure

  Ran into bird shot(wonder if he got the squirrel or not) 

  The end result, took me about 3 hours of trimming and sawing and brushing the sawdust from each slice and stacking. I told the buyer that this will be and experiment and I will be paid for my time and the crotches sawn or we end the experiment .Tim   

drobertson

Nice work TW,  I have been driving by a yard where walnut was taken, lots of limb wood, crothches. If some of the folks here on the forum saw these laying they might be inclined to whack me on the head for not stopping by,  I'm just in between macining and milling and not sure what to do, No where to store the product, and just left scratching my head, must be why I have a balding area ;D plenty of head scratching in my travels,  even meant to photo the pile, just seem to be running more than pleasure cruzing,   I reckon I will post a pic, and then hear the gruff, part of the deal I suppose,  david
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Peter Drouin

nice job on the crothch, I just got some butter nut to day with some crothch and nails :D :D :D ;)
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

francismilker

Good looking crotchwood.  Just curious, what's the reason for cutting so thin?  I know you mentioned veneer but those pieces are awful small in square footage to cover much.  I'm learning here.
"whatsoever thy hands finds to do; do it with thy might" Ecc. 9:10

WM LT-10supergo, MF-271 w/FEL, Honda 500 Foreman, Husq 550, Stihl 026, and lots of baling wire!

T Welsh

francismilker, Mileage ;) Crotch wood is used in various ways, usually in decorative uses. So we chose to get the most out of a crotch in cutting thin slices rather than cutting 4/4 or larger such as 8/4 and then after drying resawing into smaller slices. As I said this is a paid experiment, and this is the second crotch I cut this way! And my buyer is coming to pick up another truck load of grade lumber Monday morning and e-mailed me asking to cut another ;D. I told him right from the start,if it does not pay for my time and materials,I will not do it. I will find out Monday if it pays or not! Tim

thecfarm

I bet you will be doing more,if it comes out of the kiln in good shape. Sounds like you both are learning.  ;D
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

T Welsh

I talked to the buyer last night and the first crotch is in the kiln and down to 25%. They sandwiched the slices between cardboard and weighted the whole crotch down to minimize movement. He said the end purchaser is very happy with the results so far and wants to do another. As I said,this is an experiment and I will find out whether it will pay tomorrow morning. We are slicing these thin to eliminate resawing, I have no idea what the end user is doing with them, the buyer is keeping this to himself and not sharing this with me.

  Here is another picture of one of the best slices! Tim

thecfarm

It's almost like a trade secret with him. He don't want you to know what he is doing and how much money he is making. But as long as you are happy with the money you make,that is fine.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

outerbanxer

Lots of woodworkers would use them for inlay work especially with that thickness after sanding. Which is also why they want to keep them bookmarked.

T Welsh

Mostly I started this and the other thread about sawing the Walnut to the buyer is to educate myself and others with a very niche market. I saw mostly very high end Walnut,Cherry and Oaks. Its all about getting the most value out of your work and the logs I sell.When these trees come down I always keep the crotches on the logs in Walnut and Cherry,but not Oak,I have never had anyone want them!I see the value in the crotches but I have never had anyone other than serious woodworkers ask for them. As I said this is an experiment that I am trying out and told the buyer if it works for both of us, we can both make money. I need him to make a profit,if he doesn't I do not have a sale!I see a lot of threads about how much should I sell this slab,or log or for that matter anything we cut on our mills. I want to pass along as much knowledge as I can on how we can maximize our efforts and products that we cut ;) Tim 

MotorSeven

I have not tried this yet, but we have a lot of Walnut here..........another option for crotches is gunstock blanks and grips. It's a long process, but can pay in the end if you do it right. Blanks have to be air dried for almost a year, then kiln dried. The slab has to be oriented right when it is cut on the mill, or it is useless or stock blanks. I have some crotches in the yard now and will be using them as guinea pigs soon.
WoodMizer LT15 27' bed

T Welsh

MotorSeven, Added value to what the mills consider a defect and cut off! I am always willing to try something different, I have sold plenty of gun stock material in the past and your right air dried for a couple of years and then into the kiln down to 6%. I usually cut at 8/4 that gives them enough to play with in fact I just sold this piece for a butt stock. Tim

 

dboyt

I'd like any info and the benefit of experience of those who have managed to dry thin cut crotches successfully.  I cut some for dulcimer parts from walnut crotch wood, and they ended up shaped like potato chips!  Do you weight the pieces down?  Change the cardboard every day or two?  Thanks!
Norwood MX34 Pro portable sawmill, 8N Ford, Lewis Winch

T Welsh

dboyt, They will fry like bacon in a pan if not kiln dried right. Yes weighed down with cardboard between every slice. I will ask my buyer how they did it, The first crotch is probably done by now. He came and picked up 8/4 grade from me Monday. He did not have enough room for the 2nd crotch, so he will be coming back and I will ask him how they did with the first one, he told me it was down to 25% and they took a piece and where happy with the results, it was to be moved to another kiln for final drying over the weekend. So the next time I see him I will ask how it came out and all the details. I hope it works for them as I have about 5 more crotches that I would like to sell to them! Tim

MotorSeven

Jeff, I hope this is ok to post this link. If not I guess you will make it vanish ;) Anyway, it's a terrific tutorial &  shows in quite detail how to properly cut and orient a gunstock blank:

https://forestryforum.com **/f26/gunstock-blanks-walnut-crotches-31039/
WoodMizer LT15 27' bed

5quarter

Bump...

Hey Tim, have you seen the finished product yet? any other details regarding Their drying technique?

thanks.
What is this leisure time of which you speak?
Blue Harbor Refinishing

Seaman

Just found this thread, missed it the first time. I am assuming stickkers AND cardboard?
Frank
Lucas dedicated slabber
Woodmizer LT40HD
John Deere 5310 W/ FEL
Semper Fi

T Welsh

5quarter,No I have not seen the end product! And for that matter I have not seen the buyer or money owed for sawing it :o. He was a fast talker and I did what he needed and got payed for it. But this was picked up and he said I will see what I can sell it for and has never showed back! LIVE and LEARN. Seaman, From what I know they put it in the kiln and walked it down slow. They weighted it down with cinder blocks and cardboard in between slices! Tim

5quarter

Tim...that really bites. either their method didn't work so well or they couldn't sell them for what they wanted. I'd probably track him down simply on principle...I don't like getting stiffed.  >:( All the same, I'm going to try that drying method and see if I can get some larger thin stock to dry. I've used a similar method with good results but I'm thinking the cardboard between the layers will work even better.
What is this leisure time of which you speak?
Blue Harbor Refinishing

Seaman

Mulling it over, I guess that would work long as the weight did not crush the air channels in the cardboard. That should work for air drying also.
Lucas dedicated slabber
Woodmizer LT40HD
John Deere 5310 W/ FEL
Semper Fi

Solomon

Quote from: francismilker on May 04, 2013, 07:15:23 PM
Good looking crotchwood.  Just curious, what's the reason for cutting so thin?  I know you mentioned veneer but those pieces are awful small in square footage to cover much.  I'm learning here.
Looks to me like those slices will make some astoundingly beautiful drawer fronts or  table tops.   Perhaps a book matched set of end tables and coffee table.   I think the guy paying for the experiment is on to something good!
Time and Money,  If you have the one, you rarely have the other.

The Path to Salvation is narrow, and the path to damnnation is wide.

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