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I had a visit from a log broker today!

Started by T Welsh, April 18, 2013, 06:44:26 PM

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justallan1

I wear the safety glasses that come in both bifocal or the entire lense in whatever strength you need. They fit real snug to your face like fishing glasses. It's come to the point that it's a must for working under trucks and tractors anymore. I know Napa Auto carries them and possibly A.O. Safety.
Allan

Delawhere Jack

Quote from: justallan1 on April 20, 2013, 08:26:10 PM
I wear the safety glasses that come in both bifocal or the entire lense in whatever strength you need. They fit real snug to your face like fishing glasses. It's come to the point that it's a must for working under trucks and tractors anymore. I know Napa Auto carries them and possibly A.O. Safety.
Allan

Thanks, I'll look into them. Thursday I was on a job and got more sawdust in my eyes than ever, and the safety glasses kept fogging up something terrible.

Stephen1

Quote from: T Welsh on April 20, 2013, 07:08:17 PM
Quote from: POSTONLT40HD on April 20, 2013, 06:52:44 PM
Quote from: Peter Drouin on April 20, 2013, 06:24:13 PM
good for you , and yes we are all getting old :D :D :D

Speak for yourself.  surfer-smiley
David, If you recognize it you have already experienced the problem ! Getting old happens :D, Tim
Read the book "Younger next year"
we dont have to get old.
IDRY Vacum Kiln, LT40HDWide, BMS250 sharpener/setter 742b Bobcat, TCM forklift, Sthil 026,038, 461. 1952 TEA Fergusan Tractor

justallan1

Jack, for fogging use winter grade Rain-x, it works great.
Allan

T Welsh

I spent a day sawing noting but grade Walnut,turned 90 degrees after each cut, nothing other than 90% clear 8/4 grade lumber. We settled upon Doyle scaled from the log! Then I edged and obtained grade that the buyer wanted at the agreed price per bf. So far it has worked for me and him! The problem has arisen that what was scaled in the log does not meet the bf.  that the buyer expects, I told the buyer that he has agreed to the scale written on the logs and regardless of the yield it is what it is! Trimmed boards are a loss in bf. We are at a stand point, that I will not settle for anything less than the bf marked on each log sawn. He wants to pay for the total yield :o This does not compensate for my time sawing the grade lumber!! I will not willing to negotiation in his favor, we have been fair so far and it has worked for both of us, but this is what it takes to meet his requirements!Its his loss for cutting grade lumber Tim

beenthere

Tim
Sorry to hear of the disagreement.
This, to me, has been a somewhat strange deal from the getgo.
Edging off the sapwood will mess with even the bf Doyle scale.

Grade walnut includes sapwood, IMO. 

south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

T Welsh

beenthere, Strange indeed. But so far extremely profitable.
1. I have never encountered a log buyer having a mill saw the logs!
2. He told me from the onset that premium grade was needed
3 He wanted the 8/4 sawn to 2" and 3/16
4. He wanted to be there when I sawed the first set of logs, 3 of the best that scaled around 700bf.
He and I will meet this morning and I will flat out tell him,my understanding was for scaled logs not scaled lumber! Tim

Ron Wenrich

If the sapwood is to be milled off, then the logs should have been scaled inside the sapwood.  That's why you're having the scale problem.  The deal started off like everyone was talking the same talk, and ended up being apples and oranges. 

Does this guy have good credentials?  There are a lot of guys that can't live up to their moniker.  I've seen log buyers that don't know the basics of milling, lumber buyers and sellers that don't know the basics of lumber, and foresters that are nothing more than timber pimps. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

beenthere

Maybe better settle up where you are now (don't know how much is in the log brokers possession and paid for, or not).
Seems that there should have been two deals... 1) logs purchased (apples) and money in your pocket, 
2) his logs sawn by you (oranges) and he could have you saw his logs any way desired by him and paid when he takes his lumber.

Don't saw any more logs his way until the deal is clear and written down and signed. Hope you don't come out the loser here.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

mesquite buckeye

Quote from: Ron Wenrich on April 26, 2013, 07:44:52 AM
Does this guy have good credentials?  There are a lot of guys that can't live up to their moniker.  I've seen log buyers that don't know the basics of milling, lumber buyers and sellers that don't know the basics of lumber, and foresters that are nothing more than timber pimps.

OUCH!!!!  I'm so glad that none of us is one of THOSE guys. smiley_biggrin01
Manage 80 acre tree farm in central Missouri and Mesquite timber and about a gozillion saguaros in Arizona.

T Welsh

Quote from: Ron Wenrich on April 26, 2013, 07:44:52 AM
If the sapwood is to be milled off, then the logs should have been scaled inside the sapwood.  That's why you're having the scale problem.  The deal started off like everyone was talking the same talk, and ended up being apples and oranges. 

Does this guy have good credentials?  There are a lot of guys that can't live up to their moniker.  I've seen log buyers that don't know the basics of milling, lumber buyers and sellers that don't know the basics of lumber, and foresters that are nothing more than timber pimps. 
As Ron stated, it was my misunderstanding about grade Walnut, which has its own grading system. We talked it over and came to an understanding and both parties are now on the same page and I still have a smile on my face :D And another check in my hand.I had a lot of field grown Walnut from a clearing job for a horse pasture that has 1/3 sapwood in the logs,I was going to take a beating on these logs at the mill, but now I am still being able to recover a good sum for them! Tim

MotorSeven

Quote from: T Welsh on April 20, 2013, 08:59:36 AM
I have sat on these logs for over two years,knowing darn well what I have! I am a hoarder when it comes to Walnut and Cherry! I have enough to keep me in projects for the next ten years! This is the first time in 30 years of doing this that I was able to get paid for the real value of the logs vs. pennies on the dollar at the mills. The plus side of it too is that I am getting paid to process these logs ;). We talked and came to an understanding that unless both parties are happy the deal would not happen. The next process is to go through the Black Cherry pile and he will pick the ones he wants and we will do them up. I am just a happy camper that I found a source to double my returns on these logs. The log market has been horrible since the down turn of the economy and I have just been sitting on them! Tim

Tim, how did you keep them from splitting since I see no end sealer? I am cutting up walnut right now that has been down for less then a year and some of the logs are split 6' in from drying out. These were dropped off by my logger neighbor & we made a deal. I needed walnut for my log house build & he said take what you need & cut the rest at 4/4 for me.
WoodMizer LT15 27' bed

beenthere

Quotedown for less then a year and some of the logs are split 6' in from drying out
Do you have a pic of the 6 ft split in the walnut log? Seems pretty unusual for walnut to have stress like that.
Or by chance, are they large limbs?
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

drobertson

Glad you got to get the logs sold, cut and are moving them for sure, especially if you are satified with the arrangments, this log broker almost sounds like an oportunist,"middle man"  I had one arrangment similar a few years ago with oak timber,, found out the "log broker" was a lazy rascal wanting something for doing nothing, now there is something to be said about moving stock, and we pay for advertizing at times in different ways so maybe this is a good thing, my thought is that it might could be better without this middle man, maybe I should just keep me mouth shut, 
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

T Welsh

MotorSeven, I did nothing other than put them in a pile. I come in and out of logs so often,it does not pay to seal the ends, I,ll take the check loss! drobertson That is what brokers do! Look for opportunities to make money! This is why I started this thread is to teach every one including myself,on how the process works! I am getting paid for my efforts and the logs at the same time, I have been completely fair and know the market and I told the broker up front that if I feel slighted in any sort I will stop the process and we will talk :o And we have done this twice so far and come to terms that will both make us money! He is paying good money and I know it, but when it goes to far over on his side I called a halt to the cutting until we came to terms. This is the learning process ;D. He would not have a sale without my material and I would not have a sale without his outlet! I am still smiling ;D. Tim 

drobertson

thanks for the response Tim, I would've done the same thing, I have and will again, Its just hard to find the time to cut, market, sell, haul, and all that, a service is just that a service,  which we pay for when the timing is right,  I wish you continued good fortune Tim,  keep it up brother,  david
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

T Welsh

Dave, thats what this forum is all about(knowledge). This was a first for me,to have someone contact me and ask for logs has never happened. I know the current markets for logs and its not good in our area! I figured that I would let everybody know how this process went along. Because most of us are small operations that have good logs but not enough of them to score big! I scored fair by being able to sell the logs and to saw them too! I purposely did not mention any prices because it varies from region to region. Tim

drobertson

Yeaa, and you know that I really wanted to know!  My gig is so many folks seem to get by making cash without breaking a sweat,  I suppose it is part of the necessary evil we have to live with when in bussiness.   take care, and happy for you too.  david
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

mesquite buckeye

Marketing and knowledge of markets has a value, even if it isn't obvious to producers of goods. I have come to appreciate the value of marketing, after a huge accumulation of unsold inventory that cost a lot of money to produce.

It is important to value what all participants in a business environment bring to the table. It isn't just about sweat.
Manage 80 acre tree farm in central Missouri and Mesquite timber and about a gozillion saguaros in Arizona.

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