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Onto the next phase of my operation...

Started by Ruffneck, May 02, 2013, 05:44:23 PM

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Ruffneck

I have been working on a thinning project in South-Central Washington for a few months now. I discuss it in this thread: "A walk through of my forest land"

The other day I hired my neighbor to deck my logs... He charged me $75/hour. I had no idea how long it would take, it ended up taking five hours to get a majority of the logs decked. I didn't want to spend anymore money that day. Note: when he wants some logs milled, charge him $75/hour ;D



 

I ended up with a few different log decks. I just had to get them stacked so I can get my LT 35 manual WM to them. My thinking was it'll give me practice moving and setting up the mill. These are all Ponderosa Pine the smallest diameters being six inches on the small end.

  

  

  

  

  

 

I ended up cutting 8, 12 and some 16 footers. These logs were crooked as can be, so I tried to buck them best I could. I'm figuring if I can cut these into lumber, I should be able to mill anything.

I'm planning on milling 2x and 1x boards. On the 6 inch diameter logs maybe cut just two sides or try for some 4x4s.
My milling operation is in its' infancy. I figure I can use the boards to build a wood shop/saw shed. I will have to get these milled before the pine beetle emerge.

I am planning on storing the boards outside to dry. I will be covering the stickered stacks with tar paper to keep the direct sunlight off of them. I will try and keep them in the shade too. My concern is different than most I've read on this form. I don't have a  lot of moisture in my semi-arid region so I don't think mold is a huge concern. I'm more worried about the high temps and low humidity and the high winds that come through.
Should this be a concern?
I have end sealed the logs. On some fresh cut logs I had a problem sealing the ends with the sealer because of the sap flowing. Should I try and seal these ends later?

Any and all input is very much appreciated. I have a feeling I just need to go for it and learn as I go... I've attended the School of Hard Knox before :D

Stay Safe!!!
Ruffneck


Chuck White

That looks like quite the project!

Coming along nicely!

I think most of us either did or wanted to "practice" without anyone watching when we first got our mills!  :-\
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

Ruffneck

Thanks Chuck!
It's a good location to "practice" in.
People aren't going to be able to watch me, but I'm pretty sure they're going to be able to hear me at times :)

kderby

Looking good Ruffneck.  Classic ponderosa stand and thinning is a good thing.  You are asking good questions.

Paying the $75/hr was a good investment in neighbor relations.  Your work got done and he paid some bills.  He may not feel quite so stung next time he gets a big parts invoice.  Machinery is expensive and his time matters.

If the lumber is for personal use, do not fear the wane. The "mill two sides" idea I think is a good one.  Then they stack, dry and get used.  Plenty of utility in short lumber with a skiff of bark on one side.  You are building sheds and cabins not pianos!

No worry about the temperature, wind or dry.  If some turns to scrap, let it go to the fireplace. 

Pine is very forgiving and not high value (good utility but not high value).  I have milled some spectacular pine.  The lesson I have learned: you never see high end furniture made with pine.  Beautiful, practical, functional.  Pine as expensive lumber....not so much.

Carry on and enjoy the fruits of you labor!

Kderby


drobertson

Looks like a great start to the operation!  If I had only one suggestion, it would be to sort and save some of the straighter slab cuts, not sure if you have a draw knife, but by taking off the bark on these straight slabs you will have some fine fence boards for many uses,  there can be very decorative and useful around the place, strip and stack them just as you would the lumber,   david
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Magicman

Nice whack.  Don't concern yourself with end sealing Pine.  It will be OK.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Ruffneck


Thanks everyone!
Looks like you're just to the south of me kderby. It's all for personal use. If I come across some nice stuff, I'd like to try and make some Dutch Lap or pattern 105 siding for an old house I'm renovating. I have discussed my tools
I'm planning to do it with in this thread:
"I was able to purchase my Dad's shop tools..."
The big thing is to get these milled before the beetle start to emerge :-\

It was looking like the ends were starting to check a little. That must be what the trim allowance is for. I'll save my sealer for nicer logs ;D

How are the knots going to act? I've heard of stable and unstable knots. Something to do with knots from live limbs and dead limbs being different I believe.

Stay safe!

Steven



Magicman

I would not be too concerned about the knots.  I do see a few logs that probably will give you some grief because the piths are badly off center.  For example, fourth picture and the two logs in the lower right, and I also see a few more in other pictures.  They probably also have sweep.  There have been several recent threads discussing how to deal with them.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Ianab

QuoteHow are the knots going to act? I've heard of stable and unstable knots. Something to do with knots from live limbs and dead limbs being different I believe.

Correct.

If a limb is still growing then the woodgrain will "turn the corner" from the log to the branch, and they are physically joined. This is the "tight" knot that will stay in place.

When the branch dies, but doesn't fall off right away the trunk continues to grow outwards, but the branch is not growing. The wood grain now makes a detour around the embedded branch and they aren't physically connected any more. This is the "black" or loose knot, usually only held in place by a bit of bark. These tend to fall out.

Small tight knots? No real issue, the wood has most of it's structural strength, use that as normal.
Larger tight knots? They wont fall out, but the board is weakened by the knot. Still fine for cladding and non-structural uses.
Small loose knots? Likely to fall out, but most of the strength is still there. Not good for things like floor boards where you don't want knot holes.
Large loose knot? Make two shorter boards....  :D

Like Magicman says, don't worry too much about the knots at this stage, although it's worth keeping any eye on the grade as you are sawing. No use cutting rafters and floor joists from a log with large knots. Make fence or cladding boards from that. Saw the structural pieces from the better (smaller knots) logs.

Drying? You can't really dry pine too fast. It doesn't surface check under dry conditions like some hardwoods. It can be a problem in warm / humid areas (like here) where it dries too slow, giving fungus and bugs a chance to get started. But hot, dry, breezy conditions should be fine.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Ruffneck

Thank you Ianab!
It makes perfect sense the way you explained it. I see some stacks of short boards in my future :)
That mistletoe sure produces big knots.

I have been trying to get a grasp on sawing the sweep in those threads Magicman.  ;D I'll make the time to study them a bit more before I get to crazy with things :D

Will I be able to use stickers that are from the lumber I'm cutting? I would like to just stack the 4xs without stickers by stacking one level lengthwise and the next level stacked widthwise. Could that work?



Ianab

If the boards aren't for appearance use then you could use green stickers. You might get a bit of staining where the green sticker is sitting (that spot is slow to dry). But it wont affect the wood structurally. But if the wood is for an "appearance" use, like floor boards, that stain can go deep in the wood, and wont plane out. You end up with a "Tiger Stripe" floor.   >:(

Using 4" 'stickers' is a big patch of wood covered. It's almost certain to grow something before the wood gets dry. You might get issues too if the stack is as wide as it is long. Lack of airflow, slower frying, more fungus.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Ruffneck

Thanks Ianab!   
I'm not concerned about the 4x4s staining but I'll use dry
stickers on my 1xs and 2xs. If I'm stacking with live edges,
will it be ok to stack the varying widths in the same stack or
will that tend to diminish the air flow to much?

Steven :laugh:

Ianab

Quotewill it be ok to stack the varying widths in the same stack

No worries with making up layers with different width boards. Just use the same thickness. Live edge boards will just mean a gap inside the layer, this isn't a problem.

So you will be fine making up a layer with 2x4, 2x6, 2x8 etc.

If you mix thicknesses in the stack, just complete each layer with the same thickness.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Ruffneck

Well, there have been some challenges so far, but nothing I haven't been able to overcome. Was sawing along yesterday when the Simple Set gave me a Eo2 Magnet reading

 
Called WM and was able to remedy it within an hour. I was a little frustrated at first, but then I reminded myself there is way more to this than cutting lumber. It is a machine and to be successful I'm going to have to be somewhat of a millwright.
Not sure I'll be able to get all the log decks finished before the IPS beetles emerge in the next couple of weeks, but I'm hoping I can by the time the Mountain Pine beetle do ::)
If I don't, it's not from a lack of trying :)
The lumber I've cut so far looks pretty good from my greenhorn point of view. I like the color of the pine and it seems to be drying fast. Taking the bark off with the drawknife seems to take some getting use to. I just need to practice more I guess :D 

 
Starting to get warm!
Stay hydrated and safe my friends! 

clww

Many Stihl Saws-16"-60"
"Go Ask The Other Master Chief"
18-Wheeler Driver

Peter Drouin

A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

Sixacresand

Ruffneck,   Looks like you have everything under control and are having fun.  Thanks for the pictures and posts.
"Sometimes you can make more hay with less equipment if you just use your head."  Tom, Forestry Forum.  Tenth year with a LT40 Woodmizer,

Ruffneck

Thanks! I'm just about done with my first log deck. I've been trying to center the pith but it does sweep in some of these logs. Some of my 2x have just a bit of pith in spots, I'm just stacking it and hoping for the best. I have 17 days left to complete this, that's when my forester is going to inspect. It's going to be close :)
The EO2  magnet came on again, I wonder if the heat has something to do with it. It was only 80 today. I'm not 100 percent sure I'm adjusting it right. My understanding from the technician was to loosen the bolts holding the black mounting bracket. I could only get to three. Now there are two screws that hold the sensor and I'm wondering if this may be where adjustment should be made. Tightened the bolts back down and it worked great the rest of the day :)

Starting to get a stack of lumber 8)


 

thecfarm

The log piles are getting smaller and the lumber piles are getting bigger. You are heading in the right directions. I noticed you have some stickers sticking out.  :D  I finally got smart and have a small hand saw with me to saw my stickers to the length I need. Good luck with your time frame.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Magicman

You are looking good my friend.....well at least the lumber is.   :)
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Ruffneck

Thank you!  :) The lumber was looking good until I started attacking a log with some sweep in it. 

   :D :D :D We'll see how it dries.

I've been busy sawing 4x4s, trying to center the pith best I can. I have the end of a tape measure that's magnetized that seems to be helpful in doing that. I was really into a rhythm when I went and did something I was trying to be very careful in avoiding. I swear I checked it and it was clear. I saw it coming, but as soon as it registered and I was able to react, it was to late :-\ I just replaced the blade a half hour before too:

  
Live and learn I guess::)

WoodenHead

Those sneaky backstops!   :D

It looks like you handled the sweep in the log well.  If the log had been turned another 90 degrees your lumber would bend to one side or the other.  Dimensional lumber that curves to the right or left is much more difficult to work with (but not impossible when they are long).  I might not use this one as a stud though.  ;)  If you need exterior cladding I would suggest slicing the log into 1" material.  It is relatively easy to work with a bend like that when you are nailing it flat against the wall.

Remember to flip the cant often and place pieces like this on the bottom of the stack with lots of weight on top.

That's my two cents.   :)

BTW:  How do you like the SimpleSet?

thecfarm

You may live,but the learning part is in question.  :D I just did it about 2 weeks ago. Somehow I got thinking about something else and........... Another blade to hang on the chicken coop wall.   ::)  Another mill owner came to buy veggies,I showed him my mill. He saw the blades hanging outside and asked about them. I told him my wall of shame.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Magicman

It looks like you handled that log perfectly (just as WoodenHead described above).  Sticker it with the bow up and it should be OK.

Now that situation with the paint knocked off.....  :D  :D 
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

pineywoods

1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

Ruffneck

 

  



                                                          :)

Ruffneck


Ruffneck

 

 

The DNR cost-share program is complete. Forester Dan seemed to be impressed with my ops. 50 total days in the woods. Will end up making two-bits an hour. Complete report soon. I need to get a shave and haircut now :D

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